Speedometer fix - Is this too simple?

[Biker George]

Everyone knows that the speedometer is de-rated by some percentage (7% has been suggested). So, we do a mental reduction calculation to adjust to reality.

...and there are a number of postings regarding an electro-thingee to correct this - but then the odometer will be off.

So, it seems to me the simplest solution would be to locate a replacement indicator dial that would have the MPH numbers in the right place. Then, it would be a simple drop-in solution with no effect on the odometer.

My question is: Does anyone make such a thing? ...or is that too simple?

Regards to all,

-Geo

[Tiny]

The error is variable and non-linear.

[Pred8tor]

The error is variable and non-linear.

You mean variable between bikes? Do we know this for sure, or are some estimating their errors?

Non-linear wouldn't be such a hurdle to overcome. If all STs don't match up in indicated MPH then THAT would be a problem.

[bcst1300]

as long as the error can be plotted then a speedo face can be printed to match. I would buy that over the electronic gadget. If the electronic gadgets work across all st1300 then I am pretty sure the error must be pretty to the same for all st1300.

Great and simple idea as well as an oportunity to take that apart.

[JZH]

Or just R&R the speedo needle? (remove and replace)

Ciao,

[Scaredy Cat]

Or just R&R the speedo needle? (remove and replace)

Ciao,

JZH,
that would correct for a zero offset, but not a span offset. I believe the ST (as do most vehicles) has a positive span error, making it read a certain percentage high, although as stated it may not be linear, but it's not far off linear.

I reckon a re-etched dial would work pretty well, but I wouldn't pay to have one. I had to get an MPH dial made for a bike I imported, and I'm sure the company could make up whatever scale you wanted for a decent price if there were enough buyers.

Just a comment - when my Kawasaki's battery gave up while switching the key on, the needles stopped right where they were in the "exercise the dials thing" it does when starting, about half way round the scale. Pretty spooky, but it turns out they're operated by a stepper motor and are not "spring-return" like a normal dial. Thought I'd really broke it that time.

[illzoni]

The error is variable and non-linear.

Tiny,

Are you sure about that?

All the previous talk I've seen here and elsewhere indicates it IS linear.


BG,

I would agree that if you could get one to fit, replacing the speedo face would be the simpliest and very effective solution.

[Burger]

The error is non linear... meaning it is a percentage of the actual speed... let's say for sake of argument it's 10%... that means that at a real 30mph you're speedo is indicating 33mph, the needle needs to move 3mph backwards. At a real 70mph, the needle is indicating 77mph and needs to move 7mph backwards. Non linear might not be the correct scientific term, but it makes sense to me and I'm sure that's what Tiny meant.

Not sure how moving the needle backwards would work at standstill where I believe it rests against a stop by which I mean I'm not sure you could move it backwards so that it wouldn't start moving until a higher speed.

Regards,

[illzoni]

The error is non linear... meaning it is a percentage of the actual speed... let's say for sake of argument it's 10%... that means that at a real 30mph you're speedo is indicating 33mph, the needle needs to move 3mph backwards. At a real 70mph, the needle is indicating 77mph and needs to move 7mph backwards. Non linear might not be the correct scientific term, but it makes sense to me and I'm sure that's what Tiny meant.

Not sure how moving the needle backwards would work at standstill where I believe it rests against a stop by which I mean I'm not sure you could move it backwards so that it wouldn't start moving until a higher speed.

Regards,

I'm sure I'm guilty of using technically incorrect terms, so I'm not passing judgment, that's for sure.

What you describe is linear. If actual speed can be expressed by: actual = indicated +/- %, then it's linear. In that case, the speedo face swap is a great, low-tech solution. It just involves creating a speedo dial with larger gaps between the lines.

If we were riding sportbikes, I know there are sources for aftermarket speedo faces. Not so sure about STs.

[If you care, the term linear relates to how the equation is graphed.]

[Byron]

I've been meaning to try the R&R the needle but just haven't gotten around to it. Changing out the face of the dial would require the needle be removed and in doing so you run the risk of not putting it back on in the same exact place. Depending on where it went on you could be closer to actual or further away.

Change tires with a different dimension and you are off again. That is one of the reasons I bought the Speedo-Healer. It allows you to make adjustment to speedo any time you want and nother to take apart to do it.

I think I just talked myself out of moving the needle to make any correction :D.

[Biker George]

Well, in light of the foregoing - it seems to me that a replacement dial face would work. I realize that the spacing between numbers would not be equivalent, but at least they'd be accurate.

A good discussion...thanks for all your input.

Now the question is: Who would make such a thing?



Any ideas?

Regards,

-Geo

[Scaredy Cat]

Well, in light of the foregoing - it seems to me that a replacement dial face would work. I realize that the spacing between numbers would not be equivalent, but at least they'd be accurate.

A good discussion...thanks for all your input.

Now the question is: Who would make such a thing?



Any ideas?

