ST1300 SS Brake Lines

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I'm considering replacing the stock brake lines with braided stainless brake hoses. Since nobody makes a complete set, I'll have to take off the existing ones and either measure them or send them to someone like Spiegler or Galfer to have a custom set made. (Spiegler responded promptly to my emailed inquiry, Galfer, not yet.)

My question: Does it make any sense to do just the front brake hoses? These are exposed and relatively easy to remove and replace. The rear hose is (I think, have not really investigated this thoroughly yet) buried and requires a whole lot more work to expose and then R & R. My thoughts are that since the system is linked, replacing only part of the system will let the OEM (rear) hoses still expand under braking pressure and any improvement that might be seen from the SS lines will be negated.

What do you think?

My motivation: I'm not dissatisfied with the brakes as they are, and I'm not a very aggressive sport rider. I do enjoy tinkering on the bike and I look at this like one more 'improvement' - why not? The bike sits in the garage all winter long, and I do whatever maintenance/upgrades then anyhow.
 

W0QNX

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Why not? Because why? The ST1300 has excellent brakes so why? why do you suppose nobody makes them after 13 years of ST1300's?

Sorry you started it when you asked "What do you think"?

Do as you please, post the results. I would rather strip the bike down and polish the frame to a mirror finish but truth is I hardly do much to it other than ride it hard and put it up wet. 8)
 
OP
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Why not? Because why? The ST1300 has excellent brakes so why? why do you suppose nobody makes them after 13 years of ST1300's?

Sorry you started it when you asked "What do you think"?

Do as you please, post the results. I would rather strip the bike down and polish the frame to a mirror finish but truth is I hardly do much to it other than ride it hard and put it up wet. 8)
I noticed a difference between before and after SS brake lines on my old Guzzi - well 2 of them. But those were 'old' technology bikes (well, maybe not so old). And someone who writes knowledgeably about his bike here said similar things about the feel of the brakes after installing SS lines.

My 'what do you think' question was intended to get opinions on what changing part of the system would yield. Tho I'm open to all comments.

Once upon a time, MCN was discussing the importance of having great brakes on a bike compared to just good brakes. Their point was if the excellent brakes stopped the bike one foot away from the car that turned in front of you, and the bike with only 'good' brakes took 5' farther to stop, which bike would you want to be on? My belief is that any advantage I can squeeze out of the bike is worth it, whether I use it or not. And while I usually clean my bike only once or twice a year, I do envy those compulsive fellows who ride immaculate bikes. Whatever floats your boat. Who is to say that you get more joy out of riding than someone who lavishes time cleaning his bike and enjoys the time spent doing that? I've never heard any of those guys complain about the time spent waxing and polishing.
 

SupraSabre

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If you have to send in the originals, why not pick a complete set up off ebay and send those in? That way you could still ride until you get them back and start swapping them out!
 
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Since nobody makes a complete set, I'll have to take off the existing ones and either measure them or send them to someone like Spiegler or Galfer to have a custom set made.
You don't need them exact, cut a piece of string or similar and tape it along the run of the lines for an approximate measurement. I'd estimate a bit long since you can't make them reach if they're too short, but a little long doesn't hurt anything. I can't answer your question about doing the rear with the front, it depends on how long the rear hose is and I don't have a ST1300 to know that distance. If its short then its probably not going to expand much anyway, so I wouldn't worry about it too much, but its your call.
 

T_C

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The fluid from the front lever/master cylinder does not go directly to the back. So not seeing them matter much.

But I would make sure my training and practice were fully qualified and up to speed before worrying about maxing the brake power. Realizing you need brakes, or avoiding the situation all together, before applying them early will be more effective then more grippy stoppers.
 

ST Gui

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My motivation: ... I do enjoy tinkering on the bike and I look at this like one more 'improvement' - why not?
Ok there's the "why". I look at the "why not" as rhetorical given his answer. He's not after maximum stopping power.

