Handle bar wobble '91 1100

ST1100Y

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Tapers have a bit more drag in the design...
Obvious due the increased contact patch of them rollers, opposite to the tiny patch in ball bearings.
But doesn't the increased resistance cause one to zig-zag during slow manoeuvring? (as when having worn head-bearings with centre-dented)

...noticed it now has a definite center notch so will need to change the bearings soon. The have almost 45,000 miles on them.
Aha, so they actually don't last longer then the ball types? 45Kmiles/70.000km would actually be on the lower end of lifetime of the ball type head bearings...
 
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my 94 st11 was developing this said shake, so i changed my tyres,
the guy in the tyre shop recommended changing the front from a 110 to a 120 to help with the shake problem.
think someone who owned it maybe cut cost and put a 110 on it before i got it.
just rode home, ill get a dry day this wek and get it scrubbed in.
probably wont notice for a couple of thousand miles.
 
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think someone who owned it maybe cut cost and put a 110 on it before i got it.
110/80-18 is the tire size for all ST1100s except for the ABSII models which have a different rim size and use a 120/70-18

yours is not an ABSII model, so the 110 width tire would be the recommended size.
 

JPKalishek

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Obvious due the increased contact patch of them rollers, opposite to the tiny patch in ball bearings.
But doesn't the increased resistance cause one to zig-zag during slow manoeuvring? (as when having worn head-bearings with centre-dented)
Not that I have noticed. maybe if you over torqued them it would

Aha, so they actually don't last longer then the ball types? 45Kmiles/70.000km would actually be on the lower end of lifetime of the ball type head bearings...
Not if they are cheap and you ride a bit too much like a hoon on some rather rough roads (my old commute could nearly bottom my XL250S, and I'm not afraid of the occasional gravel road). I used some from All Balls and I don't think they are the highest quality out there, but certainly not the worst. Both bike were near 40,000 miles when I changed them over, and the balls were very much in need of replacing (two tone because of the crash Doghouse had pitted it off center, but they were about the only thing on the bike not well lubed and taken care of).
 

ST1100Y

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Not that I have noticed. maybe if you over torqued them it would
But this could be the case for some who are in chase of a dec wobble...

Not if they are cheap and you ride a bit too much like a hoon on some rather rough roads.
Our frost beaten, patch-worked mountain roads don't do much good for bearing lifetime either...
So at the bottom line: nothing much to gain by tempered head bearings, they won't last significantly longer under the given conditions...
And they certainly can't cure a dec wobble, only mask the symptoms to a degree...

I used some from All Balls and I don't think they are the highest quality out there, but certainly not the worst.
Well, I'm very suspicions about the use of after-market parts in such sensitive areas... thus rather stick with OEM...
And I've learned to work very methodical... sound and thorough service are the foundation of a roadworthy vehicle...
 

JPKalishek

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But this could be the case for some who are in chase of a dec wobble...


Our frost beaten, patch-worked mountain roads don't do much good for bearing lifetime either...
So at the bottom line: nothing much to gain by tempered head bearings, they won't last significantly longer under the given conditions...
And they certainly can't cure a dec wobble, only mask the symptoms to a degree...


Well, I'm very suspicions about the use of after-market parts in such sensitive areas... thus rather stick with OEM...
And I've learned to work very methodical... sound and thorough service are the foundation of a roadworthy vehicle...
Tapers should never get as bad as balls will with the indexing, Also they are far less prone to just scattering when you've removed the trees for some reason other than working on the balls and races (I still find balls on the floor in my shop from work on bikes). I'd get some Honda oem tapered bearings if they were not quite so over priced for what they are. I get good wheel bearings from a electric motor repair shop and they are only a few bucks more than the cheap ones from All Balls and Boss bearings with the chinese bearings, and they are the same ones in the Japanese sets. What I lack is the seals and those are not too bad getting oem (but have not gone to a seal and bearing distro yet so who knows there).
 

ST1100Y

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...they are far less prone to just scattering when you've removed the trees for some reason other than working on the balls and races.
Never had that though ;-)
Conditions of head bearings is a mandatory inspection point during the annual MOT, and since I'm pretty observant I get them done on even the slightest sign of "locking" in the centre position anyway...
So I yet have not seen any balls flying through the work-shed... but my mech surely did, sometimes they get real worn down, rotten vehicles in...

What I lack is the seals and those are not too bad getting oem (but have not gone to a seal and bearing distro yet so who knows there).
Just because of that seal issue (only cover plates) I never really bothered with tempered... IIRC were there issues with the seals when fitting tempered bearings?
The OEM ones come as a kit in a funny cardboard-can like instant coffee, top and bottom bearing plus the two seals/covers... no hustle, no searching around... just remove the forks, bang the old bearings out, reach into the box for the new parts... 2~3 stress free hours...

What I dislike on doing head bearings is that I could loose the MOT- plus the m/way toll-sticker... both placed on the tubes, just below the upper TT...
Have to wedge a large screwdriver into the gaps of the lower TT to widen it enough so them stickers don't get scraped off... fumbling like a surgeon there... ;-)
 

JPKalishek

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What I dislike on doing head bearings is that I could loose the MOT- plus the m/way toll-sticker... both placed on the tubes, just below the upper TT...
Have to wedge a large screwdriver into the gaps of the lower TT to widen it enough so them stickers don't get scraped off... fumbling like a surgeon there... ;-)
Do so love places that put things (especially expensive, legally, required things) where they may, or will be destroyed by routine maintenance. I think I'd find a tube to slip over the area, like the old headlight brackets, that could be removed, and stick those items on that.
 
