Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip.

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

It's not an engine or charging problem, in fact it started and ran about 15 seconds before it quit due to something with the ignition key. Maybe the last 10 times I turned the key to the on position, I noticed the lights would go out, a jiggle of the key and the lights would come back on. If it helps you point to something, I have a relay to a Blue Sea 6 fuse buss that isn't even getting power, when it normally does with the key in the on position. So somewhere from turning the key on, to how the juice gets to relay and I'm able to see the neutral light, side stand down light and turn the engine over there is something wrong with it. I'll be working on it at my end.

CYYJ · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

moddy said:
...a jiggle of the key and the lights would come back on.

That observation suggests that the problem is failure of the electrical switch assembly below the ignition key cylinder.

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

CYYJ said:
That observation suggests that the problem is failure of the electrical switch assembly below the ignition key cylinder.

I was just in there 10 minutes ago cleaning the leads replacing the spring and putting it back together. My clock goes out when I turn it to the on position but any other lights or the relay is not getting electricity somehow.

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

Whoa that's promising! I turned the bars all the way to the right and now the electric comes on. I'll just begin working backwards from there.

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

I have been using a silicone spray to lubricate the lock in the last 5 years I've owned it and may not have used it soon enough and gunk built up. There is an up and down mechanism that works within the lock as you turn it from the locked position to the on position. If that doesn't push down and come all the way up it will not make the contact. I found with subsequent lubrication and working the key that it's getting more consistent and working better.

CYYJ · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

moddy said:
Whoa that's promising! I turned the bars all the way to the right and now the electric comes on.

Uh, to my mind, that is NOT good news. It's possible that when you turn the bars all the way to one direction, that tugs on a loose connection at the ignition switch, but it is also possible that you have an intermittent connection somewhere in the wiring harness that originates at the ignition switch.

I would be very reluctant to head out on a 1700 mile trip with that intermittent condition present. If it changes from intermittent to 'continuously not working', you will find yourself stuck at the side of a road somewhere, needing a tow to get the bike off the road, and needing to arrange shipping to get the bike back home. Those two activities will create a big hole in your wallet.

I don't know what the construction of the ignition switch is - whether it is possible to purchase and easily install a new electrical switch assembly below the key cylinder (in other words, I don't know if the electrical switch assembly just has one or two connectors that you remove and re-connect to install a new switch), but my suggestion would be that you replace the electrical portion of the ignition switch, then see if that solves the problem 100%. If it does, great, head out on your ride. If you still have intermittent problems, then you will need to find the intermittent wire downstream of the ignition switch.

The fact that turning the bars solves the problem rules out a defective component (such as a relay) further downstream of the ignition switch.

Michael

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

CYYJ said:
Uh, to my mind, that is NOT good news. It's possible that when you turn the bars all the way to one direction, that tugs on a loose connection at the ignition switch, but it is also possible that you have an intermittent connection somewhere in the wiring harness that originates at the ignition switch.

I would be very reluctant to head out on a 1700 mile trip with that intermittent condition present. If it changes from intermittent to 'continuously not working', you will find yourself stuck at the side of a road somewhere, needing a tow to get the bike off the road, and needing to arrange shipping to get the bike back home. Those two activities will create a big hole in your wallet.

I don't know what the construction of the ignition switch is - whether it is possible to purchase and easily install a new electrical switch assembly below the key cylinder (in other words, I don't know if the electrical switch assembly just has one or two connectors that you remove and re-connect to install a new switch), but my suggestion would be that you replace the electrical portion of the ignition switch, then see if that solves the problem 100%. If it does, great, head out on your ride. If you still have intermittent problems, then you will need to find the intermittent wire downstream of the ignition switch.

The fact that turning the bars solves the problem rules out a defective component (such as a relay) further downstream of the ignition switch.

Michael

I hear everything you're saying. Right now, thinking I was about to start this thing having a pretty constant electrical connection just showed as soon as I tried to start it went dead again without moving the key I really don't understand. It could to the starter relay or the starter itself. It's just weird.

Mcreviver · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

You might find a wire inside the harness where it has to bend when you steer it has failed.

Uncle Phil · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

Just to eliminate the obvious, check your battery connections and the 'red' relay connection that tends to overheat and melt over time.

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

Uncle Phil said:
Just to eliminate the obvious, check your battery connections and the 'red' relay connection that tends to overheat and melt over time.

Phil is that where the main fuse is under the left side panel?

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

With the ignition finally responding, in the 90% range of consistency, when I tried a test start, dead. There is charge in the battery, remember, I rode yesterday, it went dead.
Of the 3 wires that are soldered to disc at the bottom of the ignition, if the appropriate 2 of those wires are connected, the ignition turns on, I would bypass the ignition in a minute to see if the components of the ignition were at fault. That is of course after I check the red relay first.

GreenZR · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

Moddy, if I can find it, you are welcome to the ignition switch from my 1991 1100.

Gary.

Uncle Phil · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

moddy said:
Phil is that where the main fuse is under the left side panel?

Yes, it's just to the left and lower than the battery. The 'big' red wire connector has a history of getting hot and melting the plastic around the connections. But you won't see the 'melting' unless you disconnect it.

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

GreenZR said:
Moddy, if I can find it, you are welcome to the ignition switch from my 1991 1100.

Gary.

Thanks for the offer, that's what I had in mind with the email. I had my hand on that today but didn't look close enough at it, to need to pull it again. Hopefully that's it, I need to ride.

GreenZR · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

Moddy, if I can find it, you are welcome to the ignition switch from my 1991 1100.

Gary.

Got it.

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

Uncle Phil said:
Yes, it's just to the left and lower than the battery. The 'big' red wire connector has a history of getting hot and melting the plastic around the connections. But you won't see the 'melting' unless you disconnect it.

I'll be inspecting it closer tomorrow, fingers crossed.

Uncle Phil · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

I've got the instructions for the repair with pictures if you need them. If you do, just PM me your email addy and I'll send them in PDF form.

GreenZR · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

Uncle Phil said:
I've got the instructions for the repair with pictures if you need them. If you do, just PM me your email addy and I'll send them in PDF form.

PM will be sent in juST a few minutes, as I could use those pictures and instructions too!

Thanks, Gary.

moddy · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

Uncle Phil said:
I've got the instructions for the repair with pictures if you need them. If you do, just PM me your email addy and I'll send them in PDF form.

Let me run this one by you. Is that the gateway, when the ignition is turned that allows power from the battery to transverse through the rest of the electrical system?

John OoSTerhuis · Oct 28, 2017

Re: Bike won't start and it did yesterday. Leave in 5 days for a 1700 mile round trip

Hope this helps, Dave:
Ignition Switch Tune-Up ( ST1100 )
http://www.st-riders.net/coppermine/displayimage.php?album=38&pid=1139#top_display_media

Edit: just reread the last few posts. The main fuse Is part of the starter relay unit.

John

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