New Shinko 011 Verge Radials Installed

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Oct 9, 2009
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18
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union mo
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St 1300
I had 2 of them front shinko 011 tires Fail on me on my st1300.Will not use it again!! Big bubbles on tread, were only half worn
 

Andrew Shadow

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what your not taking into consideration is when the tire is starting to come to the end of its life, the tire is thinner, and more flexible, and has less strength and support on the side wall.
They can squirm around and start to leak in places that they didn’t in the beginning of their life.
I have seen this happen with several different brands of tires, and would not imply it was a Shinko brand tire problem only.
Well, you may be right Larry, because I can't find any leak elsewhere, twice now. However, I have checked for leaks around the bead several times with both tires and have not found any.

A worn tire in and of itself is not a cause for a bead leak in my opinion and experience. A tire won't leak around the bead seat simply because it is worn, regardless of how worn it is. There needs to be a cause for that leak. If normal tire wear is the cause it is unique to this tire and a problem with their design as I have never experienced or heard of a worn tire by itself being the cause for a bead leak without any other influencing factor.

Usually corrosion, dirt or bead damage is the cause of a bead leak. This not the case with either of these. I clean both the rim bead seat and the tire bead of the new tire at every tire install as a matter of course. After having this experience the first time, I examined the bead seat and the tire bead after removing the tire because I wanted to know the cause of the leak. I found nothing of concern or that would explain the leak. With the second set I was extra diligent in making sure that there was no contaminant in these two areas specifically because I did not find a leak the first time, and did not want a repeat of this scenario. When there is a leak that can not be found the bead seat area is the most likely suspect. Because of this I made sure that both the rim bead seat and the tire bead were spotless, and tire paste was used.

It is almost as if when the tire gets worn below a certain level the remaining rubber is just porous enough to allow air to escape. I hope not, because other than this problem I like these tires and the price is good.

Keep throwing ideas at me. I'll keep checking all suggestions to see if I can find a leak until the tire needs replacing. If it is something that can be checked only when the tire is removed, I will look for it then.
 
Joined
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Well, you may be right Larry, because I can't find any leak elsewhere, twice now. However, I have checked for leaks around the bead several times with both tires and have not found any.

A worn tire in and of itself is not a cause for a bead leak in my opinion and experience. A tire won't leak around the bead seat simply because it is worn, regardless of how worn it is. There needs to be a cause for that leak. If normal tire wear is the cause it is unique to this tire and a problem with their design as I have never experienced or heard of a worn tire by itself being the cause for a bead leak without any other influencing factor.

Usually corrosion, dirt or bead damage is the cause of a bead leak. This not the case with either of these. I clean both the rim bead seat and the tire bead of the new tire at every tire install as a matter of course. After having this experience the first time, I examined the bead seat and the tire bead after removing the tire because I wanted to know the cause of the leak. I found nothing of concern or that would explain the leak. With the second set I was extra diligent in making sure that there was no contaminant in these two areas specifically because I did not find a leak the first time, and did not want a repeat of this scenario. When there is a leak that can not be found the bead seat area is the most likely suspect. Because of this I made sure that both the rim bead seat and the tire bead were spotless, and tire paste was used.

It is almost as if when the tire gets worn below a certain level the remaining rubber is just porous enough to allow air to escape. I hope not, because other than this problem I like these tires and the price is good.

Keep throwing ideas at me. I'll keep checking all suggestions to see if I can find a leak until the tire needs replacing. If it is something that can be checked only when the tire is removed, I will look for it then.
Andrew, what method are you using to inspect/look for leaks with? Just curious.
Windex, dish soap & water, and spraying stuff like WD40 on the area will not always show leaks.
Go to the toy store and buy some miracle bubbles (not the cheap $1 store stuff as its mostly just water and soap) but the real thick syrupy stuff. When this stuff is used it will start blowing a big bubble up at the sign of any leak. Been using this stuff for life support and scuba stuff for years. It shows leaks where other methods show nothing etc.
I would also get a restaurant dish bussing tub and fill it with water, and wait several minutes at each section of tire submerged. Often it takes heat, movement, or time, for the bubbles to show.
How have you been checking your valves? Again, Metal or rubber? Have you been over tightening the schrader valves in an attempt to prevent leaks? this can cause leaks as well.
Replace the valve core EVERY time you change the tire.
Could your tire pressure gauge be off? Don't trust TPMS for fine adjustments, they are often only close.
I've seen lots of Metzeler tires develop leaks on track bikes as they started to wear.
I've only run 3 sets of Shinko's on MY ST with no issues, other than the balance issue of the stiff sidewall not seating correctly once, which was corrected and the problem went away after that.
I have installed MANY SETS of these tires for folks who brought them to me because of their cost, and nobody has come back and talked about air pressure issues.
Not defending the brand, just trying to figure out why your having issues, and trying to help.
Ride safe
 