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A little personal history on steering bearings: I've changed or help change the steering bearings on many bikes, including 4 or 5 STs. When the tapered bearing issue first came up, found the correct set thru my local indy dealer in Downers Grove, IL. Marlene Mares had never done mail order, but she did them for us at a good price. Lots'a STOCers (STriders? SToners?) ordered from her. She bought'em wholesale from Tucker Rocky (Same part # as the early Gold Wings) and dropped shipped to many members. Who else remembers ordering from Mar? Derek's 91 was the first we did, way back in 93.

STick got'em early as well, and now has her second set of tapers. STanley (nee ReSTored, RIP) had them already when I got'im from Adam Koczarski. Helped a couple other guys along the way. The tapers are worth the effort, just don't get'em too tight. And do plan on readjusting after a thousand miles or so.

Now, the current End Of The Story: LipSTick, my 01 ABSII, still has her original ball bearings at 180,000 miles+. Everything seems fine. I have a set of tapers in the box but haven't seen a need to change them yet. Jus' sayin'. :D
 
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Brant,
so what a bout the people that have the tapered bearings and still get wobble? Or the guys who have more than 100 K on OEM bearings and never had the wobble? Or the guy who only had wobble once in over 300K and it was his tire? Oh I get it someone has an opinion different than yours so they must be wrong??

Way to help out the group!!!
Was NOT an opinion, just what solved the issue on my bike AND the largest majority of those here. May not resolve ALl the cases, as theirs ALOT of variables. You or I don't know their tires or pressures used....and on and on, but steering head bearings IS a good starting point, whether it be adjustment or replacement. Sad that you have totally misconstrued things.......nothin' a long ride won't correct tho!
 

Dex

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My ST1100 year 2000 acquired a head-shake problem after a 200 mile motorway run (heavily loaded) which squared-off the rear tyre. It reduced after a few hundred more miles of mixed riding which rounded off the flat part of the rear tyre profile. In other words it was the partially worn rear tyre that created the front head shake.
 

John OoSTerhuis

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A little personal history on steering bearings: I've changed or help change the steering bearings on many bikes, including 4 or 5 STs....
Heh, heh. Talk about ST1100 and STOC history... have a look at the Spring '94 issue of the ST1100 Newsletter, page 11:

http://www.st-riders.net/index.php?topic=3471.0

Edit: BTW, George, I used your article to do mine way back when, but you must have had much better fender washers than I could find. :) Ended up using a big brass drift. The STOC loaner kit is the surefire way these days! 75 ST1100 and ST1300 steering bearing R&Rs to date and currently available for loan!!!

John
 
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I had forgotten that article, John. Long ago and far, far, away...

Good on ya for all the loaner tools, I've used the alternator, sttering bearings, and wheel bearings kits. :D
 
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I had the wobble at 35mph, and replaced the tyres front and back. Next step was replace the head bearings, and to my surprise found it had a tapered lower bearing and OEM ball bearings on the top. !!

Anyway does anyone know the correct torque setting for tapered bearings ?
 
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I had the wobble at 35mph, and replaced the tyres front and back. Next step was replace the head bearings, and to my surprise found it had a tapered lower bearing and OEM ball bearings on the top. !!

Anyway does anyone know the correct torque setting for tapered bearings ?
You're better off adjusting by feel rather than by a specific torque value. Tighten it so that when the front wheel is elevated off the ground a little push from center will cause the wheel to travel smoothly to either side to its full stop. Keep tightening in small amounts until you feel a little binding, then back it off until the binding goes away.
 
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......to add, it may take several re-adjustments to for that gradual roll of the wheel off to the left or right. The top locknut will seat lower nut into threads causing preload to be tighter than was initially adjusted......just an FYI;).
 
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Hello All......re guarding handle bar shake...had it on a couple of bikes BMW GS and ST1100....."low tire pressure" added a couple of PSI ....problem gone.....KEN.
 
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Hello All......re guarding handle bar shake...had it on a couple of bikes BMW GS and ST1100....."low tire pressure" added a couple of PSI ....problem gone.....KEN.
Most any change that alters the stock rake and trail geometry may cause wobble. Could be as simple as a very worn tire, or a new one with slightly smaller diameter than called for. Carrying an excess load on the bike that reduces the effective diameter of the front wheel will do this also. Increasing the weight of the front end...say, strapping a sleeping bag to the front fender...may cause it as well. Changing the drag on the front wheel in such a manner that the resulting forces resemble a change in rake/trail could conceivably cause wobble. Number of potential causes, but the usual culprit is a front tire diameter that is just a tad too small.
 
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That is an old trick used on all bikes - I did it 20 years ago with a BMW R75 . It seems a sensible thing to do with any front suspension. sorry - by that I meant to mention the slacking off, bouncing the forks and re-tightening trick.
 
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