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Thread: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

  1. #1
    mrflexicoil's Avatar
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    Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    My bike starts to runs rough after I have been on the road for about 1 hr. It runs like it got bad fuel or something. I looked in the service manual and it does not talk about a fuel filter anywhere in the system which I find strange but possible. I have not change air filters or spark plugs since I have owned the bike which is getting close to 40,000km ago. I am thinking that is a good place to start but was wondering if they was anything else I should be looking for.
    Last edited by mrflexicoil; 08-14-2017 at 09:00 PM. Reason: typo

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    FieSTa45's Avatar
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    Re: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    This could be the beginning of a fuel pump issue. What is the fuel gage telling you?

  3. #3
    John Heath jfheath's Avatar
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    Re: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    Fuel filter is buried inside the lower tank (under the seat). To get to it, you need to have an empty upper tank and as little fuel as possible in the lower. You need to buy the rubber gasket, new fuel joining pipe between the upper and lower tanks, along with the extremely strong, sprung hose clips. Oh and a new filter. Info is in section 5, page 56 in my workshop manual. Other manuals vary though.

    It happens after an hour ? Is that related to the level of the fuel in the tank or not ? Is your coolant OK - replaced recently and topped up - it could be heat related ?

    You say you have only ridden for 40 km since you got it ? Is that correct, or is it a typo ? What was done before you got the bike, or is that unknown.


    Anyway, if you think its a long time since the plugs and air filter were done, I would start with the plugs and the air filter. Give it a treat and put some good quality fully synth oil (check the rating for your temperature in Alberta) The Honda manuals are inconsistent in what they recommend, but there is a good diagram to show the range for 10W-30 and 10w-40 oils - and a new oil filter (Make sure you follow the guidelines in the owners manual for the spec of the oil). And then run through a couple of tanks with some better quality fuel (preferably not with ethanol - I find it makes the engine knock more readily) and put some fuel injector cleaner in the fuel for a couple of tanks.

    Try to have a long run, letting the engine spin up (as a police bike instructor once described it to me) - ie keep the revs up higher than you would normally, and if you can arrange for it to be with 'thick air' - cloud cover, early morning or later evening - that helps too. He told me to ride it in the 4000 to 5000 range for a while. I did this on the way home from spending a 2 day training course with him - after an hour the engine felt loose, easy to rev and responsive.

    The pre-2008 models seem to run leaner, or the engine management system isn't as good as the models since 2008. And this is going to sound odd, but it comes from a long time ST1300 rider and senior employee with UK Honda - and it seems to work.
    He said that if the bike is happily coasting along and there is very little change in the demand on the engine, then the engine management system seems stop monitoring everything as frequently. To wake it up, it needs some serious input - changes of revs.
    Now - whether or not this is true, I do not know, but I had a problem with my A6 which used to seem to stutter after riding on long open roads. Nothing doing much and then I'd want to accelerate away from a corner, and the power wasn't there.
    A few hard blips on the throttle and all was OK. In fact I kept the high revs up for a few seconds while pulling the clutch. And the problem would go away. I wondered if this was similar to the diagnostic test mentioned in the manual where it was necessary to run the engine at high-ish revs for a short while before doing a test. I know I have read it , but can't find it at the moment. 10 secs at 4000rpm rings a bell, but I wouldn't rely on that. Someone on here will know for sure.

  4. #4
    Site Supporter ToddC's Avatar
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    Re: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    If all the above fails....try cleaning the five way plastic t under the tank and airbox....
    Just my 2 cents...

    ToddC
    I Just wana Ride man, I just wana Ride!

  5. #5
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    Re: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    Quote Originally Posted by FieSTa45 View Post
    This could be the beginning of a fuel pump issue. What is the fuel gage telling you?
    It can be any where from full tank to almost empty

  6. #6
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    Re: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    I meant 40,000 kms. Just ordered plugs and air filters. I was looking in the service records previous owner had kept and it is time for a change. I will try these items first and see what happens. I don't like trying to many things at once because then you never know what the problem was

  7. #7
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    Re: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    I have replaced both the spark plugs and then the air filter and neither one fixed the problem. I now have replaced the fuel pressure regulator valve. Can you explain to me exactly what this does and how it does what it does? There is not much to the valve.
    Last edited by mrflexicoil; 09-15-2017 at 09:14 PM. Reason: spelling error

  8. #8
    This space for rent... Scooter's Avatar
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    Re: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    Quote Originally Posted by mrflexicoil View Post
    I have replaced both the spark plugs and then the air filter and neither one fixed the problem. I now have replaced the fuel pressure regulator valve. Can you explain to me exactly what this does and how it does what it does? There is not much to the valve.
    Why did you replace the pressure regulator valve? I second the previous suggestion and think that your fuel pump heading south. I highly doubt that you've got a clogged fuel filter. First off, there is a pre filter that the gas goes through before it even goes through the fuel pump and through the main filter. Second, if it was the cause, it wouldn't be time sensitive in nature like your problem is.

