Garmin: Navigate to pre-planned route?

EASt

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It's been a long time since I used my Zumo. I used to create a route in Basecamp with all my chosen turns, stops, and things to see. I'd upload it to the Zumo, and then call up the route while underway.

"Navigate to route?" the Zumo would ask. I would agree and would get directions to the nearest place to join my plotted route.

Now, though...

My S1000XR came with a Garmin Navigator V. Same software, but newer and seemingly more complicated.

I plotted a route in Basecamp across Wisconsin. As soon as I crossed the border, I called up my loaded route.

However, instead of navigating to my route, the unit would just create a new route to the final destination of my planned route instead. :confused:

I called it up time and again, but the only thing the Garmin would do would be to consider my end destination and calculate new routes.

Can anyone tell me how to navigate using my pre-planned route, and prevent the GPS from making an entirely new route instead?

Thanks.
 

skipcurt

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This may be a dumb question but do you have a starting waypoint and an ending waypoint only or do you have those two with a bunch of waypoints in between? If the answer is the latter than I don't know the answer.

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Gerhard

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Mine will ask me at which way point to start the route. When I first started using Basecamp I would try to start at the hotel or where I was staying and I found that it was better to start the trip a few miles down the road. The other thing I have found is that just because Basecamp calculates the route a certain way doesn't mean that the Nav V will calculate the route the same way. The only way to force the Nav to calculate the route the same way is to include enough way points.

Gerhard
 

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Is there a setting in the GarminV to turn off auto-recalculate? There is in some other Garmins.
 
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Gerhard is right. Different model Zumos calculate the route differently. A problem is that some models have a limit to the number of waypoints. When I load a route to my Zumo, it shows up in saved routes, and yes, depending on your saved presets - avoid tolls, fastest way, shortest way, it may or may not follow your original route. You will have to experiment - but start out using a lot of waypoints since the device is supposed to hit each and every one of them.
 

jfheath

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Can anyone tell me how to navigate using my pre-planned route, and prevent the GPS from making an entirely new route instead?
Yes, probably - but I'd need to know which model of Zumo you are using. It makes a big difference to how the unit behaves.

I back up Gerhard and SMSW in their assertions that different Zumos will calculate routes differently. I will add to this and say that different Zumos treat the points on your route differently, and to make things even more interesting, the same model Zumo will calculate the same route differently. This is because some of the later models build up a profile of how you ride - and it plots a route accordingly.

Also - Basecamp and Zumo interact extremely well - but you have to know how to stop the Zumo from recalculating your carefully created route.

I have a whole load of answers about Zumos 550 series, 660 series and 590 series, but for them to be relevant to your questions, I'd need to know which model you have.
 

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Its the BMW Nav v you might hit up Bones he has a BMW nav unit not sure which one he may be able to help you.
 

Gerhard

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The Nav V is basically a 590 in a different package, it has some different points of interest pre programmed basically the North American BMW dealer network.
 

jfheath

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Cheers T_C - the info I was after was in the original post. You may want to consider the help provided here given that the author (me) doesn't seem to be able to read !

Ok - first off - I have never had my hands on the Navigator, but I've downloaded the manual (which is pretty useless in my opinion), and I've looked at a few videos to get the idea of what it looks like when in use.

It has the Trip App feature - which is common to the later Zumo models - eg 390 / 590 / 595 - the Zumos that were introduced after the demise of the 660 - and I am very familiar with the way in which that works.

I'm guessing that the OP - EASt - previously owned a unit like the 660 as he described the Navigate to the route feature.

First though lets get the terminology sorted out. Many people use the incorrect terms in attempting to help others - and this can become rather confusing. It isn't their fault. Garmin have seemed to change their usage of certain terms in successive generations of the Zumos that I have owned. So here are the basics:

A WayPoint is a location that is stored in a database. It may have other info such as phone number and address associated with it. It may be something obtained from the Basecamp database or it may be a point that you have created yourself.

