Water Pump Weep Hole Upgrade

Dave.David

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Check out this article if you have not yet seen it. It has some pretty good pictures and text. stupendous1300.blogspot.com
I just read that article, how important is that press in this case? Hoping the old fashioned way of slowly tapping seals and bearing in with a soft hammer and wood will do the trick. More time than money ya know.
 
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I just read that article, how important is that press in this case? Hoping the old fashioned way of slowly tapping seals and bearing in with a soft hammer and wood will do the trick. More time than money ya know.
No! don't use a hammer! The white seal is ceramic and can fracture and crack. I have replaced one on a 2012 model that the dealership replaced the water pump under warranty, and it was pouring coolant out while the guy was riding home. When I removed it, we found the white seal broken in pieces! A call to the shop confirmed my fear....we don't use a press, we just tap it in with a hammer!
I have known folks to go to harbor freight and purchase the larger arbor press, use it, then return it. Not saying you should do that, just some folks have.
But no, please don't hammer anything, as even a gentle tap can break them.
.02
 

Mellow

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+1 I've heard a press is really the way to go here... I don't know if you could somehow get close w/table vise and some other contraption... I was lucky and never had this item go out on my 2 STs.
 

Dave.David

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No! don't use a hammer! The white seal is ceramic and can fracture and crack. I have replaced one on a 2012 model that the dealership replaced the water pump under warranty, and it was pouring coolant out while the guy was riding home. When I removed it, we found the white seal broken in pieces! A call to the shop confirmed my fear....we don't use a press, we just tap it in with a hammer!
I have known folks to go to harbor freight and purchase the larger arbor press, use it, then return it. Not saying you should do that, just some folks have.
But no, please don't hammer anything, as even a gentle tap can break them.
.02
Thanks Igofar. What do you think about the impeller shaft being ok after a seal swap?
 
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This is all a big what if of course , original question was can I replace the seals while using the same impeller. My 1300 only has 27000 miles, I would like to think the impeller and bearing are in decent shape, and of course I would change if bad. So when I pry the white seal off the impeller can I assume that should not scratch the shaft on impeller?
I personally would not risk removing a part that bearing surfaces and seal surfaces ride on, and risk gouging/scratching the part. It would suck to spend the entire day scraping gaskets, pressing in parts, and putting it all back together, then find out you caused a bigger leak than before :rofl1:
I try to error on the side of safe and do the job right the first time, so I don't have to redo it all over again the second time...but that's just the OCD in me I guess.
I have several ceramic seals/bearings/props in my box of shame. If somebody wants to see up close photos of them after being removed send me a phone number and I'll text you some pictures.
Igofar
 

SupraSabre

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Thanks Igofar. What do you think about the impeller shaft being ok after a seal swap?
I think that's what he was trying to say all along... replace the impeller and at $35, it's cheap enough to make it worth while to change out.

Being cheap is usually more expensive in the long run, when you have to redo it because of a failed part you should have replaced in the first place!
 

Dave.David

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$35, wow. That's what I get for thinking stealer dealer prices, I was thinking $135. Plus a press I have not needed in the past.
 

SupraSabre

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$35, wow. That's what I get for thinking stealer dealer prices, I was thinking $135. Plus a press I have not needed in the past.
Well, adding a press to it, you are looking at around $135. Unless you can find someone with one...;)
 

Dave.David

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Mello, Igofar, SupraSabre, ddublin, and more, thank you for all the suport, time, and info all you guys give here on this site. Reminds me of days when mechanics would sit in front of many different bikes and talk shop (and B.S.) all day long. I miss that sometimes.
I will post that somewhere for all who support the riders here but I wanted first to say this to you special few that do this the most. Don't you guys have job's? LOL lol.
 

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Mello, Igofar, SupraSabre, ddublin, and more, thank you for all the suport, time, and info all you guys give here on this site. Reminds me of days when mechanics would sit in front of many different bikes and talk shop (and B.S.) all day long. I miss that sometimes.
I will post that somewhere for all who support the riders here but I wanted first to say this to you special few that do this the most. Don't you guys have job's? LOL lol.
Well, it's a virtual shop.. the but BS is real.. :eek: :rofl1:
 

SupraSabre

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Plus gaskets and coolant. Can coolant run into the oil, or, do I need oil?
You would be pulling off the front engine cover. The oil pan will be open to the elements...best to replace the oil.

Just be sure to understand the process of pulling that front cover... if you do it wrong, the sprocket to the water pump will come loose and the chain will drop behind the clutch, then you just created a new problem! :eek:4:

Go read up on it...a few times before attempting it!
 
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If anyone in my neck of the woods wants to do one, I have a press, and pretty much all the tools needed. I just want to watch and see how it's done. We'll make a party of it. (envisions a line of ST's in the driveway-looks fearfully at the beer stash....)
 
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Another water pump seal question

Unrelated to the weep hole upgrade, but concerns the water pump seals replacement:

After oily leakage from the weep hole I pulled off the front crankcase cover and took it, plus new oil and water seals to the dealer for assembly (I don't have a press and no desire to ruin a new seal). I assume they put it on correctly since I paid them good money.

My question for the assembled experts: how tight should the new seals be? I got the cover back with the seals installed and now it takes a significant amount of force to turn the water pump. I don't remember it requiring as much effort when I dropped it off (of course it was leaking then). Can anyone quantify how much torque it takes to spin the impeller? The finger scale is fine, I don't need actual numbers. I just don't want to reinstall the cover and rebuild the coolant system only to have to pull it off again. Thanks for the help.
 

SupraSabre

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They are a bit on the tight side. I would say, if it turns without feeling rough, you should be fine. Make sure you measure the back of the pump to the housing (check the book on where to measure , and make sure they got it right. When I had a shop do my '05's waterpump/bearing/seals. they didn't get the pump far enough in. 24mm is what I think it needs to be.

I just replaced the '04#2 with that cover I had intended for the 2010, so I could get the '04#2 back on the road.

I been riding it for several weeks now and it seems to be doing just fine. I still have a small leak someplace (it's not the seal, since the hose is going under the engine now ;). It's small enough, I'm not overly concerned with it just now. After June, I can tear into it and investigate more.
 

Dave.David

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Re: Another water pump seal question

Unrelated to the weep hole upgrade, but concerns the water pump seals replacement:

After oily leakage from the weep hole I pulled off the front crankcase cover and took it, plus new oil and water seals to the dealer for assembly (I don't have a press and no desire to ruin a new seal). I assume they put it on correctly since I paid them good money.

My question for the assembled experts: how tight should the new seals be? I got the cover back with the seals installed and now it takes a significant amount of force to turn the water pump. I don't remember it requiring as much effort when I dropped it off (of course it was leaking then). Can anyone quantify how much torque it takes to spin the impeller? The finger scale is fine, I don't need actual numbers. I just don't want to reinstall the cover and rebuild the coolant system only to have to pull it off again. Thanks for the help.
Part of the reason the pump is tight to turn is no oil on / under the seal. I'd add a drop of oil between the shaft and seal before playing with it , you don't want a tiny tear in the seal before you even get it on the bike.
 

T_C

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Re: Another water pump seal question

I'd add a drop of oil between the shaft and seal before playing with it , you don't want a tiny tear in the seal before you even get it on the bike.
Ceramic bearing/seal. If you tear it, it's broke, you are replacing it.
 
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Re: Another water pump seal question

Yeah, put some oil on the seal to protect it from damage, but whack the fragile ceramic bearing in with a hammer, that'll work :rofl1:
 
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