If it were me under the same conditions (which pretty much is me) I wouldn't bother. I think the ST's brakes are more than up to the task for our riding. A proper bleed is probably more effective than adding braided lines. Now if you like the looks then by all means do it. Nothing wrong with that.

Under those conditions I'd just to the front and the clutch to match. It's only money. Since most of the already effective braking is done with the front brakes I'd keep the rear stock. There'd be an improvement in the front and the rear would be pretty much the same. But I'm lazy and a little on the cheap side.

However would lightweight and/or non-aggressive riders appreciate or even detect the improvement? I don't think so. At least not under normal casual use. Done well I don't see a downside except for the hit on the wallet. I just think that for the vast majority of riders stainless steel braided lines are overkill.
 
OP
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If you have to send in the originals, why not pick a complete set up off ebay and send those in? That way you could still ride until you get them back and start swapping them out!
Thats a great idea!

Ok there's the "why". I look at the "why not" as rhetorical given his answer. He's not after maximum stopping power.

If it were me under the same conditions (which pretty much is me) I wouldn't bother. I think the ST's brakes are more than up to the task for our riding. A proper bleed is probably more effective than adding braided lines. Now if you like the looks then by all means do it. Nothing wrong with that.

Under those conditions I'd just to the front and the clutch to match. It's only money. Since most of the already effective braking is done with the front brakes I'd keep the rear stock. There'd be an improvement in the front and the rear would be pretty much the same. But I'm lazy and a little on the cheap side.

However would lightweight and/or non-aggressive riders appreciate or even detect the improvement? I don't think so. At least not under normal casual use. Done well I don't see a downside except for the hit on the wallet. I just think that for the vast majority of riders stainless steel braided lines are overkill.
I agree - every time I take the bike out on twisties I'm amazed at its capabilities, it is far more capable as a bike than I am as a rider. And I'm sure the brakes are more than adequate for all situations short of a season's campaign at the race track with an expert rider. In the end, the ABS probably removes much of the advantage of SS brake lines. There is no such thing as modulating the brake any more just below the grip of the tire on the road - just grab a fist full of brake in an emergency and steer straight. I too am cheap sometimes, but I've spent more money than I've needed too in the past when I was convinced that I was 'improving' some aspect of the bike.

Many of the farkles we put on our bikes are based on the belief that they will improve some facet of the bike's performance, or make things more convenient for us. And most of those changes are not evidence based decisions. I'm not sure that SS brake lines will improve anything for me - but i believe they might.
 

Steve398

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>>I'm considering replacing the stock brake lines with braided stainless brake hoses. Since nobody makes a complete set, I'll have to take off the existing ones and either measure them or send them to someone like Spiegler or Galfer to have a custom set made<<

I'd be tempted along with you... as I understand it the standard rubber hoses have a 'life' before they are liable to ballooning leading to increased lever movement and possible consequences. Because this will be a gradual process you probably won't notice any deterioration that does take place until it gets really bad.

The braided hose is a better alternative without doubt, but with HEL hoses @£499 they're pretty expensive to buy plus the additional cost of fitting. I have in the past replaced hoses on most of my bikes and would like to do it on my 2009 ST13, but suspect my wallet would probably go into immediate traumatic shock!
 
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In the end, the ABS probably removes much of the advantage of SS brake lines. There is no such thing as modulating the brake any more just below the grip of the tire on the road - just grab a fist full of brake in an emergency and steer straight.
The primary advantage of the braided lines is because they don't flex, you get more feel for exactly what the brakes are doing. You don't lose any feel from the flexing of the rubber hose, so you get better feedback over the entire range of braking power.
 

tjhiggin

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I'm considering replacing the stock brake lines with braided stainless brake hoses. Since nobody makes a complete set, I'll have to take off the existing ones and either measure them or send them to someone like Spiegler or Galfer to have a custom set made. (Spiegler responded promptly to my emailed inquiry, Galfer, not yet.)

What do you think?
I did this with my '83 KZ1100 a few years ago. I sent my old lines to Spiegler and in short order I had a new set. They fit perfectly and work great. I don't think you'll go wrong.
 
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