A route is a series of points which you intend to visit. A route always has a Start Point and an End Point. It may also have a number of Via Points and/or a number of Shaping Points.

I tend to refer to Shaping Points and Via Points collectively as routing points if I am not bothered about the distinction between them.

Via Points are points on your route which are what I consider to be 'must visit' locations. The satnav will alert you as you approach and again on arrival. It will then then continue navigation to the next routing point (Shaping or Via). The SatNav will always try to take you to the Via Point that you have included in the route. So if you accidentally plot it half a mile up a side road, it will forever navigate you back to that point - even if you are on the intended route after the Via Point. (This does not apply to the Zumo 660).

Shaping Points are also points that you intend to visit, but the satnav will not alert you as you approach them or when you arrive - although they do appear as a small circle on the displayed map. They are there simply to ensure that the satnav takes you through the point that you have plotted. The satnav will attempt to take you back to a Shaping Point if it is up a side road - but if you ignore the instructions and then join the plotted magenta route, it will carry on navigating you to the next point on the route.

Note that a route does not contain WayPoints as such. You can put any number of Waypoints (ie points taken from the database) into a route, but the satnav then treats them as either Shaping Points or Via Points. You can change any routing point to be a shaping or a via point - either in Basecamp or on the satnav itself.

There are other differences between Shaping and Via Points - but that's too much to put here. I have a link to an article for that level of detail - read on.

-------

Right - that's that bit out of the way. So you have a route and it consists of a start point and an end point, and maybe some routing points (via or shaping). It is planned on Basecamp and you download it to your Zumo. All is good.

It doesn't matter whether your Basecamp route and your satnav route are set to the same mode of transport. If all goes well with the transfer you will get the identical route in your satnav that you had on BaseCamp, no matter what the settings. If you don't then there is something wrong with the transfer process. Read the document provided in the link below and you will see my explanation.

There are a few gotchas to be aware of when transferring a rout to the satnav from BaseCamp.

1) You need to have the latest version of BaseCamp and the latest version of the software for your satnav.
2) You must have the same version of the map in use with BaseCamp and on your SatNav
3) You must have set the option not to recalculate the route when it is transferred from Basecamp

If any of the above conditions isn't met, then when the route is transferred to the satnav, the satnav will recalculate the route using its own internal settings. Should recalculation take place, then it is handy to have the route preferences on the satnav and in Basecamp to be the same. At least then you will get a similar route (but not identical) plotted. But if it recalculates the route, your original route is lost.

When you are navigating the route, if you deviate from the plotted magenta route that the satnav displays, then the satnav will recalculate the route from where you are now to the next routing point (shaping or via). To do this it will use its own internal routing preferences, losing the original route for that section. Once you get to the next routing point (via or shaping), the original route will be followed. You need to consider whether or not auto recalculate is on or off.

When you start a route, on a Gamin satnav that has the Trip Planner app, it asks where you want to go to next. If you have no shaping points or via points, then the one that is listed is the end point. (The start point is also available but it is usually scrolled off the top of the screen). If you select the end point as your next destination, then you are telling the satnav to make its own way there and ignore all of your routing from Basecamp. There may be intermediate points listed, but only Via points will appear, not shaping points. I am guessing that this is the issue that the original poster has (EASt).

The trick is to do with how you plan your route: Set the start point to be on the first main road that you will definitely be riding along. It might be 5 miles away. When asked where you want to go next, you make sure that you choose the start point 5 miles up the road. The satnav will find its own way there, and then take you on your intended route exactly as transferred from BaseCamp. This gives you the option of letting you deviate from the route that has been calculated (say) to avoid road works, and lets the satnav get you to your start point.

Ok that's enough - remember my recent experience of this is from the Trip Planner app on a Zumo 590 and 595. From what I have seen, the Nav V uses the same Trip Planner App - but there may be slight differences. However I think that there will be enough similarities to help find the problem. Certainly the manual uses the same terminology that I have described here.

