Decent Terminal Crimper

[stoc445]

Good Day my fellow Farkleteers! My quest is to find a decent wire terminal crimper and not drop a ton of money. I was wanting a ratchet type with a double nest. I know these can easily reach several hundred dollars, but I've also seen a few in the $40-$70 range. Kind of the low end of the better quality category. With this, I'm unsure on which one to buy. Youse guyz have anything that fits this criteria and works well? Some not so much?

Appreciate the time.

[NCrider]

Crimpers can be expensive, personally I don't like them and end up soldering over the crimp anyway.
When you crimp you are pinching the wire and weakening them.
I wish you could see how many repairs I do that are because of crimp connections.

My suggestion would be use solder and shrink wrap instead.
Cheaper and much better.

[jdpfms]

Good Day my fellow Farkleteers! My quest is to find a decent wire terminal crimper and not drop a ton of money. I was wanting a ratchet type with a double nest. I know these can easily reach several hundred dollars, but I've also seen a few in the $40-$70 range. Kind of the low end of the better quality category. With this, I'm unsure on which one to buy. Youse guyz have anything that fits this criteria and works well? Some not so much?

Appreciate the time.

I prefer posilock products much more now.

JDP

[dduelin]

Ancor makes a good double-crimp tool that is priced around $100 retail. You might find it cheaper on-line somewhere. I bought one about years ago for about $20.

Crimping vs. soldering is controversial. My background on the subject is mostly marine electrical and their professional standard is that crimping is better, I think mainly because soldering correctly is requires a skill level above crimping and crimping done correctly is as good as a soldered connection. It's easy to solder poorly. Many, many years ago I worked in a Texas Instrument factory making charge jacks for calculators - I guess my first real job after a paper route. My job was to solder 500 jacks a shift, or 1000 soldered joints. I can do both soldering and crimping but a good double action crimper is my choice, done of course with dielectric grease in the connection then covered with heat shrink.

[Gonzo]

In many of my little jobs I actually do both. First I crimp, then I solder it, too. Sure, it's over-kill, but it's only for my own stuff, not for somebody else. I started doing that when I was wiring up radios in trucks while I was in the Navy (ssshh! don't tell!) and the connections were more reliable and the noise floor improved dramaticly.

If you do this, though, be carefull the solder doesn't wick up the strands and make the wire stiff. Flexibility is still important.

gonzo

[wjbertrand]

One downside I've experienced with soldering is that it can make the wire really stiff next to the terminal bit. If there's much movement or flexing going on, the wire can fracture there, or slightly further down where the solder stops. The abrupt change in stiffness at that point seems to be a stress riser.

[nm6r]

In a dynamic environment such as motorcycle wiring, a properly crimped wire connection is much more suitable than a soldered wire connection. Look at all the oem motorcycle wiring. It's all crimped.

A properly soldered wire connection requires skill as previously mentioned which most do it yourselfers don't have. The properly soldered wire connection has yet another problem in the dynamic environment of a motorcycle. Solder is wicked up the wire (under the insulation) making it brittle and increasing the potential of breaking. Soldering a crimped connection defeats the built in strain relief of the connector itself due to the solder wicking up the wire.

Ray

[George]

When I started as a tech at the fore factory, all cross connects were soldered. Did many thousands over the course of 3 years. Advances for both speed and environment resulted in "push" connects, basically spring loaded terminals were the wire is pushed between. good connection, easily removed, immediately reusable. On the back side (factory wiring) all the wires are now "wrapped" with a speed gun. Multiple turns, no crimps or solder, on a post about an inch long. Again, good connection, lasts for years. BILLIONS of these wire wrap connections on fone equipment around the world.

Not all of these connections are indoors or in a controlled environment. Those green stunt boxes ya see sticking up in every neighborhood are not enclosed at the bottom.

Just saying.

[NCrider]

I get the point that solder on the wire makes it stiff, that's where shrink wrap comes in to reduce flex around that area.

But what you don't seem to understand that a crimp connector does the same thing.
You still go from a wire to a solid connector.

I build muli-thousand dollar drives. Our customer was having some complaints about crimp connections and we use some very expensive crimpers and connectors.
I started building the drives and crimping + soldering, no more complaints. As a matter of fact the customer brought up to me that they had had NO connection problems since I started building the drives.

