Stebel Nautilus air horn farkle

[wjbertrand]

LiSTers,

I found a neat, very compact, integrated, dual tone, not to mention loud
(139 db) air horn at Griot's Garage:

http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?&SKU=77839

and managed to farkel it into STat. I'd never seen this design before. After I'd already bought this unit I found out that Stebel makes an even more compact model seen here:

http://adventurersworkshop.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?screen=CTGY&Store_Code=AWI&Category_Code=Stebel_Air_Horns

(scroll down the page)

I had to trim the trumpets a little to affect a fit but it worked out. I
wanted to try something different than standard dual Fiamm set up again.
These horns have dissonant, penetrating shreek that I'm sure will wake up
any brain dead cager. A nice benefit of the integrated design is that
there is virtually no delay waiting for the compressor to spool up. I'm
quite pleased with the end result. I noticed BTW that wiring it with 12ga
wire and a relay allowed a much louder "hoot" than when I tested them by
connecting directly to the OEM horn leads. I stuck a couple of shots on my
webshots page if anyone is interested.

http://community.webshots.com/photo/268485706/329368664uUXDwU

http://community.webshots.com/photo/329368763/329368763sSTYbq

[number9]

Hmmm, looks nice. I really like the new style compact one. I may have to pickup one of these. Since you had an ST11 does it look to you that the one you have or the new style would mount in the stock horn locaion okay?

[nm6r]

I fit a set of traditional two trumpet air horns in the same location. The trumpets hang down to the OEM horn openings in the inner cowl. I still had enough room up in there for the vacuum canister for my electronic cruise control.

It gets the attention you would expect.

Ray
http://www.frontiernet.net/~st1300rider/smile04Bikerwheelie.gif

[number9]

I think I will order one of these for the ST tomorrow. If it works out good, I will buy one for the R6 too. :biker:

[wjbertrand]

Hmmm, looks nice. I really like the new style compact one. I may have to pickup one of these. Since you had an ST11 does it look to you that the one you have or the new style would mount in the stock horn locaion okay?

Things are a little tighter in the 1100, especially with ABS. The more compact design would probably fit with a little effort though.

[Rob Hephner]

If you go with anything other than the factory horn you need to add a relay to not blow a fuse.

I have this horn on my Honda Element and it will blow a 15-amp fuse if you hold it for more than a second.

It is easy to add a relay that will isolate power. Simply wire the relay and use a 20-amp fuse and you will never have a problem.

Either get someone who understands how to wire a relay to help you or take a look here http://www.classictruckshop.com/clubs/earlyburbs/projects/bosch/relay.htm

Basically you will wire the light green wire to the 85 terminal and a ground to the 86. Then run a wire from the battery with a 20-amp fuse inline to the 30 terminal. Then run a wire from the 87 terminal to the horn's positive terminal and a wire from the horn's negative terminal to ground.

Beep-Beep and no worries of being stranded without brake lights. :)

I need to double check the light green wire tomorrow versus the dark green wire on the horn, but if you use the wrong one, it just will not work.

The dark green should be a ground, and you actually should not use it as you will decrease the voltage that the horn will get due to its inability to carry more current.

Whew, everybody get that? LOL

[Rob Hephner]

BTW, I actually am going to go with a dual set of Hella horns that are available from Griot's due to the fact that a bike should be able to have a horn that can handle weather a little better. True, I doubt water will ever get on a horn where it is located, but the Hella horns will withstand repeated direct contact with water better.

Just an FYI.

[wjbertrand]

Wiring-up Instructions for Stebel Air Horns

Jeff, if you would, please let us know what you did (and didn't do) to get
these air horns to operate properly. In your answer, be specific about which
color of stock wires you did use, which one's you did not use, and if the stock
fuse (15 amps) was adequate.

In previous horn farkles, I've heard several ST1300 riders complain that their
FIAMM dual horns was causing them to blow-out their fuses when they're way
out there away from home. For this reason, I'd love to install a single/dual compact Stebel if I can be reasonably assured it's not going to blow fuses, or other unhappy electrical dysfunctions. Thanks for your time.

