Anyone de-linked the brakes?

Joined
Aug 21, 2008
Messages
128
Age
81
Location
Ellensburg, Wa
Here's the desperation question of the week: Has anyone "delinked" their brakes somehow, via custom lines or plugs, and turned their ST1300 into a front lever/front caliper and rear pedal/rear caliper system? I'm beyond frustrated with the rear brake lockup issue..... This is insane for a bike this good to have this bad of a problem....just insane.....
 

Bones

Your Humble Scribe
Joined
Dec 6, 2004
Messages
4,907
Age
60
Location
western Mass
Bike
2014 BMW R1200RT
STOC #
5575
I haven't followed your particular brake problem, but delinking seems like major surgery for what should be a simple fix. The ST's brake system is complex and the bleed procedure when changing out the fluid is involved and specific. I've done it three times, each time with a helper, and it's a PITA. I'm wondering if you have air in the lines or if your fluid is contaminated. Is the rear caliper somehow misaligned? Is the stopper bolt that holds the rear brake caliper tightened to the right torque? Are the brake pads installed correctly? Do the pistons need to be cleaned? Is there an issue with the secondary master cylinder leaking air around the seal? I've read a couple cases where Honda replaced that master cylinder to fix a rear brake problem.
 

Dinkie Diesel

------------Jeff------------
Joined
Jul 5, 2007
Messages
3,056
Location
Defiance, Missouri
Bike
2013 GL1800
Remember the days of transition from manual chokes to automatic chokes on cars? The automatic choke was great...when it worked. If I were you I'd do whatever it takes to get the problem solved without modifying the system. Chances are that doing away with the linked brakes wouldn't fix the problem either. Point us to your thread, if you have one, dealing with the locked brakes or tell us exactly what is taking place. There are some wise folks that hang out here that can help.
 

Mellow

Joe
Admin
Joined
Dec 1, 2004
Messages
18,827
Age
60
Bike
'21 BMW R1250RT
2024 Miles
000540
I absolutely love the brakes. Is the design such that there are issues? yes.. and it's tough for some service departments to grasp as it's not a common way for Honda to do the brakes. They do it on the wing as well but it's not an identical setup.

Given regular scheduled maint.... the issue is typically w/smc which I think they could have just been designed upside down so any water falls out of the plunger section... but, I'm no engineer and that design may be worse.

I plan on getting an smc rebuild kit and have it on hand to replace around 80k I think or if I start having issues.
 

BakerBoy

It's all small stuff.
Joined
Jan 31, 2008
Messages
5,454
Location
Golden, Colorado
STOC #
1408
I too think it is a great system, with a couple 'trouble' spots. The SMC is turning out to be the biggest issue--in some cases due to the angle (it retains water), but in most cases due to incomplete bleeding. But still, I wouldn't de-link it.

I recall that there was a thread on this very topic a couple years ago. The conclusion was much the same as the first few posts above, but there may be some additional insight in it. :)
 
Joined
Apr 25, 2007
Messages
4,954
Age
62
Location
New Jersey
Bike
st1300 '04
STOC #
7163
Someone here devised a temporary fix jamming a cut wedge of rubber from the front V or a boat trailer between the fork and caliper to keep the left front assy rotating forward and engaging the SMC. Might work until you rework the SMC if that's your issue. OTOH might not be your issue. I wouldn't chance it .02.
 
Joined
Apr 14, 2012
Messages
129
Location
Mississippi
Bike
2007 ST1300
Cousin Jack,
Lots of good info here. I feel your pain. Also note there are alot of very knowledgable people on this forum with experience with the braking system.
I too contemplated delinking the system while it was 103*F in my garage and I was recently sorting out the brakes.
if i can be of any help, pm me and I will try to assist.
 

sirepair

Let's RIDE!
Site Supporter
Joined
Jun 7, 2007
Messages
3,231
Location
Chillicothe, Ohio
Bike
2003 ST1100P
STOC #
7105
Well, to answer the original question; it shouldn't be that hard to do. I bought a set of ST1300 front calipers; thinking of fitting them to my 1100, and was confronted with the same issue.

Rear brake should be pretty easy; a small "jumper" hose from the center puck to the rear, then a single line from the rear to the m/c. May want a larger dia m/c.

The same approach could be done on the front. I would use dual braided lines, one each from m/c to caliper, with jumpers to the 2nd fittings. Again, may want a larger dia m/c to compensate.

There may be some other caliper that would be an easy swap, but I have not looked at that.
 
Last edited:

RONST1300

STOC # 8616
Joined
Apr 5, 2012
Messages
400
Location
Council Bluffs, IA
Bike
2005 ST1300
STOC #
8616
Givea shout to Igofar Larry. He can help you. I've been there, and Larry talked me off the ledge. Just recently there was a post on an SMC bypass. That would be a good way of rerouting the brakes. Also you may discover your problem is in the SMC or not, or the bleeding process.
Ron
 
Last edited:

drrod

Site Supporter
Joined
Aug 4, 2006
Messages
1,716
Location
Calgary, Alberta
Bike
'04 ST1300
STOC #
8313
This is a relatively common procedure done by Blackbird owners. There is a guy in Britain called "Jaws' who makes a kit to do it. Visually the linked system of the BB looks the same as the ST, but I will not swear that it is so I do not know if the BB kit will work on the ST.
His website is
http://www.jaws-motorcycles.com/

He has a great reputation in the BB world for being helpful when contacted. If you are seriously considering de-linking, you might send him a message.

