Help me find the right GPS?

SMSW said:

...my Nuvi at that time wanted to route me through Newark, and later kept insisting that i take a state route that either did not exist or was not marked on the roads.

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Sounds to me like that is a cartography problem, rather than a Garmin programming problem.

Garmin makes the hardware, and also the software that operates the device, but they don't make or modify or inspect the cartography (maps) that are used on their devices. For many years, Garmin products used Navteq cartography. Navteq, a totally independent company, creates their maps from a combination of sources - government produced maps, their own research, and other commercial map suppliers.

More recently (last 2 to 3 years), Garmin has switched away from Navteq and is now using maps created by HERE. HERE is owned by Noika, who I think have recently been purchased by Microsoft. There are some advantages to the change to HERE cartography, most notably that HERE permits 4 map updates per year (every 90 days) for users who have lifetime subscriptions. But, due to changes in the way the map data is compiled, only Garmin hardware that is less than 2 to 3 years old can take advantage of the quarterly updates. Older Garmin units with lifetime subscriptions get 2 updates per year.

Anyway, getting back to your routing problem, my guess is that it was caused by an inappropriate road attribute (speed limit, road classification, continuity problem, etc.) being set in the cartography for the most desirable route. As a result, the navigator looked for the 'next best' route, and that is what you got. Those kind of errors normally don't persist for more than one update cycle, because users report the errors back to Garmin, and Garmin passes the reports back to the cartography supplier. It is also possible that the strange routing may have been caused by a user-selectable preference that you had enabled, for example, 'no toll roads', or 'avoid expressways', or similar. If you have a traffic device attached and enabled, the routing problem may also have been caused by an inappropriate traffic report that listed the road as either closed or congested.

Michael

SMSW said:

It seems (especially out west) that as roads are changed/abandoned/replaced sometimes the changes don't make it to the mapping software and people are routed toward newly created dead ends in the middle of deserts or areas with few roads. At this point, being hopelessly lost, a few people have died.

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Darwinian selection at its finest. Anyone who navigates out into remote or potentially hazardous areas without carrying out appropriate due diligence is a fool. Trusting absolutely only one source of information, whether that be a paper map, a GPS, or verbal directions provided by a person, is utter carelessness.

Michael

two_wheeled said:

. . . Things that are important to me are:

• audio jack, or some way to plug in to my J&M audio. My J&M and helmet are wired, not bluetooth, but I have an iPhone if that matters.
• lifetime free maps
• can create multi-point routes
• speed limit indicator
• fast turn-on/reception

. . .

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If you can find a few extra dollars I believe this unit meets all the things you listed; Garmin Dezl 760LTM

I was able to find them refurbished for just over $200. I bought mine before the RV version was available or at least I never saw it when I was shopping. It does have an audio out jack, life time maps, multi-point routes, speed limit for the road and your speed as well. Your speed goes red if you exceed the posted speed. It's start time and reception are good. It has multiple modes and can also track related data. Older eyes seem to enjoy the larger 7" screen. They also make a 5" version which may be less expensive but still have the same features.

CYYJ said:

Darwinian selection at its finest. Anyone who navigates out into remote or potentially hazardous areas without carrying out appropriate due diligence is a fool. Trusting absolutely only one source of information, whether that be a paper map, a GPS, or verbal directions provided by a person, is utter carelessness.

Michael

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Michael,
I could not agree with you more. I've been saying for years and years, 'We have to eliminate stupidity from the gene pool somehow.....' This fills the bill. But. People do misuse everything at one point or another.

As far as the routing problem, this happened about 6 years ago, with a Nuvi 255w (or was it an earlier model? I don't remember). Anyway, after a couple of trips (I was traveling to NYC for work) the problem fixed itself - probably after one of those upgrades since I usually do that regularly, hoping for the corrections Garmin brags about.

CYYJ said:

Sounds to me like that is a cartography problem, rather than a Garmin programming problem.

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Yep, tell 'em Michael... :yes: :lol:
Also on the local GPS boards over here the ongoing "...crappy Garmin..." woes are really getting on the nerves... :banghead:
GPS/satnav is only an assistance, the responsibility remains with the driver, always... period.

If you want a perfect motorcycle route, you will have to plot it yourself using MapSource/BaseCamp/etc... check its entire length in over-zoom, correct errors accordingly and transfer that then onto your GPS...
You cannot expect a machine to create the spectacular motorcycle route for you... machines are dumb and do exactly what you've instructed them, which means: crap in equals crap out

I for one am continuously heavily impressed by the shier masses of data embedded in those maps... street names and house numbers of any secluded farm settlement are in there... its an amazing tool!
If used properly though...

You said you wanted cheap. If you want free and have an old cell phone (IOS or Android) laying around, you can download a free GPS program (like NavFree) that also downloads the map data and doesn't need a data connection (cell or wifi) to run. Certainly not feature rich or ideal, but if cost is a factor, you can beat free sometimes!

JimS63 said:

You said you wanted cheap. If you want free and have an old cell phone (IOS or Android) laying around, you can download a free GPS program (like NavFree) that also downloads the map data and doesn't need a data connection (cell or wifi) to run. Certainly not feature rich or ideal, but if cost is a factor, you can beat free sometimes!

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Dang good idea! I have just retired my Samsung G3, it might become my fixed GPS in place of my Garmin 1490.

But I do like the quick access stuff the Garmin interface supports, like finding nearest gas or food along the planned route. Do any of the apps do it as nicely and easily?

T_C said:

Dang good idea! I have just retired my Samsung G3, it might become my fixed GPS in place of my Garmin 1490.

But I do like the quick access stuff the Garmin interface supports, like finding nearest gas or food along the planned route. Do any of the apps do it as nicely and easily?

