How to Fry two very expensive ST1100 Voltage regulator/ Rectifier units.

STPiper · Nov 15, 2011

I just fried the second of two Voltage regulator/ Rectifier units ($235 dollars each) on my 1992 ST1100. Most of the wires from the main harness had melted insulation at the plug socket. Honda does not sell the plug socket, one has to purchase a whole wiring harness or cannibalize a used tteryharness.
According to the service technician making reference to a Honda service bulletin for GoldWing motorcycles, it is the construction of Chinese-made motorcycle batteries that are sold through a major cycle parts vendor. When I thought about it, I did purchase a Chinese-made battery, and this battery melted the two voltage regulators within a few hundred miles. The battery somehow fools the regulator into thinking it's undercharged. The regulator then overheats while overcharging. All seems to be fine with my new, Japanese-made Yuasa battery. 3,000+ miles so far.

schlep1967 · Nov 15, 2011

This post is worthless without the name of the offending battery. Sorry you had the bad experience, but if you don't put the info out there you are not preventing us from making the same mistake. Come on, give it up.

scootac · Nov 15, 2011

schlep1967 said:
This post is worthless without the name of the offending battery. Sorry you had the bad experience, but if you don't put the info out there you are not preventing us from making the same mistake. Come on, give it up.

Agree with this,,, saying "Chinese made" doesn't eliminate much of anything these days.

Dwhit · Nov 15, 2011

Yuasa battery manufacturing is in Laureldale, PA
I use Yuasa batteries exclusively for 45 years...never disappointed. Typical life on a flooded battery is 5 years. I have a gell-cell going 10 years now on a SHADOW and she starts every time.
www.yuasabatteries.com

sennister · Nov 15, 2011

I thought there was an aftermarket option for the VRR on the 1100. Something less expensive than the OEM.

st1300r · Nov 15, 2011

Be interesting to see the service bulletin and specific reference to failure mode.
Yuze guys on the 1100's have a real voltage meter no? Did show anything unusual while this was going on?

sennister · Nov 15, 2011

st1300r said:
Be interesting to see the service bulletin and specific reference to failure mode.
Yuze guys on the 1100's have a real voltage meter no? Did show anything unusual while this was going on?

No Voltmeter on the 1100 unless someone added an aftermarket one just like the 1300. There are a few people that replace the headlight adjuster knob with a Honda Marine Voltmeter that looks like it is OEM but they don't come that way.

st1300r · Nov 15, 2011

So...Even the stuff that the 11 doesn't have is better than the stuff the 13 doesn't have

:bow1:

I'm a fan of analog gauges as well.
Ideally oriented with needles at the same angle when at normal op conditions.

John OoSTerhuis · Nov 15, 2011

In following this issue for over ten years now, this is the first time anyone has ever blamed a functional battery. My bet is on corrosion and I'd sure inspect all the connectors. If nothing special has been done other than another VRR and a new battery, history would suggest that if one VRR was fried, it will happen again. Lots of info on the ST forums about actions to extend the life of the VRR and stator. BTW, I ask voluntary 40amp upgraders who borrow the STOC tool kit to save their white 6P connectors with enough wire lead length so someone with a melted one can use it to splice into their wire loom. There's some salvage 6Ps out there. I have at least one, plus an OEM VRR or two...

edit: running a voltmeter on an aging 28amp system is a must, IMHO. Might save a VRR if the stator fails or corrosion ups the resistance big time, not to mention give you enough warning to keep from being stranded 20 miles outside BFE late on a Sat night in a driving sleet storm.

Regards, John

gmast1100 · Nov 16, 2011

sennister said:
No Voltmeter on the 1100 unless someone added an aftermarket one just like the 1300. There are a few people that replace the headlight adjuster knob with a Honda Marine Voltmeter that looks like it is OEM but they don't come that way.

FYI-You forgot the 1100 Police models. My wife has a 03 1100P and it does have the volt meter. They moved the headlight adjuster way under some of the plastic.

BuddingGeezer · Nov 19, 2011

STPiper said:
I just fried the second of two Voltage regulator/ Rectifier units ($235 dollars each) on my 1992 ST1100. Most of the wires from the main harness had melted insulation at the plug socket. Honda does not sell the plug socket, one has to purchase a whole wiring harness or cannibalize a used tteryharness.
According to the service technician making reference to a Honda service bulletin for GoldWing motorcycles, it is the construction of Chinese-made motorcycle batteries that are sold through a major cycle parts vendor. When I thought about it, I did purchase a Chinese-made battery, and this battery melted the two voltage regulators within a few hundred miles. The battery somehow fools the regulator into thinking it's undercharged. The regulator then overheats while overcharging. All seems to be fine with my new, Japanese-made Yuasa battery. 3,000+ miles so far.