"Quality is remembered, long after price is forgotten" :bow1:

I used the stock horn connectors to power only the relay's coil. They will plug right onto the relay coil lugs. I don't think it matters which wire goes to which of the coil terminals on the relay. I then ran a 12Ga wire forward from the battery through a 15A fuse to the #87 switch terminal on the relay and then from the other #87 terminal to the "+" terminal of the horn itself. The horn is polarity sensitive but the relay is not. From the "-" terminal of the horn, I ran a wire directly to ground. So far, even with extended operation, the 15A fuse seems to be holding fine. If it blows, I'll replace it with a 20A one.

Since the stock fuse in the OEM horn circuit is now powering only the relay, and its draw is probably a lot less than the OEM horn, the standard 15A fuse will be fine here. The main power source to the horn however is a new, separately fused, circuit using much heavier wire (12GA) as described above. The light wires (18GA?) that power the stock beeper (and now the relay) are the limiting factor and should not be used to directly power the horn. I could see doing so would cause blown fuses and burned horn switch buttons.

I think the blown fuse stories are from folks trying to take the easy way out and skip the installation of the relay. Besides overloading the OEM circuit, the horns will not develop their full volume if powered that way.

[Rob Hephner]

Yes, you can use the horn wires to hook up to 85 and 86.

However you must use 87 to hook up to the horn and use 30 as the input. The other 87 (which is the center post) is a normally closed connection. If you hook up to 87 and 87a you will get nothing but a click.

You can reverse 30 and 87 but you must use the outside connections, not the inner post.

[wjbertrand]

Yes, you can use the horn wires to hook up to 85 and 86.

However you must use 87 to hook up to the horn and use 30 as the input. The other 87 (which is the center post) is a normally closed connection. If you hook up to 87 and 87a you will get nothing but a click.

You can reverse 30 and 87 but you must use the outside connections, not the inner post.

I guess I'm not remembering the numbers correctly but there were only four terminals on the enclosed relay. I've had similar relays with 5 terminals, two of which were #87s. If there is only a #30 and a single #87, does it matter which is connected to the horn and which is connected to 12V? Seems like nothing more than a simple switch connection in there.

[curmudgeon]

Jeff, do you think the compact horn would work just as good? :confused:

By the way thanks for passing along this great farkle. :bow1:


Phil

[wjbertrand]

Jeff, do you think the compact horn would work just as good? :confused:

By the way thanks for passing along this great farkle. :bow1:


Phil

If the specs can be believed Stebel, or at least that web site that sells them, claims the same 139db output, so based on that, yes.

[curmudgeon]

Just ordered the smaller horn. :D


Phil

[number9]

I called twice today trying to order the horn and only got their voice mail :(

[Rob Hephner]

I guess I'm not remembering the numbers correctly but there were only four terminals on the enclosed relay. I've had similar relays with 5 terminals, two of which were #87s. If there is only a #30 and a single #87, does it matter which is connected to the horn and which is connected to 12V? Seems like nothing more than a simple switch connection in there.


It does not matter if 30 or 87 goes to the horn or battery, just telling you the standard automotive configuration.

If it is a 4-terminal relay then you will not have a 87a terminal which is in the middle of a 5-terminal relay. :)

The reason for placing the power on the 30 side by the way is to place the least amount of load inline when the relay is in the off position, but honestly you will never probably cycle a horn relay enough to ever see failure do to 87 being used instead. (Long story it is really an automotive standards issue)

Yea, OK before anyone says it, I know a little too much about relays. LOL

[Rob Hephner]

S & D

Fret not, it is just a horn. :)

Not sure exactly how it will mount, I would bet down near where the factory one is now. Just take it out and use that as a starting point. There are no external moving parts, so if you wire tie it to the bar it will be just fine. Just make sure it is secure and will not fall off. You might even be able to bolt it in place.

The relay can tuck up a little higher behind the instrument cluster area, just wire tie it up there.

15-amp fuse and a relay and you should be able to blow the horn for about 5 minutes straight with the bike off before you run out of power. :)

You are not ever going to need to blow the horn long enough to cause an issue in normal use to need worry about blowing a fuse or hurting the electrical system.