The rather lengthy article that I wrote is here - Zumo Trip Planner and Basecamp - what goes wrong and why - The links is way down in Post #1. They are pdf files. I've posted the entire document, and also broken it into 3 smaller docs in case download is a problem.

I hope this helps - you'll be able to judge from the screen shots whether or not the info is relevant to the BMW Navigator V. I think much of it will be.

I also have a series of videos to describe the issues in getting the route from Basecamp and to illustrate the issues with Via and Shaping points. The links are on Page 26 of the pdf file.

Happy for you to PM me if you want further information. I spent hours on this thing trying to work out what it does - it is a completely different concept from the earlier 660.

I love that handlebar joystick that they have developed for the BMW Nav V.
 
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EASt

EASt

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The Nav V is basically a 590 in a different package, it has some different points of interest pre programmed basically the North American BMW dealer network.
Yes. This. To me, I just assumed it was an overpriced 590 with lifetime updates built in to the unit instead of requiring a subscription. :rolleyes:

I'm guessing that the OP - EASt - previously owned a unit like the 660 as he described the Navigate to the route feature.

There are a few gotchas to be aware of when transferring a rout to the satnav from BaseCamp.

1) You need to have the latest version of BaseCamp and the latest version of the software for your satnav.
2) You must have the same version of the map in use with BaseCamp and on your SatNav
3) You must have set the option not to recalculate the route when it is transferred from Basecamp

If any of the above conditions isn't met, then when the route is transferred to the satnav, the satnav will recalculate the route using its own internal settings. Should recalculation take place, then it is handy to have the route preferences on the satnav and in Basecamp to be the same. At least then you will get a similar route (but not identical) plotted. But if it recalculates the route, your original route is lost.

When you are navigating the route, if you deviate from the plotted magenta route that the satnav displays, then the satnav will recalculate the route from where you are now to the next routing point (shaping or via). To do this it will use its own internal routing preferences, losing the original route for that section. Once you get to the next routing point (via or shaping), the original route will be followed. You need to consider whether or not auto recalculate is on or off.

When you start a route, on a Gamin satnav that has the Trip Planner app, it asks where you want to go to next. If you have no shaping points or via points, then the one that is listed is the end point. (The start point is also available but it is usually scrolled off the top of the screen). If you select the end point as your next destination, then you are telling the satnav to make its own way there and ignore all of your routing from Basecamp. There may be intermediate points listed, but only Via points will appear, not shaping points. I am guessing that this is the issue that the original poster has (EASt).

The trick is to do with how you plan your route: Set the start point to be on the first main road that you will definitely be riding along. It might be 5 miles away. When asked where you want to go next, you make sure that you choose the start point 5 miles up the road. The satnav will find its own way there, and then take you on your intended route exactly as transferred from BaseCamp. This gives you the option of letting you deviate from the route that has been calculated (say) to avoid road works, and lets the satnav get you to your start point.

Ok that's enough - remember my recent experience of this is from the Trip Planner app on a Zumo 590 and 595. From what I have seen, the Nav V uses the same Trip Planner App - but there may be slight differences. However I think that there will be enough similarities to help find the problem. Certainly the manual uses the same terminology that I have described here.

The rather lengthy article that I wrote is here - Zumo Trip Planner and Basecamp - what goes wrong and why - The links is way down in Post #1. They are pdf files. I've posted the entire document, and also broken it into 3 smaller docs in case download is a problem.

I hope this helps - you'll be able to judge from the screen shots whether or not the info is relevant to the BMW Navigator V. I think much of it will be.

I also have a series of videos to describe the issues in getting the route from Basecamp and to illustrate the issues with Via and Shaping points. The links are on Page 26 of the pdf file.

Happy for you to PM me if you want further information. I spent hours on this thing trying to work out what it does - it is a completely different concept from the earlier 660.

I love that handlebar joystick that they have developed for the BMW Nav V.
Although I've trimmed your response a bit, this is a wonderfully thorough explanation. My first reaction is a failure to comply with option 3 (avoid recalculation). As you said, the instructions with the unit are useless, and will require some old fashioned burrowing into the unit to find this setting. Hopefully it's with in the "Apps" section.

