Clutch won't engage

sport_tourer said:

Reinstalling the water pump chain should NOT be a problem. You should be able to easily slip and L-shaped tool (bend a screwdrive if you must) to resintall the chain around the back of the clutch basket. Then install the the chain around the smaller water pump sprocket, and then install the sprocket with the chain already in place back into its little hole. And dont worry about the water pump chain slop....when u reinstall the front cover, you will actually be alignining/positioning the water pump sprocket, which will take up tension, and all will be fine. I was really worried about this when I had mine apart, but had some Honda mechanics tell me no sweat, just put it together.

To me, the hard part after removing the front cover and messing around in there is the reinstallation of the front cover itself. Everything esle should be easy.

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I wish the word easily was working for me! I have spend at least 15 minutes with the chain fished up to the top, but I cannot get enough slack to actually re-install the water pump drive gear. The lower chain run must be getting caught on some kind of protrusion.

For me the hardest part of this task is the the work position I am in. I don't have a cycle lift, so the bike is on the floor and I am bent over on my elderly knees and my back will only do this for so long before it cries 'uncle". Getting old is a bitch!

ccryder said:

Somewhere, sometime I seem to remember someone mentioning a "boss" that protrudes back behind the basket or such that likes to bind up that chain if it gets a chance. Before you remove the basket get a mirror for a look behind the basket. Wish I could find that note but I can't.

Good luck
Neil S.

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Thanks, I was also thinking about trying a mirror. Do auto part stores sell those little mirrors on a stick like the dentist uses? I have a dentist appointment on Aug. 7, maybe they will give me an old one.:

what's going on with this? You get it back together?

huxtablejones said:

what's going on with this? You get it back together?

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Enquiring minds would LOVE to know!

I put the new clutch in on Saturday and reinstalled the bodywork Sunday. Bike runs fine now, clutch works great, I even lugged it down in 5th gear and had no slippage. I've attached some pictures showing the clutch basket tool I made to hold the basket while tightening the basket bolt. I tried to buy the correct tool from Service Honda, but they responded with "THE FOLLOWING PART WAS NOT INCLUDED IN THIS PARTS ORDER: WE DO NOT SELL TOOLS.".
There is also a picture comparing the old and new clutch springs.

I am convinced the the abuse I did to the clutch late in June while stuck in Illinois Tollway backups is what caused the failure. Both the inner and outer clutch baskets appear to have baked on oil on their outer surfaces, I assume that oil splashing on the overheated metal burnt and produced the residue.

Glad to read you're back on the road.... good job & thanks for sharing.

One thing I could not find in the service manual was the torque values for the clutch cover. I finally decided on 10 newtons as a safe torque value.

When ordering parts, I failed to order a new o-ring gasket for the water pump cover. It wasn't until I was putting it back together that the service manual refers you back to chapter 4 and the reinstall of the water pump cover. Thats where they say to replace the big o-ring type gasket. I was ready to finish this repair and was not about to wait another week on parts. I sure hope the gasket holds; if it does leak, that gasket is a fairly easy replacement.

alan said:

I put the new clutch in on Saturday and reinstalled the bodywork Sunday. Bike runs fine now, clutch works great, I even lugged it down in 5th gear and had no slippage. I've attached some pictures showing the clutch basket tool I made to hold the basket while tightening the basket bolt. I tried to buy the correct tool from Service Honda, but they responded with "THE FOLLOWING PART WAS NOT INCLUDED IN THIS PARTS ORDER: WE DO NOT SELL TOOLS.".
There is also a picture comparing the old and new clutch springs.

I am convinced the the abuse I did to the clutch late in June while stuck in Illinois Tollway backups is what caused the failure. Both the inner and outer clutch baskets appear to have baked on oil on their outer surfaces, I assume that oil splashing on the overheated metal burnt and produced the residue.

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That's awesome man - I'd have bet my arse it wasn't that :bow1: :bow1:

that's why I'm a computer nerd and not a motorcycle mechanic

A few more pictures as the project moved along. The first two show how the waterpump drive chain fell down behind the clutch basket. The space between the back of the clutch basket and those bolts holding the drive bearing is extremely close. Murphy's Law allowed the chain to slip down and off of the sprocket, but I spent a lot of time trying to finagle the chain back up without any luck. So I had to remove the clutch basket just to remount the chain. The third picture shows the waterpump drive chain correctly installed. Now that I have experience doing this, I know when pulling the clutch cover to just pull the cover a little bit and then get a finger or two behind the cover and make sure the waterpump drive stays in the engine block and does not pull out with the cover. If you do have to pull the clutch basket, be sure to order a new 25mm nut that holds the clutch basket.

The last picture shows the back of the clutch basket with the baked and caramelized oil on it.

I enjoy working on engines and found this to be an interesting job and I like to know what the inside of my engine looks like. Except for the problems I had with the waterpump drive chain, this was a fairly simple procedure that only requires normal hand tools. Well within the capabilities of most decent home mechanics.

huxtablejones said:

That's awesome man - I'd have bet my arse it wasn't that :bow1: :bow1:

that's why I'm a computer nerd and not a motorcycle mechanic

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Hey, I'm a computer nerd myself, been a MVS systems programmer forever. Taking my engine apart is just having fun on my part.

Alan:
We ALL feel your pain and learn from it! Great job! Thanks for the education! Do you think sometime in the near future you could do a write up and consolidate this great info?
Neil S.

My ST1300A2 clutch fails routinely after about 20 minutes riding, then recovers after being shut down 30 minutes later when it has cooled down!
I haven't figured what the problem is, even after complete flush and refill with DOT4 fluid.
Any ideas would be appreciated, thanks.
Ross

rossjeal said:

My ST1300A2 clutch fails routinely after about 20 minutes riding, then recovers after being shut down 30 minutes later when it has cooled down!
I haven't figured what the problem is, even after complete flush and refill with DOT4 fluid.
Any ideas would be appreciated, thanks.
Ross

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You may need to replace your clutch slave cylinder #3 here http://www.cheapcycleparts.com/oemparts/a/hon/5053f133f870021c54be64a3/rear-crankcase-cover

I would make sure to bleed your clutch with new fluid first.

Ross you may just have a small bit of crud in the tiny bleed port in the master cylinder. With use, this could be accumulating pressure in the clutch line and preventing the springs from pressing the plates together enough to generate friction. A quick check would be to ride the bike until the clutch slip happens, and then break any pressure at the bleed nipple. If the clutch returns to normal operation immediately, then the return port is clogged.

If you open up the master and drain the fluid down, you will see a dumbell-shaped thin gauge insert that sits in the fluid intake and over the bleed port. You can prise that out of the way and inspect the bleed port. When you operate the lever, you should initially see a small spurt of fluid from the bleed port (that is why the metal cover is there, to stop brake fluid from squirting you/your bike). The bleed port should be clear and if not you might have to disassemble the master and clean it out.