Rod
 
Joined
Apr 14, 2012
Messages
129
Location
Mississippi
Bike
2007 ST1300
:headbang:
what ron said

Givea shout to Igofar Larry. He can help you. I've been there, and Larry talked me off the ledge. Just recently there was a post on an SMC bypass. That would be a good way of rerouting the brakes. Also you may discover your problem is in the SMC or not, or the bleeding process.
Ron
 
Joined
Nov 16, 2007
Messages
1,372
Location
MURFREESBORO, TN
Bike
18 Gold Wing
STOC #
7285
I have been dealing with some rear brake issues and after a little go around Mother Honda is replacing my Secondary Master Cylinder. I'll let you all how that works out in the lo0ng run. They(Honda) recognize there is a problem with the SMC but won't do anything about it until you make some noise! Communicate with Igofar, Larry and/or visit your local dealer and insist they call Honda and also follow the correct bleeding process when after they replace the failing part.
 
Joined
Jan 8, 2011
Messages
7,066
Location
Arizona
Bike
2007 Honda ST1300A
I absolutely love the brakes. Is the design such that there are issues? yes.. and it's tough for some service departments to grasp as it's not a common way for Honda to do the brakes. They do it on the wing as well but it's not an identical setup.

Given regular scheduled maint.... the issue is typically w/smc which I think they could have just been designed upside down so any water falls out of the plunger section... but, I'm no engineer and that design may be worse.

I plan on getting an smc rebuild kit and have it on hand to replace around 80k I think or if I start having issues.
Not a bad idea on having spare parts ready when it fails, however, purchase the entire unit, NOT the rebuild assembly. When the SMC goes bad, the rubber scrapers lay down flat and the piston goes metal to metal and damages the bore of the housing. Ask me how I know? I had a few rebuild kits on hand, and every time I opened one up I found bore damage, making the rebuild kit useless.
Its not much more money, and much easier to simply replace the entire unit.
.02
 
Last edited:

SupraSabre

48 Years of SoCal Lane Splitting/Commuting-Retired
Site Supporter
Joined
Nov 20, 2005
Messages
9,500
Location
Cedar City, Utah
Bike
12/04 ST 1300s
2024 Miles
000145
STOC #
5901
Okay, we (the Forum, not me) have been talking about the SMC for several months now and to tell you the truth, I'm only guessing which part we are talking about! So, to clear all this up, is this the part that is being called the SMC?

View attachment 122378
 

Mellow

Joe
Admin
Joined
Dec 1, 2004
Messages
18,827
Age
60
Bike
'21 BMW R1250RT
2024 Miles
000540
Joined
Jan 15, 2009
Messages
353
Location
HolliSTer, CA
Bike
2012 ST1300A
Making such a change (de-linking) would absolve American Honda of all product liability in a brake-related failure- and place it squarely on you. Sure you want to do that rather than get it fixed properly?
 
OP
OP
Cousin Jack
Joined
Aug 21, 2008
Messages
128
Age
81
Location
Ellensburg, Wa
My original post didn't have enough information, I guess........here's kind of a flesh-out!

My rear brake seized today on my Honda ST1300; and I had to crack open a bleed nipple to get the pads off the disc.... I nursed it home then, and had seemingly normal front brakes. Safe at home, I'd pump the front lever and everything was okay, the rear caliper would not stick, but if I so much as touched the rear pedal, the rear caliper would clamp tight, and I'd have to crack the bleed nipple again, and pry the pads away from the disc...... and when I would crack the nipple, the brake fluid pulsed out like an arterial wound!

Two years and 17,000 miles ago, I put on a brand new secondary master cylinder, built myself a home-made vacuum bleeder (see pic), bought a shop manual, found an illustrated guide (on here, I think) and bled the brakes as carefully and as well as my wife and I could. I live in a small town, and the dealer is a mountain range and 115 miles away, and so we do our own work. And everything was fine with the brakes, until today.....the rear disc would sometimes feel warm during the "okay" time, but never overly so. If anything ever causes me to sell the ST, it will be this issue. I'd still like to delink the brakes somehow, with plugs and custom lines, and go back to front lever/front, and rear pedal/rear. Damn engineers are too clever for their own good.......

How should I start with this problem? Clean and maybe rebuild the rear m/c? Redo the whole system again, with a new SMC (my second in 36K miles)? I don't mean to be a crybaby; I love this bike, except for this issue....
 

Attachments

SupraSabre

48 Years of SoCal Lane Splitting/Commuting-Retired
Site Supporter
Joined
Nov 20, 2005
Messages
9,500
Location
Cedar City, Utah
Bike
12/04 ST 1300s
2024 Miles
000145
STOC #
5901
Thanks Joe...Here I have 154K on my '05 and the brakes just seem to keep working ....All I have ever done is to bleed them a few times and and clean the pistons when replacing the pads. :eek::

Maybe because I'm riding it all the time, it keeps things moving....:think1:

Although, I'm sure if Larry (Igofar) looked at them, he would say they are in terrible shape...lol
 
Top Bottom