    Read through this thread. It's a little long but it was the original thread describing symptoms that in turn was found to have been caused by a bad fuel pump. See if there is any similar symptoms to what you are experiencing.

    BTW, there is no need to spend big money on a Honda replacement assembly. Equivalent pumps can be found on eBay or your local auto parts store.

    Another good thread detailing the process of changing the pump can be found here.

    Keep us posted...
    Scooter

    "When you are courting a nice girl an hour seems like a second. When you sit on a red-hot cinder a second seems like an hour. That's relativity." Albert Einstein

  9. #9

    Re: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    Before you start throwing money at it I have a couple questions.
    Has the FI light come on and thrown any codes?
    Like scooters comment, why did you replace the pressure regulator valve?
    The first thing(s) I would do, is to replace the plugs and air filter, and replace the vacuum lines and clean the 5 way tee out, and do a TB sync while your in there.
    Your Tee may be clogged, and after the bike runs a while, the clog starts breaking up and moving around, possibly causing your issues with the fuel injectors and lines.
    Have you tried running a couple ounces of Seafoam and MMO through the bike?
    A couple other things you may want to consider that nobody else has brought up, check the condition of your plug wires, caps, and coils? You may be having an electrical issue as it gets hot.
    Keep us posted on what you find.
    Igofar

  10. #10
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    Re: Runs Rough after an 1 hour on the road

    The pressure regulator valve was replaced at the suggestion of the tech at the dealer. As I was replacing it it took a quick look at the fuel and vacuum lines and did not see any bad cracks in any of those lines. I have had a 2 blick code come on and go off (which is related to the MAP sensor) but it has not been for a long time and is not currently on. The two blink code does not seem to have anything to do with the bad running because it does not appear at the same time as bad running and has not been on for most of the season and the bad running as been getting worse because now it seems to be doing it on shorter runs. I had it out last night after I put the FPRV in and it did right fine so I need to take it on a longer run to see what happens.
    I had it out for two hour ride tonight and it never missed a beat. Rode it through the speed range from just cruising to a bit above the legal limit and all was good. Still not going to say that the FPRV was the issue but we see if it ever returns. If it does the 5 way tee is the next point of attack. I seen that when I was in there to change the FPRV.
    I had the bike out last week on what was a 27 Celsius degree day and it started running rough again after 1.5 hours. Burns gas like crazy when it runs like that. Got to where I was going and had to fuel up to make it home. Ran great all the way home again but it had cooled off by then. Lifted the tank to get at the 5 way tee as has been suggested. There is really two 5 way tees under there. One that attaches to the top of the throttle body and one that goes to the EVAP canister from what the parts books shows. I took the one that goes to the throttle body(smaller of the two) out tonight and found nothing in there. No clogs as was suggested I would find. Will take the other one out tomorrow and see what I find there.

    Put the bike back together tonight and tried to start it but no luck. Did not even fire. Turns over fine but no life in it. Did get the FI light on now and I counted 5 blinks. One long light and then 5 after that. I check the service manual and 5 blinks does not exist from what I can see but I thought I have seen something on the forum about that but have not found it yet.

    Finally got time to get back on the project. I took it all apart to get back at the 5 way tee that I had cleaned and inspected. When I was doing that I had removed the fuel injector power leads and either missed put # 4 on or did not get it on properly. Either way there it was not connected at all which I think explains the 5 blink code that I got. To me 5 blink mean the ECU is really not happy and needs a reset of the ECU. Was able to get it reset which can be a little tricky for first timers but it can be done. That process seem to be timing thing as far as doing everything in just the right time frame. To fast and it does not register too slow same result. Got it reset and put back together and it started like it always does. Still not sure if the problem is solved but I am running out of weather to do any more test runs and I have not found knobbing tire for winter roads.
    Last edited by mrflexicoil; 10-20-2017 at 09:23 PM. Reason: udpate progress on problem

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