difference between a Pan European, ST1100 and ST1100A?

Question: What is the difference between a Pan European, ST1100 and ST1100A? Thanks! I live in the US, and am planning to buy an ST soon!

Answer (from post #45): Technically speaking "Pan European" is not a stand-alone model designation from Honda but a version (or variant, nickname) of a standard Honda (alphanumeric) model designation such as "ST1100" that was (and still is) sold in certain European markets. The differences are (mainly): minor cosmetic, emissions control and local traffic law compliance (such as lighting).

For the most part it is the same bike. Called the ST1100 in North America and the Pan European in Europe. The A indicates that it is an ST1100 fitted with ABS brakes.

Andrew Shadow said:

For the most part it is the same bike. Called the ST1100 in North America and the Pan European in Europe. The A indicates that it is an ST1100 fitted with ABS brakes.

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1. Honda never made a motorcycle called a "Pan European."
2. The factory manual talks about 3 types: Standard Model, ABS/TCS Model and LBS-ABS/TCS Model.

1. Honda DID make a motorcycle called a Pan European, from 1990 to 2002. It had lovely "Pan European" badging on the fairing. This bike was only sold in Britain and Europe, however, it was exactly the same machine as was sold in North America during the same years called the ST1100. There were, of course, some minor differences due to emissions and lighting regulations of various countries, as happens with all motorcycles made for a world wide market.

2. Both Europe and North American models of this identical machine came in three types - Standard (no ABS), ABS/TCS (ABS and Traction Control) and, in later model years, the LBS-ABS/TCS (Linked Brakes-ABS/TCS).

Hope that clears that up for you.

1. The non-ABS 1100s don't have linked brakes.
2. The ABS bikes do have linked brakes & larger fork tubes....but, those 2 changes were made after '94, I think.

John

To the OP:: If yur looking for an ST in the US, the bike ya want is a 96 or later A model. Larger forks, better brakes, 40 amp alternator. That said, there is a beautiful, low miles 91 Silver on e-bay right now.

Timothy1959 said:

1. Honda never made a motorcycle called a "Pan European."

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That's great news - it means my Pan-European Owner's Manual should fetch a fortune on eBay!



On the other hand it does make me feel dumb for owning three Pan-Europeans over the last 12 years. I wish someone had pointed out to me that I was riding a non-existent motorcycle!

Hound said:

That's great news - it means my Pan-European Owner's Manual should fetch a fortune on eBay!



On the other hand it does make me feel dumb for owning three Pan-Europeans over the last 12 years. I wish someone had pointed out to me that I was riding a non-existent motorcycle!

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Now Hound .... I guess I must have ridden the same non-existent motorcycle when I rode with you! ;-) Seems like there was a bunch of them that surrounded us... ;-) Hope this finds you doing well, my friend.

Since you're in Nevada, you are likely to see a few California bikes for sale.

The California bikes have an evaporative fuel canister and miles of related (and really unnecessary) tubing to comply with CARB specs for our misguided policy setters. Some Cal bikes also have a different cam grind (specs listed in the service manual) that would serve to "detune" the engine a bit. Whether you can actually feel any difference when riding the two bikes is arguable but the difference is certainly there. The Cal bikes will, of course, have a higher probability of developing vacuum leaks etc. in all the related tubing. It's not difficult to fix....just something that should be considered.

If my FOG memory is correct, the California bikes have a VIN that starts with JH2SC26(1). The 49 state bikes will start with JH2SC26(0). Canada got a (3) I think. Anyways, there ARE some differences. The California bikes will also have a sticker under the seat stuck on the rear inner fender plastic that diagrams the routing of the CARB canister hoses and can be recognized in that manner. All STs have a rear swingarm that is manufactured with a lot of holes and blind corner spaces. In general, we don't have a big rust problem with salted roads here in the states but you might check out some of the swingarm horror photos from the UK and stay away from bikes from the eastern seaboard that were ridden in winter conditions (or at least flop down on your back and take a look at the swingarm with a good light).

Couple this with the other info on model years (alternator output)the ABS and TC bikes (bigger fork tubes and a wider front wheel) and it can get a bit confusing.

To my mind the ABS/TC systems are hideously complex and also very expensive (even on used parts) to repair.

Thats about it. Good luck on your search. Winter is your friend particularly right after Christmas when everyone is broke.

Ladder is generally right, but the Cal bikes shouldn't be a concern. My 01 CA model ABSII has over 180,000 miles with no problems.

According to my Honda Model Identification Guide, ABS II arrived in 97. I thought it was 98.

Good luck on your hunt.