I really don't think the battery is the problem. On the 28 amp system with the separate VR/R the VR/R reads the battery voltage on the black wire. The black wire servrs 2 functions. In addition to supplying the VR/R with battery voltage it supplies the alternator magnets power to energize them. The wiring runs through the ignition switch and isn't very large. Due to the long circuit line, light wire and maybe corrosion there is quite a bit of voltage drop on the black wire that conects to the VR/R. My running voltage on my Datel voltage meter rose to over 16V which is too high. The upper operating voltage limit on the 28 amp alt is 15.2v according to the OEM service manual. With 16v at the battery, the voltage on the black wire was just 11 volts. this voltage loss fools the VR/R into thinking the battery need charging. My solution was to run a fused bypass circuit via a relay from the battery to the black wire. The line voltage loss to the black wire after this was only 0.1V rater than 5 volts. My running voltage now is 13.9-14V on the Datel.

I believe this line loss on the ST1100 28amp systems is the reason for VR/R failure and alternator failure. (at least on the bikes that are not electrical farkel over loaded)

DeanR · Nov 19, 2011

Mr Geezer, I might be inclined to try this on my 91 if I only had a clue what all this electric lingo meant and was able to properly operate a multimeter !

kawamewa · Nov 20, 2014

BuddingGeezer said:
I really don't think the battery is the problem. On the 28 amp system with the separate VR/R the VR/R reads the battery voltage on the black wire. The black wire servrs 2 functions. In addition to supplying the VR/R with battery voltage it supplies the alternator magnets power to energize them. The wiring runs through the ignition switch and isn't very large. Due to the long circuit line, light wire and maybe corrosion there is quite a bit of voltage drop on the black wire that conects to the VR/R. My running voltage on my Datel voltage meter rose to over 16V which is too high. The upper operating voltage limit on the 28 amp alt is 15.2v according to the OEM service manual. With 16v at the battery, the voltage on the black wire was just 11 volts. this voltage loss fools the VR/R into thinking the battery need charging. My solution was to run a fused bypass circuit via a relay from the battery to the black wire. The line voltage loss to the black wire after this was only 0.1V rater than 5 volts. My running voltage now is 13.9-14V on the Datel.

I believe this line loss on the ST1100 28amp systems is the reason for VR/R failure and alternator failure. (at least on the bikes that are not electrical farkel over loaded)

Hi mr buddinggeezer, do have the diagram or picture how is your bypass look a like, i just change my rectifier and the voltage going up to 15.6v with head light on and low rpm

Grabcon · Nov 20, 2014

For my vintage CB750's I go here for connectors.

http://www.vintagecb750.com/products/5/electrical/64/wire-terminals-couplers-fuse-boxes-fuses

If you go to the bottom of the page you will see 2, 3, 4, 6, and 8 pin connectors. I use these a lot and have never had issues. I also use their small connectors to replace the factory single connections.

DeanR · Nov 20, 2014

That looks like a great source Brad. and I wouldn't mind having one on hand.
but
shipping for one $4.50 8P connector is $14 !!!!

Grabcon · Nov 20, 2014

Yea, the shipping. When I get stuff from these guys I usually buy a bunch of stuff because of shipping cost. I believe the are out of Canada which contributes to the shipping cost.

One other thing don't be in a rush. It usually takes 5 to 7 days to get to me.

DeanR · Nov 20, 2014

Shipping to a buddy in Canada would be a whole $1 cheaper!

Amazing. A couple bucks to toss the darn thing in an envelope is about what it oughta cost..

FNAVTX · Nov 20, 2014

That Honda marine voltmeter sounds interesting! Anybody got a part number or source?

Grabcon · Nov 20, 2014

Here is another source. Although I have not used them. And they are US based. See bottom of page

https://www.mikesxs.net/products-78.html#products

DeanR · Nov 20, 2014

FNAVTX said:
That Honda marine voltmeter sounds interesting! Anybody got a part number or source?

http://www.boats.net/parts/detail/honda/H-37450-ZW5-000ZA.html

How to Fry two very expensive ST1100 Voltage regulator/ Rectifier units.

STPiper

schlep1967

Bill

scootac

Will Ride for Food

Dwhit

sennister

st1300r

sennister

st1300r

John OoSTerhuis

Life Is Good!

gmast1100

Gettin old sux

BuddingGeezer

DeanR

kawamewa

Grabcon

DeanR

Grabcon

DeanR

FNAVTX

Grabcon

DeanR