When you go from a wire to any connector in any way/shape/form you are going to a flexable wire to a solid connector. This is where there is always a problem. This is one reason SHRINK WRAP is so important.

Believe me.....I do/have done repairs day in, day out for 20+ years.

IMHO


YMMV

[CZman]

Having crimped many a terminal, in all sizes, and having used many a tool, I have had the best use from a pair of Klein crimpers. They are very well made, but reasonably priced eletrician's tools, some of which are sold at Lowe's.

[DaBear]

In many of my little jobs I actually do both. First I crimp, then I solder it, too. Sure, it's over-kill, but it's only for my own stuff, not for somebody else. I started doing that when I was wiring up radios in trucks while I was in the Navy (ssshh! don't tell!) and the connections were more reliable and the noise floor improved dramaticly.

I agree with The Gonz; If it's for my own stuff, I do both. I've built telescopes for years, and precision and craftmanship's the name of the game. Also, I'd rather take the extra time in a warm, lighted, and dry shop that be cursing in a rainstorm at night on an unlighted roadside.

[John OoSTerhuis]

Hi Denny,

Put me in the crimp-only group. Have never had a failure-of/problem-with any of the many electrical farkles I've installed over the years. The cage and m/c OEMs haven't soldered their wiring connectors for years.

I always use uninsulated connectors and quality shrink-wrap. I bought my crimper from Radio Shack a number of years ago, ~$35 IIRC. It has multiple slots for crimping various wire sizes/connectors, and the larger sizes have the double curved die face on one side that creates the proper double roll on the connector for a very secure crimp. Damned if I can find the tool on the RS website right now, though. Sorry. Good luck with your search. A good crimping tool will be somewhat expensive but worth it in the long run. Personally, I'd never use the ubiquitous DIY insulated connectors and their (cheap) crimper on anything on my 91 SSMST. FWIW

John

[stoc445]

Gentlemen,
Great insight. I truly appreciate the knowledge shared on this forum. With the solder versus crimp debate, my experience is each has its merits. IMHO, a crimp for a relay, fuse block, etc. is fine assuming you take proper care securing the wire. Eliminate movement from vibration, etc and it will be fine.

I'm a firm believer that joining two wires together deserves a dab of solder to ensure a sound connection. Again, taking care to properly secure the wire in place. I know these Posi-Locks are getting good press, but an in-line solder with some heat shrink can't be beat for durability and overall tidiness. Easily fits in wire looms.

CZman, thanks for the tip on the Klein crimpers. I recently purchased their wire strippers and was impressed with the quality. I'll be marching me fluffy arse down to Lowes tonight!

Thanks

[Viggo]

I use a really cheap crimper. I think it cost me all of $6 or $7. It does have multiple slots for different sizes but no double curve die face. To get a good crimp, it's important that pressure is applied to the right place on the terminal, i.e. right on the split. I often, but not always, solder the connections as well. I've found that just a tiny bit of solder is really all you want; more is not better in this case.

[st1300r]

If you are going to solder make sure you are doing a good job.
Soldering and crimping is going to make the joint less reliable if you don't do it correctly. If the solder is wicking up under the wire insulation you aren't helping yourself.

+1 on making sure there is a good transition from the solid connection (whatever the type) to the flexible wire.

Also check you strands after stripping and make sure you haven't knicked the wires.

[John OoSTerhuis]

Here's what mine looks like, Denny:

27662

The die faces are stamped into the tool. Crimpers with removable/replaceable dies are much more expensive.

John

[MidLife]

Good Day my fellow Farkleteers! My quest is to find a decent wire terminal crimper and not drop a ton of money. I was wanting a ratchet type with a double nest. I know these can easily reach several hundred dollars, but I've also seen a few in the $40-$70 range. Kind of the low end of the better quality category. With this, I'm unsure on which one to buy. Youse guyz have anything that fits this criteria and works well? Some not so much?

Appreciate the time.

Beside those who have already replied, Jim Davis (Eastern Beaver Co) is another member who knows a lot on the subject.