Hound said:

I wish someone had pointed out to me that I was riding a non-existent motorcycle!

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As long as you don't ride it wearing non-existant gear (or kit).
:mcrider:

Hound said:

That's great news - it means my Pan-European Owner's Manual should fetch a fortune on eBay!



On the other hand it does make me feel dumb for owning three Pan-Europeans over the last 12 years. I wish someone had pointed out to me that I was riding a non-existent motorcycle!

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The ST1100 became the ST1300. Does that mean the ST1300 is also called "Pan-European?"

Hound said:

That's great news - it means my Pan-European Owner's Manual should fetch a fortune on eBay!



On the other hand it does make me feel dumb for owning three Pan-Europeans over the last 12 years. I wish someone had pointed out to me that I was riding a non-existent motorcycle!

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Honda never used the name "Pan-European" all by itself. In the case of your owner's manual in the pic, it is used with the alphanumeric "ST1100."

George said:

Ladder is generally right, but the Cal bikes shouldn't be a concern. My 01 CA model ABSII has over 180,000 miles with no problems.

According to my Honda Model Identification Guide, ABS II arrived in 97. I thought it was 98.

Good luck on your hunt.

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George, I would LOVE to get a copy of this "Honda Model Identification Guide" How can I do this?

ST1100 and ST1300 were both sold as Pan Europeans,looks like this will be the end of the line though.

broc11 don't be a so negative Mother Honda will rise to the challenge of a NEW ST sooner or later they cant be so daft as to think all the die hard fans will not be hungry for a newer model sooner or later

Timothy1959 said:

Honda never used the name "Pan-European" all by itself.

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I don't understand why this name thing is such a problem for you? Fact is, if you lived in Britain, you'd be looking through the adverts for a Pan - period. That's the commonly used name for them over there and Honda isn't doing anything that car manufacturers haven't done over the years, by naming the same basic vehicle one thing in Europe and something else in North America. It's all about marketing. Don't lose any more sleep over this.

Hound said:

On the other hand it does make me feel dumb for owning three Pan-Europeans over the last 12 years. I wish someone had pointed out to me that I was riding a non-existent motorcycle!

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LOL! Nuff said Hound :yes: ;-)

And IIRC are there actually 4 'continental' models: the standard ST1100 (non ABS, '90~'00), the ABS-I/TCS ('92~'94) the ABS-II/CBS ('95~'00) and then the P-spec versions.
And not to mention the rainbow like colour variations they came in...
(and I believe there was a castrated 70HP version sold in Switzerland for some time, different ECU...)

And IIRC_II had the CN-spec (or 48-states models) some gadgets added to meet emission regs: altitude control, tank breather routed through a charcoal-canister, running-lights, headlights hard-wired, etc...
The US market saw a truly amazing selection of colours to choose from: arrest-me-red, silver and black... ;-) (only the '90 model came 'uniform' on both sides of the pond: Maroon...)

Thus Pan-European and ST1100/A actually are different models.

Timothy1959 said:

Honda never used the name "Pan-European" all by itself. In the case of your owner's manual in the pic, it is used with the alphanumeric "ST1100."

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ehhm... all the advertisement material, posters, price lists, accessories, fairing decals/badges, etc... came with the brand-name Pan-European, and that's how the bike is known with.
HondaLine even offered an expensive series of stitches with the Pan-European logo, just like Gold-Wing or Civic...
And before the 'ST1100' came up, we actually referred to it as 'SC26' or simply 'a Pan' when ordering parts and such...

Also the 1300 was branded as 'the new Pan-European' over here...

ST1100Y said:

LOL! Nuff said Hound :yes: ;-)

And IIRC are there actually 4 'continental' models: the standard ST1100 (non ABS, '90~'00), the ABS-I/TCS ('92~'94) the ABS-II/CBS ('95~'00) and then the P-spec versions.
And not to mention the rainbow like colour variations they came in...
(and I believe there was a castrated 70HP version sold in Switzerland for some time, different ECU...)

And IIRC_II had the CN-spec (or 48-states models) some gadgets added to meet emission regs: altitude control, tank breather routed through a charcoal-canister, running-lights, headlights hard-wired, etc...
The US market saw a truly amazing selection of colours to choose from: arrest-me-red, silver and black... ;-) (only the '90 model came 'uniform' on both sides of the pond: Maroon...)

Thus Pan-European and ST1100/A actually are different models.

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"Thus Pan-European and ST1100/A actually are different models."
I THOUGHT SO! This means that many people are simply wrong. It seems that I have, once again, run into a "common miss-conception."
Now what I want to know is: Exactly WHAT are the differences between the three?