Regards,

-Geo

I used this company when I imported a bike to the UK. Reasonably quick turnaround and I can't tell the replacement from an original dial.
http://www.redial-uk.co.uk/custom.html
I see they now have a template on their website where you can specify exactly what you want.

[B11RGER]

I don't need to rely on my speedo for accuracy. I can tell when I am doing the legal speed by looking in my mirror??????? :rolleyes:








Cos'there is usually some cager tail-gating me or trying to get past:eek: :D

[STArnie13]

One thing to consider about the speed is that different tires will throw things off some. You would think all tires the same size designation would be the same size but they aren't. You wouldn't want to replace the face plate with each tire change.:03biker:

[beatlejuice]

so what about the police bikes how do they calibrate them. or do they?
if we find the answer to that the solution might be easy :)

[saaz]

The police versions will have a calibrated speedo. I have a police spec ST11 that has a calibrated dial. It has a different face on it with 2kph graduations on it, and is fully accurate through the whole of its range. Normal face has 5kph I think. Any speedo should eb able to be calibrated properly, but it might cost.

[100MPG]

According to my GP, my speedo is accurate up to about 50, then somewhere around that speed, it reads 5mph fast, all the way up to 75-80. I found that very strange but checked it many times along more then a few miles with the same result. I will check it again and write it all down and post it here.

[RibsST1300]

Well, in light of the foregoing - it seems to me that a replacement dial face would work. I realize that the spacing between numbers would not be equivalent, but at least they'd be accurate.

A good discussion...thanks for all your input.

Now the question is: Who would make such a thing?



Any ideas?

Regards,

-Geo

Check a few Sport compact car forums-lots of them pull the gauges and redo the face plate. One thing to thik about is Night lighting-if it is backlit-through the current hashmarks, then you cannot overlay a new face-the backlight cutouts won't line up.....

[kevinfromwebb]

Too bad you can't buy a Police version speedo and/or guage set up for a reasonable price. I"m guessing that whatever drives the speedo would be the same just different guages???

Kevin

[Lloyd]

Save the aggravation......but an inexpensive GPS and mount it on the bike. It probalby the cheapest solution.

[JZH]

Too bad you can't buy a Police version speedo and/or guage set up for a reasonable price. I don't think this has (yet) been proven to be the case...

Ciao,

[PNWSTMan]

Like I told my friend who got a ticket the other day (who who has a broken speedo) for doing 80 in a 60, "speedo or not you still know your speedin when you are blowing by every body else" Cops really don't bother you if you are doing the same speed as everyone else. I rarely look at my speedo...

[trueblu]

A Bicycle computer/speedo will give you an accurate reading and I have read threads on this. magnet on the wheel so tire size etc does not affect it.

[ST Dan]

how about this http://www.blackrobotics.com/yb_home.htm

[ST_Jim]

I know my Metzeler's aren't off nearly as far as my OEM Bridgestones were. Per GPS. I don't have that extra 10% I used to rely on to keep me Highway Patrol safe. :eek:

- Jim :04biker:

[Shaftrider]

Wannabe looks good . I'd get a yellow box if I heard it installs well on the ST1100. -MGG

[rdfeatherstone]

Trublu, the tire size still matters. At least with the bike computer you mention, you can make an adjustment to correct for tire size, even adjust for the wear as the tire ages.

Shaftrider. I doubt the Yellow box would work on the ST1100 as it has a completely mechanical speedometer system. Gears on the front wheel drive a cable which in turn drives the gears in the speedo.

Ralph

[rdfeatherstone]

Trublu, the tire size still matters. At least with the bike computer you mention, you can make an adjustment to correct for tire size, even adjust for the wear as the tire ages.

Shaftrider. I doubt the Yellow box would work on the ST1100 as it has a completely mechanical speedometer system. Gears on the front wheel drive a cable which in turn drives the gears in the speedo.

Ralph

[Shayes]

The error is variable and non-linear.

Based on my GPS, my speedometer is 5 mph off through all speed ranges.

[Grump]

I use a device call Navalert, made in Winnipeg. Its very small and shows speed and where red light cameras are located.

[Sink]

I have the bicycle speedo on my 1100 and it works great!
I also did a speedo face replacement on a couple of shadows. Not too hard, just a crap shoot on getting the needle back in the right spot.

[rider58c]

Has anyone tried going to a 180 rear tire to eliminate what I see as about a 7% error in the speedo reading. on mine ( an 04 ) the odometer is fast as well

[Gonzo]

Odd that nobody mentioned that when you use a speedo healer or the yellow box, both can correct your speedo but at the expense of mis-calibrating your odo.
For this reason I chose to just go with OEM and mentally calculate.