[wjbertrand]

Rob, Jeff et. al.;

I ordered the smaller, compact Stebel horn and asked the sellers to include all the necessary hardware, short the 12 guage wire, etc.

Now, I would like to know about the actual mounting strut that this New compact will rest on. Will it be positioned behind the right dash grill, or do you think lower down in approximately the same position as the stocker?

Where ever it goes, did you need to make mods to the stock strut/pipe, or just cut some of it off (ugh!)? And, using a 20 amp fuse, is there a time limit in seconds that will eventually overload the relay, or charging system, causing something to blow or die? Details, like before, are the best. Of all my doggone farkles, this horn issue is really buggin' me the most. Electronics is as clear to me as Greek is. Anyhow, thanks again for your technical insights and detailed explainations gentlemen... :bow1:

With the more compact horn (same compressor I think but smaller trumpets) you should be able to get closer to the OEM placement, but it starts getting narrow down there. I had to mount the larger Nautilus horn up higher, mostly because of the trumpets. If you look at my photos attached to the first post in this thread you can see that I hose clamped and tie-wrapped my horn in place to the faring sub frame. Not elegant, but effective never the less. No permanent changes to the bike were made at all. The strut where the OEM horn was originally mounted now carries the relay for the new horn. You should have more mounting options with the smaller unit.

[jeff4912]

I used the stock horn connectors to power only the relay's coil. They will plug right onto the relay coil lugs.

Is the stock horn ground connector a heavy enough wire to carry the ground current for this horn from the relay, or will you lose some potential from the horn?
If not, if I attach a ground wire to the frame will that suffice vs running it back to the battery?

Thanks..:mcrider:

[newbornst1300]

Is the stock horn ground connector a heavy enough wire to carry the ground current for this horn from the relay, or will you lose some potential from the horn?
If not, if I attach a ground wire to the frame will that suffice vs running it back to the battery?

Thanks..:mcrider:
I ran a 14GA copper ground wire back to a frame lug on the right side.
Just make sure that any connectors used are compatible with aluminum and copper. This horn really gets cagers attention:D ..you'll love it
Chris

[jeff4912]

So on the 4 pole relay, you have the battery power coming into the 30/51 pole and going out to the Strebel horn on the 87 pole? Then, you have the oem horn + lead connecting to the relay at the 86 pole to trigger the relay? Then another ground connection comes off the 85 pole on the relay...right?

I'm confused about the ground.

1. Are all the 4 poles on the relay used?
2. Does the horn need its own ground as well as the relay?

According to the color schematic I was looking at in one of the farkle posts for the Strebel install, there are 2 ground points.:confused:

[friedsynapse]

http://www.st-owners.com/forums/images/smilies/eek.gif
This is a good project. Thanks for saving me so much time with the info that is compiled here.

[nurseBob]

So on the 4 pole relay, you have the battery power coming into the 30/51 pole and going out to the Strebel horn on the 87 pole? Then, you have the oem horn + lead connecting to the relay at the 86 pole to trigger the relay? Then another ground connection comes off the 85 pole on the relay...right?

I'm confused about the ground.

1. Are all the 4 poles on the relay used?
2. Does the horn need its own ground as well as the relay?

According to the color schematic I was looking at in one of the farkle posts for the Strebel install, there are 2 ground points.:confused:
I grounded both the horn and the relay. That seemed to work just fine.

Bob

[HankSTer]

I installed the compact stebel on my VFR. I was able to put it in place of the oem horn, pretty good fit too.

Hopefully I will get an ST soon and will install one in it also.

The wiring is pretty easy, even for non electrical people like me. Bascially, the two wires to the horn (pos and neg) should be heavy gauge and very solid connections (as mentioned, type of ground metal etc).

The pos to the relay (from battery) should also be heavy (I used 12ga), and the same for the pos from the relay to the horn (see above).

The only other wires are the ones used to 'trip' the relay, just use the oem horn wires here, they are fine as is.

This is a great mod, I'd recommend it to all ST owners. Hank