ST1300 vs. FJR1300

[ChrisW123]

I know, this is probably a worn out topic but I couldn't find anthing previous with the details I'm looking for.

I'm looking to buy a sport/tourer bike and can't decide between the ST and FJR. For last year '05 I heard good things about both bikes. So I've been waiting for the new ST1300's for '06 to come out and today I found it on the Honda website! But I'm a little disappionted that there are no improvements and just one color.

The thing about the FJR is they are never in the showrooms so I can't look at them, sit on them, much less ride one! Has anyone here ridden both bikes, say the '05s before you choose the ST? What did you like and dislike about both bikes? Assume there is no "heat issue" with either since appartently Yamaha has fixed that.

Any feedback would be appreciated!

Thanks.

[kingprawnokay]

There's a ton of opinion and information on this site under "motorcycle reviews". I hope you enjoy the sometimes "heated" debate.

www.st-owners.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=160

[Tim4255]

How long would the I4 in the Yamaha last compared to the V4 in the Honda?

Tim :03biker:

[sherob]

Depends on if you get a FJR that develops the reported "tick" or not ;)

[ChrisW123]

Thanks for the replies! I didn't know about the "Reviews" section, thanks! I'll look around there a little. Thanks for the other good points everyone.

[CaST]

Sitting on both bikes the ST is more of a touring setup than the FJR. The FJR is more sport setup than the ST. I think the technology of the Honda is better than the FJR. Inline 4 versus V4 and linked brakes. If you like a more bent over ride, get the FJR with a few more horsepower, if you like a more upright ride, and don't care about having a few less horsepower get the ST.

You also have to prepay to get an FJR and probably won't be able to get a test ride on one while you probably will be able to get a test ride on an ST.

[Kempo-STer]

Thanks for the replies! I didn't know about the "Reviews" section, thanks! I'll look around there a little. Thanks for the other good points everyone.


Don't forget Chris to put where you are from....members on this board often go above and beyond in the name of helping one another out..

I last winter (Jan 05) did the FJR, RT, ST dance like so many others...I am not being biased here (maybe a little) that all the 'improvements' that the ST needs are kind of subjective...(Example, risers if you need them, change stock seat if you don't like it..etc..) The changes made in the FJR really in my opinion are a nod by the FJR designers because they move the FJR CLOSER to what the ST already is than visa versa....This is an incredible compliment to the ST...You should not be dissappointed in no changes to the ST13..I don't think there will be many (remember the ST11 was around for a long time without major redesign)

The things that you will change on the ST13 will serve to truely make it your own....
Good luck either way brother!

[rosast1300]

THe st is the porkier of the two, although probably for good reason if you're into touring. I had the same problem before getting mine. Nobody had FJRs and they want you to preorder. Haven't ridden the FJR, although its probably better suited for someone that wants something closer to a VFR rather than a touring bike. Touring is subjective as to what an individual wants from his bike than how far you can go in comfort. I probably would've been happy with anything, even an FJR because I came from a cruiser. However, the ST from my own opinionion is really a refined bike with very little character and in summary the heaviest of all the current sport-tourers. I don't like the FJR's styling and it does look chintsy when you look at it. The NY show had one and it looks weird and just low budget compared to other brands. I can't imagine what type of character it may have in terms of handling or vibration because I've never ridden one, but their engine is know for problems.
I must admit after sitting on several bikes at the NY cycle show, the ST does have a favorite slipper feeling to it as soon as you hop on it. The infamous BMW rt has an almost opposite seating position as our bike and it did feel unnatural. Their GS bike had a comfortable seat bar relationship that was nice. I'm rambling now, go check out the FJR forum and try to get a ride or sit on and decide for yourself.

[ChrisW123]

Kempo,

Good point that all the changes to FJR and none to the ST probably mean Yami is trying to "catch up" to the ST in some areas.

STonoma,

I'm leaning towards the ST instead of FJR because I don't want to be leaning forward at all and want more "tourer" then "sport". I went to the Yami dealer today thinking they may have an FJR on the floor (kidding myself really :) and of course they didn't. So I talked to the salesman for a while. I asked why Yami doesn't give them bikes to display on the floor! It's kinda pompus in a way to expect buyers to purchase a $15000 bike without even being able to at least sit on it first. :) Then wait until May for delivery. I also went to Honda and they said that they should have STs on the floor next Friday.

I think the ST is for me. I read a lot of threads over in "Reviews" and from what I've read I'm leaning toward the ST. I just hate that funny looking triangle exhaust pipe. :) I suppose it may grow on you after a while, who knows.

-Chris.