You can buy harnesses directly from him or if you go the DIY route, check Jim's tips at:

http://easternbeaver.com/Main/Faqs/DIY_Page/diy_page.html

[NCrider]

Wow, this is a bad as an oil thread.

The guys that trained me had military training.

Motto was: "If you crimp, solder to make sure."

[st1300r]

Wow, this is a bad as an oil thread.
The guys that trained me had military training.
Motto was: "If you crimp, solder to make sure."

I thought the motto was "Can't see it from my boat" :)
The requirements of say Weapon Spec 6536 are a little like making sausage, you don't really won't to know what went in to them. LOL.

There are many crimps used in military equipment. An Aegis Weapon System forex has a hundreds of crimps in a single cable and their are many cables connecting the various cabinets and arrays. Suffed into backshells and very well supported I should add.

[dduelin]

Somewhere up the line here someone made a subtle but important point. The insulation on the crimp terminal makes a difference. Often the DIY kits in hardware or auto parts stores have terminal fittings that have PVC insulation. The PVC used is brittle and the single-action hand crimpers can and often puncture the PVC when the "squeeze" comes on.

I like to use Ancor tin plated brass terminal fittings found in marine supply stores. Ancor also uses a type of vinyl insulator that does not hole or puncture when using their crimper. The crimp is made across a wider area at a controlled pressure from a racheting mechanism built into the tool. The crimp pressure is not dependent on the strength of your hand. Klein crimpers probably have the same type of pressure to avoid damaging the insulator.

Ancor also sells a line of fittings with heat shrink insulator instead of the standard vinyl. Crimp and heat to seal.

[st1300r]

There are 2 kinds of crimp die. One shaped for insulated terminals sort of shaped like this () and one shaped for non insulated terminal sort of shaped like this >] . Ratcheting mechinism is meant to ensure there is no under crimp.
It won't open until the tool is fully cycled. They usually have an escape mechanism in the event the crimp is in the wrong die and can't be fully cycled.

A couple of things could damage the insulator. The wrong crimp die shape, the wrong size die. The shrink tube idea provides some mechanical transition from the crimped wires to the wire insulation. The end game is to have more than just the wire strands involved in the mechanical connection.

This sort of is like an oil thread. :)

[stoc445]

I wired up an Aux fuse block on a friends VFR yesterday. I tried the crimp with the insulator in place and with the insulator removed. The crimps were much tighter with the insulator removed. Also, I could use different colored heat shrink just to mess with my anal retentive friend!.

[the_gr8t_waldo]

klien, greenlee, and G&B make hand tools that come in around 40 or so. imho few home hobbists can justify buying a d.action crimper. the cheaper hand crimpers do take a bit more hand pressusre. i do some as part of my work, and have enjoyed getting by with the cheap ones.

[uptoblackwood]

+1 on posilock...
I try to use solder on any critical connection...that doesn't flex...and posilock everywhere else.

Forest

[MileHigh]

Having crimped many a terminal, in all sizes, and having used many a tool, I have had the best use from a pair of Klein crimpers. They are very well made, but reasonably priced eletrician's tools, some of which are sold at Lowe's.

+1 on Klein

http://www.kleintools.com/

And use the Correct Klein crimpers with crimp and seal terminal ends.

http://www.imperialinc.com/grp101.shtml

After you crimp, use a bic lighter or mini torch to heat the insulator untill the sealing glue melts and oozes out for a water proof seal.

[Jim Davis]

Well it seems we got a lot of expert crimpers here, but I'll throw in my two cents worth anyway.

For a decent open barrel crimper, the Palladin is decent. Their dies sets are decent too. About $60.

However, for a real crimper, you need a Pressmaster, about $350.

One more thing - every make, size, and type of open barrel terminal is different, requires a different crimper and different technique. Crimping even with a good crimper is an art. I own 8 different crimpers.

As to the transition from the wire crimp to the wire, that is where the flare comes in. That is what the insulation crimp is for. That is why you cover the crimp with shrinktube.

I should also mention that I sell open barrel terminals. They're not easy to find and I have a good selection online. As well I'll be happy to suggest what crimper works with what terminals.

Please don't PM me, send me an E-Mail if you want help.