[BikemanKZ]

Has anyone tried going to a 180 rear tire to eliminate what I see as about a 7% error in the speedo reading. on mine ( an 04 ) the odometer is fast as well

I currently have a 180/55 on the rear, the second time I've had to do it, and it makes virtually no difference by way of my GPS. The aspect ratio is so close to the OEM. BTW, the 180 is a Dunlop, I got 3600 miles out of the previous Dunlop. My normal Metzlers have been on backorder, but I may be ready to try the ME880 in a 180/55.
I was ready to try the yellow box, but I thought it also accomodated the odo too. My speedo is off about 7-8 %, and the odo is maybe 1.2-2% off.
Guess I'll keep making the mental adjustment when I look at the speedo.
KZ

[wjbertrand]

Has anyone tried going to a 180 rear tire to eliminate what I see as about a 7% error in the speedo reading. on mine ( an 04 ) the odometer is fast as well

That would actually make it slightly worse. Most commonly available 180mm tires have a 55% aspect ratio. To get the sidewall height:

180 x 0.55 = 99mm

The OEM sized 170mm tire has an aspect ratio of 60 so doing the same calculation gives you a sidewall height of 102mm, so it is actually taller than the 180.

A better idea might be to use the ST1100 sized rear tire which is only 160mm wide but has a 70% aspect ratio. This will give you a 112mm high sidewall, taking you in the right direction toward correcting the speedometer.

[curmudgeon]

Then again why go to all that trouble when a simple Sigma Bike computer will give you accurate readings and be much easier to see at a glance. Very cheap also. The digits are large and don't require interpreting between hash marks. Of course GPS is always another option. I use both with the bike computer used more then the GPS. My bike computer is set up to be every bit as accurate as the GPS. Also the odometer on the Sigma is giving me accuracy of better then 1/2% as tested on highway markers. I've been using the same Sigma BC800 for more then 7 years. I moved it from my ST1100 to my ST1300.

Cheapest of all just add 5 mph to what the speedometer reads. You'll be close enough for virtually all normal speeds.

[George]

I calculate in my head, and generally just delete 5 from whatever the speedo shows. Doesn't keep me from getting tickets, tho.

Last week an indicated 80 clocked at 72, according to the not-so-friendly NM HP.

[mitch96]

Hi,
I guess you could use a gps to "calibrate" your speedo. Let say 30,40,50, 60,70 and 80. Put little dots,slash marks or what ever to the true GPS speed near the indicted speed. Like a little dot to the right of what is indicated, to show true speed.
Yes? no? maybe?

mitch

[curmudgeon]

Hi,
I guess you could use a gps to "calibrate" your speedo. Let say 30,40,50, 60,70 and 80. Put little dots,slash marks or what ever to the true GPS speed near the indicted speed. Like a little dot to the right of what is indicated, to show true speed.
Yes? no? maybe?

mitch

I did something like that on my ST1100. I put a short piece of thin pin stripping tape, externally, next to where the actual speed should be on 50, 60, 70, and 80 mph. You get some parallax error though.

[Putt]

Bike computer, Sigma Sport.... Less than 30 bucks,
Accurate, (you can get it to 1/2% if you want),
2 more Odo's: total miles for the trip, and total miles.
Ride time. Clock. Top speed attained.
I have mine set to read 1% low..


Putt...

[BridgeMan]

George, I thought with your gift of gab you would have talked that trooper out of a ticket in a heart beat. You should have warmed up his demeanor a bit by offering to buy a round at the next doughnut stop, or at least asking if he prefers "red" or "green" on his burritos, as you'd buy either for him! OK, maybe that isn't such a good idea--I was pulled over in Alb. for speeding a few years ago on the bike by a team of City cops, working Tramway Blvd. on a 95-degree F. afternoon. When one of them suggested to the others it was time for a tall, cool one, my offer to buy a round of iced tea brought a few chuckles but still didn't get me out of a citation. Oh well. Maybe a new thread topic--"what's the best line you've used to talk yourself out of a ticket?"

[patiodadio]

Does anyone know why the speedo is off ? What is the actual problem...wrong gearing etc..? Its hard to believe a great company like Honda that makes such a great bike ...like the ST...can't make a accurate instrument. Is the Odometer off also ?

[wjbertrand]

Does anyone know why the speedo is off ? What is the actual problem...wrong gearing etc..? Its hard to believe a great company like Honda that makes such a great bike ...like the ST...can't make a accurate instrument. Is the Odometer off also ?

It's been discussed at length and my theory it that this is deliberate for two reasons:

1. No manufacturer wants to sit in a court room and have a plaintiff's lawyer present data that the vehicle was traveling faster than indicated by the speedometer after an accident.

2. A faster reading speedometer has marketing value. The vehicle will seem to perform better than it really does.

[patiodadio]

What about cars...why the difference. You would think it would be the same.

[bcst1300]

I just wanted to answer the question of this thread anew. Yes it is too simple to re print the speedo dial. It isn't gadgety or if you prefer Farkly enough. I used a bicycle computer and a gps but I,d really like to have a more accurate speedo. I like the idea of silk screening a new speedo face. I plotted a %7 error and it is within 1-2 km of gps and bike computer. These 2 speed devices are about the same too. In hilly terrain the gps and bike computer vary by 1 to 2 kph.

[RideTN]

http://www.jackphelps.com/vstrom/speedoface.htm