[Bud5075]

I have an '05 ST but have ridden the FJR a little, (no cross country's). A friend let me tool around on his FJR. I believe the FJR is a little lighter so the handling also has a lighter feel to it. The fairings seem to be smaller so there is more wind on the arms and legs and feet. The bike is ffffaaaassssttt. I opened it up and that bike snapped to attention. The bags seem to not be attached to the frame as well as the ST so they bob around a little. I could see that when I rode next to him. The rear view mirrors are in a little bit better position than the ST, at least for me. Overall, I really enjoyed the FJR...but I enjoy my ST more. ST feels more rooted to the pavement, the powerband seems smoother and I really like the extra coverage, especially riding in the northwest. The ST just feels substantial and a bit more solid. No bad things to say about the FJR, at about 2K$ less its a good deal. Why didn't Honda put self canceling signals on the ST?
Ride safe

[Kempo-STer]

Yes the triangle pipes and the..ahem..shall we say...'exhaust note' are very diSTinctive..


But stare at the back of the ST from about 15 feet away (try not to look too long at the tail lite;), you'll see that the triangle is designed to give more lean angle. Picture the bike on a good hard lean and you'll see the function of why the pipes are shaped this way...

[kingprawnokay]

Chris,

You should definitely try to test ride both bikes. There are quite a few "preowned" FJR's out there that can be demo'd. That's how I was able to test the Yammie.

I think most people have a very strong liking or disliking for either bike after testing them back-to-back. I believe it will take you less than 2 seconds to decide after you ride...but I've been wrong before.

[ChrisW123]

King,

I think I'm going for the ST. I'm almost positive it's the right bike for me. I'll have a chance to ride on my way home from the dealership. :)

I'm wondering if you guys prefer ABS or non-ABS? Besides the extra costs, what are the benefits and drawbacks? It appears from forum posts that the ST brakes (linked?) are already superior to FJR to begin with?

Also the Yamadog guy was telling me that the STs are $2000 more but the suggested retail price for the ST according to Honda is only $500 more. Do dealers generally raise the price higher then the suggested retail price for the ST? I'm going to shop around a little but thought I'd ask anyway. :)

Thanks, -Chris.

[Medicine Bear]

Chris, if you search the forum for ABS vs non-ABS you'll find a partisan crowd in both camps. It comes down to what works best for you.

As for MSRP, there seem to be many places discounting the ST. Having said that, there are probably just as many that are not backing off suggested retail. Others will probably log in with their favorite dealers/prices.

Good luck,

Fred :03biker:

[joeseedoo]

I have an FJR 2005 model. I love the bike, Also love the ST1300. Both are great bikes. And I totally agree with this statement. Good review.


I have an '05 ST but have ridden the FJR a little, (no cross country's). A friend let me tool around on his FJR. I believe the FJR is a little lighter so the handling also has a lighter feel to it. The fairings seem to be smaller so there is more wind on the arms and legs and feet. The bike is ffffaaaassssttt. I opened it up and that bike snapped to attention. The bags seem to not be attached to the frame as well as the ST so they bob around a little. I could see that when I rode next to him. The rear view mirrors are in a little bit better position than the ST, at least for me. Overall, I really enjoyed the FJR...but I enjoy my ST more. ST feels more rooted to the pavement, the powerband seems smoother and I really like the extra coverage, especially riding in the northwest. The ST just feels substantial and a bit more solid. No bad things to say about the FJR, at about 2K$ less its a good deal. Why didn't Honda put self canceling signals on the ST?
Ride safe

[Towjam]

Also the Yamadog guy was telling me that the STs are $2000 more but the suggested retail price for the ST according to Honda is only $500 more. Do dealers generally raise the price higher then the suggested retail price for the ST? I'm going to shop around a little but thought I'd ask anyway. Prior to buying my ST, I called around and visited a couple of local dealers. In all, I talked to 5 different dealers. Although I didn't press for a "firm" OTD price since I already knew where I was going to purchase from, all 5 dealers initially quoted me MSRP and all 5 indicated that when I was ready to buy, they would deal. I've never inquired about an FJR but given that people are putting deposits down sight unseen, I would think there would be less motivation for a Yammi dealer to deal.

Regardless of what you decide to buy, good luck and enjoy the ride!

[STWannaBe]

I had a chance last year to ride the an 05' ST back to back with an 04' FJR, 04' K1200GT, an 02' K1200RS, and a Goldwing. I have many thoughts about each bike and I think all are superior machines. What really struck me about the FJR was the sheer power. Man that bike will move and because of its weight, I personally think it out handles the ST. Everytime I hit the gas in first gear, the front wheel came off the ground. It felt like anything over 5000 rpms, I was on a sportbike, anything under, I was on a touring bike. This bike had Helibars, a larger windshield, and a Corbin which made it very comfortable and I could see myself eating up the miles on this ride. It was a nice bike.

With that said, I ended up with a 05' ST. I just liked the solid smooth power of the ST and how easy it was to ride. You just can't go wrong with the V-4. Mine was a Non-ABS and it out braked everything I had ever ridden. I truly thought it was the best machine I had ever ridden, still do.