Thank you all so much for your consideration on this. My previous unit was a 550, and as frustrating as it was, it did force me to learn the unit fairly deeply. Perhaps I'll just need more time on this Navigator V.
 

jfheath

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Although I've trimmed your response a bit, this is a wonderfully thorough explanation. My first reaction is a failure to comply with option 3 (avoid recalculation). As you said, the instructions with the unit are useless, and will require some old fashioned burrowing into the unit to find this setting. Hopefully it's with in the "Apps" section.
Thank you. Glad it fits in with the Nav V. If you haven't already, get the pdf. I give illustrations and recommendations, and cover the things to make sure you don't accidentally get the unit to recalculate. I also gives tips on building routes and how to keep them consistent with the Basecamp plan, and go into which files to keep / delete in order to get rid of old favourites and such like. This may translate also translate to the Nav V.

One of the settings to prevent recalculation when transferring is within BaseCamp itself. Again - details are in the pdf, page 13. On the PC this is in the Edit / Options / Device Transfer menu. There are two tick boxes under Transferring Routes, both of which should be unticked.
 
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sky.high

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I have a Zumo 660 and the only way I've managed to do this is by importing the GPX track as an off road route, display the route and follow the line on the moving map, off course the GPS does not give any turn notification or lane guidance but it never recalculates lol.

I'd love it to be otherwise but I also don't want to spend hours placing sufficient way points to keep it on track or have it announce a way point every few minutes whilst on route. Maybe when this unit dies I'll find one that actual does what I want it to, I have to say its pretty disappointing to be using an expensive unit in such a basic way.
 

jfheath

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I have a Zumo 660 and the only way I've managed to do this is by importing the GPX track as an off road route, display the route and follow the line on the moving map, off course the GPS does not give any turn notification or lane guidance but it never recalculates lol.

I'd love it to be otherwise but I also don't want to spend hours placing sufficient way points to keep it on track or have it announce a way point every few minutes whilst on route. Maybe when this unit dies I'll find one that actual does what I want it to, I have to say its pretty disappointing to be using an expensive unit in such a basic way.
I find the logic in the Zumo 660 to be quite predictable - or at least I did once I had spent some time working out what it does and when.

I reckon that most problems with routing come from plotting routes on 3rd party applications rather than using Garmin's Basecamp or Mapsource. Both of these applications transmit hundreds of invisible 'ghost points' in order to ensure that the route is transferred precisely. This doesn't happen when importing just the GPX points. It is up to the satnav to calculate a route. Because the GPS points may be considered by the Zumo to be off route (slight differences in the maps used), when you ride past them, the satnav may end up re-calculating the route. In some cases, it is the entire route that gets recalculated as the software may not recognise the GPX points as valid via points or shaping points which effectively break the route up into sections.

At the time that the 660 was the top of the range motorcycle satnav, it seems that Garmin didn't have the same definition of things like shaping points and via points - the Zumo 660 refers to any intermediate routing point as a Via Point.

I wrote an article for our club magazine, many of whom had the Zumo 660, and who complained that it didn't work properly. It was my attempt to put them on the right track (sic). PM me an email address if you would like it. I won't post it on here as it is now out of date - mainly due to the clearer use of some of the terms, and the fact it relates mainly to the Zumo 660. But if you would like a copy, PM me an email address. It is a pdf file, 940K which should be OK for most email servers to handle.
 
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EASt

EASt

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I'd mark this thread "solved".

I highly recommend downloading Mr. Heath's wonderful PDF in it's entirety. I printed it, brewed a pot of coffee and grabbed a highlighting pen.

It is now littered with notes and important sentences. It has coffee stains on it. But, it is well digested and I've had a moment of clarity.

Ultimately, the logic and setup of the newer Garmin Zumos (including the BMW Navigators), is vastly different from the original Zumo line, and with no official documentation, John's PDF is gospel.

:beer3:
 
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