'04 1300 starting problems

Hey folks,
I've been having a starting issue for some time now that is hit and miss. I don't ride daily unless I'm on a m/c trip so typically she might not be started some times up to two weeks. The attached video shows the issue. The most recent attempt at solving the problem was disassembling the start switch housing and cleaned it and put a bit of die-electric grease in there. It's been almost 2 yrs and about 18k miles on this battery but the problem isn't new so I don't really think it's the battery.

Any thoughts?

https://youtu.be/l3yBpJQPaqo

Skip

Has it done it since you cleaned the switch?

If the side stand is down try retracting the stand to rule out the side stand interlock switch.

Something else to try is pulling in the clutch even though it is in neutral. If it starts it could be the neutral switch interlock.

Very common with Honda starter buttons... My valkyrie did that often.. spray some contact cleaner into the switch. On my Valk, you could hold the button down and then move your thumb up and down to wiggle it and it would start up. Nothing major.

drtyrrel said:

Has it done it since you cleaned the switch?

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Yes it has.

dduelin said:

If the side stand is down try retracting the stand to rule out the side stand interlock switch.

Something else to try is pulling in the clutch even though it is in neutral. If it starts it could be the neutral switch interlock.

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I'll try these suggestions out Dave. It may take some time though because some days she fires right up and other days it's like the video.

Mellow said:

Very common with Honda starter buttons... My valkyrie did that often.. spray some contact cleaner into the switch. On my Valk, you could hold the button down and then move your thumb up and down to wiggle it and it would start up. Nothing major.

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I have already cleaned it Mellow but it still does it. Since then unfortunately my Vista Cruise works poorly now also.

skipcurt said:

I have already cleaned it Mellow but it still does it.

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If you put dielectric grease in the switch, it isn't clean.

--Mark

Blrfl said:

If you put dielectric grease in the switch, it isn't clean.

--Mark

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Hmmm, I could've swore that I read to clean with contact cleaner and put a light coating of dielectric in there. You're saying clean it and leave it? Could that be the issue? Although it was doing it before I cleaned it so it still makes me think it's something else.

Skip

If you were having problems before, there's probably something else going on, but greasing the switch contacts isn't going to help. A dielectric is an insulator. The grease gets used on some connectors where the action of mating them scrapes the grease away. That leaves clean metal for the contact to happen and leaves a barrier to keep air and moisture away. Switches don't quite work the same way.

In your case, I'd have a look at the starter solenoid (relay). It might be that the starter switch is fine and several on/off cycles are jiggling the solenoid into submission when it's cold. Look for 12V on the coil side first (when you press the starter) and then on the contact side that feeds the starter.

--Mark

The switches when they come out of the factory have some type of grease on them and the act of using contact cleaners to clean and flush out the switches removes the grease leaving the bare metal open to corrosion. I've taken mine apart and cleaned them up and then apply a small amount of dielectric to the contact surfaces (and sliding surfaces in the turn signal switch). Too much is not a good thing but none is not good either.

You can get a switch cleaner/lubricant from a number of sources. Caig deoxit is one line of them.
A plastic safe version of contact cleaner can be found in most auto parts stores.

Silicone grease in switch contacts under the right conditions can form silicon carbide.

I'll have to keep my eye on this thread because my 2004 has started doing the same thing, usually firing up after the second press of the starter button. I do notice that the switch itself is somewhat sticky and I plan on going in there to investigate soon...

So yesterday I received a call from Larry, aka Igofar to discuss this nuisance of a problem. He gave me several things to do and look for so last night I spent a few hours tackling these suggestions.
1- Clean and clean again both switch housings.
Did this and upon reassembling the starter switch was now sticking. After quite awhile messing with that and solving it I moved to the next suggestion.
2- Remove the driver seat and get under the tank to check the ground setup.
The group of green ground wires appeared to be good so I just slightly loosened the bolt and shifted/wiggled the wires to maybe make a clean(er) connection and tightened. If the problem persists it would be better to remove the tank and really get in there to check it. The bolt is a few inches ahead and above the crotch area of the front seat.
3- Check the yellow connector with the group of green wires behind the right (throttle side) headlight and slightly to the outside.
It appeared to also be fine. If the problem persists I will remove the tupperware and really take a good look at it and hit it with some air and disconnect and reconnect several times to possibly give it a better connection.
4- Check the main wiring harness behind the tupperware of the left (clutch side) middle cowl.
Didn't do this but like 2 & 3 if the problem persists I will go there.

This thread will likely be a long term thread as the initial problem being intermittent it may take awhile for it to reappear if it does. Hopefully it will not.

Many thanks to Igofar for reaching out and offering the suggestions. It's the people on this site that are willing to help with a problem when they haven't even met the person before. Larry, I hope you get a chance to make it over here to GA sometime soon. I really look forward to meeting you one day.

Skip

Skip, I had a similar problem with my '04 but on mine, the fuel pump never primed and the FI light never came on. It would crank but no fire. It started as intermittent and then quit altogether. I followed the service manual's troubleshooting and after tearing off all the tupperware and checking other things, it turned out to be the stop switch relay. Put a new relay in and all was well, so you might want to check all your relays to make sure they are working. Mine was visibly corroded so it was obvious which was bad. I wish I had checked that first but I was following the order in the service manual.

Good luck!

STumped said:

it turned out to be the stop switch relay. Put a new relay in and all was well,

Good luck!

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That's good to know Dave. I'm not experiencing that but I will certainly keep this thread in my "Subscribed" list. Might be one of those items I put on the shelf for when I do need it.

Thanks!

Skip

When it is acting up put your finger on the starter solenois body and see if you can feel it click. If you feel it click then you need to test for voltage drop across the relay when the button is pushed.

gsforster said:

When it is acting up put your finger on the starter solenois body and see if you can feel it click. If you feel it click then you need to test for voltage drop across the relay when the button is pushed.

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Thanks Geoff. Certainly another thing to look for if the problem persists. I will admit that I am electrically challenged so when/if it comes time to start checking volts and amps I will have to visit someone with better knowledge in that area.

Skip

skipcurt said:

I will admit that I am electrically challenged so when/if it comes time to start checking volts and amps I will have to visit someone with better knowledge in that area.

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It's refreshing when someone admits an area of knowledge not their particular strong point, and I really do respect that I hope you get it sorted out Skip.