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I'm not sure if its on the playstore for android but for IOS you can actually download the garmin app right onto the phone and get the exact same functionality

Steve, our local WalMart has Garmin 52& 55LMs both for under $120.00....on line as well.

Best, Ed

Many of them have tens of thousands of way points built in...I believe NavFree does. Some (not all) will reroute you if you go off your route. Many need an internet connection to reroute, so check for this as that is a mandatory feature as far as I am concerned. YMMV, but as I said, for free you'd have to expect some limitations.

There are many things you can do with an old phone. You can turn this old phone into a dash cam (more free apps) and you could also load up all of your music on this secondary device to save your main phone's battery. Non bike related, you can also use your old phone(s) as an IP home security camera.

I've heard the Garmin Viago app is pretty good at a reasonable price of $2 but you need to pay another $10 to get the maps on the device so you're not using your data while riding. You can't import routes but with the Trip Planner feature but you can create custom routes within the app. They do have an Android app.

Thanks for all the input, everyone.
Speaking of phone apps, I'm fond of google maps and I've tried CoPilot also but wouldn't rely on them for several reasons. I prefer a dedicated GPS, so I don't have to swap between maps and phone and music and who knows what else. Also, I find the GPS interface is more intuitive, easier to see and has better functionality for the kinds of functions I need when out on the road.

Today I got a Garmin Nuvi 2597LMT and the RAM mount for it as well. So far it seems perfect for what I need, minus the audio jack. I had to compromise on that. I also really like how I can change the display to portrait mode. Having a tall map instead of wide seems like a good option and I have a couple different options to mount it. I hope to put it to the test Saturday.

two_wheeled said:

Today I got a Garmin Nuvi 2597LMT ... So far it seems perfect for what I need, minus the audio jack.

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You might not need an audio jack in order to get voice navigation instructions delivered to your helmet.

The 2597 supports Bluetooth. Normally this is used to pair a phone with the device (when driving a car, for handsfree operation), but you might be able to pair a Bluetooth headset installed in your helmet to the device and get the voice prompts delivered to the helmet.

There have been some good reviews published here in the forum about the Sena SMH-5 helmet headset. I own one and I am happy with it, plus, it's relatively inexpensive for a helmet headset.

I don't know whether or not the 2597 will support full pass-through from a phone to the GPS then to the headset (for making phone calls), but I think it will support pairing with a headset for the purpose of delivering navigation voice prompts. Do a function-test to be sure, though, before you lay out the $$ for the headset. You could accomplish that function test with any Bluetooth headset, it doesn't have to be the exact Sena model you test.

Michael

Great idea! Wouldn't that be cool if it were that easy? I'm not going to set my heart on it but I'll cross my fingers and try it.

CYYJ said:

, but you might be able to pair a Bluetooth headset installed in your helmet to the device and get the voice prompts delivered to the helmet.

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This is the primary reason to buy a Zumo. The current Nuvi line will not feed voice prompt directions out the Bluetooth.

two_wheeled said:

Thanks for all the input, everyone.

Today I got a Garmin Nuvi 2597LMT and the RAM mount for it as well. So far it seems perfect for what I need, minus the audio jack. I had to compromise on that. I also really like how I can change the display to portrait mode. Having a tall map instead of wide seems like a good option and I have a couple different options to mount it. I hope to put it to the test Saturday.

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I am very curious how your test turns out. Both with pairing that Nuvi with a phone and how well you can see the display in sunlight. Are you using earbuds that came with the phone? I cannot see my 2597 in sunlight without the glare shield (I made one myself out of 1000d cordura nylon I bought on eBay). Depending on the time of day and direction of travel, sometimes I can see nothing at all (sun over my shoulder is very bad for seeing the screen).

That's the one I did, the 2595. I got a factory refurbed one at Fry's for $129.
I've had it for three years.
I can actually hear the voice commands with my helmet and earplugs in at 60mph. So, an audio jack isn't a necessity for me..
It will run the battery down after about six hours with the screen at full brite even when plugged in.
You'll need a sunshade to block direct sunlight and to be able to run the screen at lower intensity.
Then battery life won't be an issue. That's my workaround.

A simple sunshade can be easily constructed from a plastic homework notebook (preferably black, costs about $1 or so and you can make two out of it) and a few strips of industrial strength velco. You can make it pretty much deep as you need it. I have reason to believe that these covers will stay in place at triple digit speeds - or so I've been told ... ;-)

Great idea with the sun shield. I'll definitely need one. The screen looks great when the sun's not on it.
With the sun even slightly on it, it's difficult to see but usually still readable. Also, if the sun is directly in front of me, my helmet reflects onto it and washes it out that way as well.
Also, the directions were off a few times.

I traveled ~600 miles yesterday and had a problem making routes. Is there an easier way to set cities as waypoints? It seems I have to go to submenus to find cities.

two_wheeled said:

Great idea with the sun shield. I'll definitely need one. The screen looks great when the sun's not on it.
With the sun even slightly on it, it's difficult to see but usually still readable. Also, if the sun is directly in front of me, my helmet reflects onto it and washes it out that way as well.
Also, the directions were off a few times.

I traveled ~600 miles yesterday and had a problem making routes. Is there an easier way to set cities as waypoints? It seems I have to go to submenus to find cities.

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Have you tried the voice commands? I've not used waypoints but if you say "Voice Command" a menu pops up. Repeat out loud one of the listed commands on the screen. After "Find an Address"
tell her where you want to go (so to speak) and she usually can find that address. Sometimes not, and you will be forced to type it in. Of course this tends to be a bit difficult at speed, but you should not be programming your GPS while moving.....