[sokay]

Nothing scientific here but it seems to me that one is paying about $1,000 for the Honda "quality." Now it may be that a buyer does not recognize or believe that Honda has somehow built into the bike a quality of materials, engineering and workmanship that would justify a $1,000 premium. On the other hand, one might believe just that. IMHO one of the peculiar characteristics of magazine reviews of bikes is the short term, or "immediate term" judgement pov. In this way, Suzuki's and Kawasaki's are often graded higher than Honda's. So I think that one is pretty much on his own when he evaluates his new bike options. Unless the buyer conciously considers that he is buying a disposable commodity, then he really needs to look at these objects, just as he would new clothing, a household appliance or whatever, and try to see what it is made of and how it is made. So I do not believe that buying an FJR sight unseen is a good idea and the best thing is to see one next to an ST and to try, somehow, to recognize what one is looking at.

[nm6r]

Depends on if you get a FJR that develops the reported "tick" or not ;)

The FJR has had catastrophic failures without the tick of doom. I have a friend that didn't ride his for a couple weeks. It wouldn't start. Turns out it was the "valve problem".

Ray
http://www.frontiernet.net/~st1300rider/smile04Bikerwheelie.gif

[waltb]

I've ridden the FJR and it rides more like a sport bike -- has a more forward, aggressive riding position. I would not be comfortable on it for a long ride.

Walt

[Bones]

Both the ST and the FJR were nearly unobtainium in the summer of 2002 when I was ready to buy a bike. Having owned all manner of Hondas (bikes, cars, power equipment) I was 90% sure it would be an ST, and when I was asked to fork over a non-refundable $500 deposit just to get on the FJR waiting list I made my decision.

When I finally was able to see an FJR in person in a dealership the next spring, there were a few things that made me glad I went with the ST:

There were no fairing pockets on the FJR. That has been addressed since, but with only one small pocket that you can't unlock unless the key is in the ignition and the bike is in neutral. (Too many lawyers, I tell you...)
If a windshield is going to move, it should have a large enough range of motion to accommodate most any preferred setting. The FJR has gotten a bigger stock shield than it had when introduced, but the ST beats it for range of motion. Overall wind coverage is better on the ST, too, which helps in New England.
I can't get my feet comfortably on the ground on the FJR.The only area where the FJR had an advantage was horsepower. Power is good, but at some point you find diminishing marginal returns (hey, an application of Economics 101!). Any advantage the FJR has in that department was of no value to me.

ST for me.
:03biker:

[ChrisW123]

Both the ST and the FJR were nearly unobtainium in the summer of 2002 when I was ready to buy a bike. Having owned all manner of Hondas (bikes, cars, power equipment) I was 90% sure it would be an ST, and when I was asked to fork over a non-refundable $500 deposit just to get on the FJR waiting list I made my decision.

I know it's maddening that Yami doesn't give dealers a few FJRs for the show room. The same basic thing happened to me last summer.... I was shopping for either an ST or FJR. I had seen the ST because there were two of them left in the showroom. But I also wanted to see the FJR because in my mind, at that time, I was leaning toward the FJR. But I couldn't look at the FJR. If Yami would have had an FJR on the floor I would have bought it probably on the spot because back then I believed it was the better bike. So Yami probably lost a sale because of the practice.

I'm sure this happens a lot were they lose these kinds of sales. A good part of sales, even high end sales like buying a bike, come from spontanious buyers like me! I'm sure they have a reason for taking this approach, probably something along the lines of, "if you preceive the bike as being difficult to attain (a waiting list) then it must be the better bike so people will go out of their way to get it...", or something like that. But it doesn't work for me that way. I'm most likely NEVER going to buy a product this expensive without being about to at least sit on the thing first!

-Chris.

[tccox]

Hmmm, My dealer still has a brand new 05 FJR on his showroom thats been sitting there since last July unloved and unsold.


When I bought my St I was also VERY interested in the FJR and honestly if it had also been avaliable thats what I would have bought just cause I've always sorta prefered Yamaha to Honda. I bought the ST and totally love the bike, and have had the chance since then to ride a FJR. All I can say is I'm glad no FJRs were avaliable when I bought the ST. A great motorcycle but the ST jus fits me better.

[ChrisW123]

Hmmm, My dealer still has a brand new 05 FJR on his showroom thats been sitting there since last July unloved and unsold.

Probably depends on your area maybe if they are going to have extras. I guess a dealer would have an extra bike if someone cancelled (losing their deposit).

When I looked last summer (late summer) the salesman looked at me like I was from another planet when I asked him if he had any FJR's in stock. It was really weird... He made it seem like there would be no way to get one in my area this late in the season and that I was a jack-a$$ for even asking. Pretty bad customer service in my opinion. :)

[naturally wired]

First off I think the st1100 went over 10 year with almost no changes ...so I wouldn't look for any changes for awhile.....second off yamy changed the bike already ...how long will it be before they change it again ......tic tic tic tic tic time will tell...........third off ....look at resale #s.....I did on the 04 st I have and for just a little more I got a new st1300 insted of a three year old st1100 ........tic tic tic tic tic tic boy the clocks running slow today....anyway if you want a deal buy a used yamy after the new ones are out for a few ......I bet the new ones dont tic.....but as soon as that gets out the used ones will go down BIG TIME!!!......so if you want the sure thing buy the st......If you end up not liking the st and want the fjr go for a none ticking used one about june should do it!!!!!