dduelin

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When I worked in the trade we called them Stinkos because of problems with out of round examples and ones that took too much weight to balance. All brand tires can suffer from quality control issues but Shinkos had way too many issues so we quit stocking them. What do expect from a $100 tire?
 
Joined
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2007 Honda ST1300A
It’s common with all tires, that when they require too much weight to balance, it is almost always found that the rims were either not cleaned correctly, the shop cut corners and used windex or WD40 to mount it, or the guy mounting it didn’t take the time to break the bead and rotate the tire till balance was found.
A local Honda shop in my area installed a Michelin tire on an ST and balanced it, by adding 12 weights to one side of the rim! By putting 6 on the rim, then STACKING 6 more on top of those, then added 4 more on the other side of the rim!
Blamed the tire, blamed the rim, etc.
Once the weights were removed, and the bead broke, tire checked in a couple different locations, balance was found with 2 weights.
Usually the youngest guy in the shop mounts tires, and that is often when they are distracted by their phone, or they just don’t know how to do it, or don’t have the patience to do it correctly.
There are always several sides to the story.
 

dduelin

Tune my heart to sing Thy grace
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Our shop only had two techs. The junior one had 15 years experience and the senior 22. This was 5 years ago and both still work there.
 
Joined
Jan 8, 2011
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Arizona
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2007 Honda ST1300A
I've seen Techs with 20 years experience that were still too lazy, too stubborn, or just didn't care about doing the job correctly.
The Honda Master Tech with over 25 years at the same dealership that mounted the tire with 16 wheel weights was a perfect example of this.
And yes, this guy still works there also.
I get a lot of work on ST's that were serviced at this shop.
Did you ever think that maybe after 15 or 22 years, they were just miserable people who didn't enjoy doing their job anymore, or didn't care.
 

Andrew Shadow

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I use a commercial grade of leak check solution that is used in the aviation industry and not available retail. I can't think of the name right now and I am not near where it is. Never had a leak indication. On my ST100 that had a porous rim I was never able to find a leak either. I found that by having the rim and the tire X-rayed. The rim alloy was porous and bleeding off pressure ever so slightly over a wide area making it undetectable. I don't suspect that with this rim because this only started with the second Shinko and continued with the third. All of the tires that I ran previously, including the first Shinko, did not loose air so not likely that the rim is the problem.

Metal valves but I have checked the valve body and core several times and over long time intervals and no leaks appeared from them. The cores were replaced and rechecked- no leak found.

As for the accuracy of my gauge- it doesn't matter in this case. The salient point is that it is registering a loss of pressure. Whether the initial pressure and the pressure reading after the loss of air has occurred is accurate or not does change the fact that air pressure was lost. I see no loss of pressure in the rear tire with this same gauge.

Still a mystery to me. Maybe I should pay to have it filled with those big-ass nitrogen molocules- that'll stop the leak!
 
Joined
Jan 8, 2011
Messages
7,062
Location
Arizona
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2007 Honda ST1300A
Almost all tires leak to some small degree.
My wife’s brand new CRV’s left front tire was always tripping the TPMS about once a month and I could not find the leak to save my soul.
A tire guy told me to drive it until it got hot then he pulled it off and put it in the water tank etc.
“See no leaks, I tried that”, wait for it he said…
About 15 minutes later I saw a very small stream of air coming out of the side wall by the lettering.
He told me to just ignore it and add air once a month.
He said many brands of tires have these sneaky leaks and nobody ever knows about them, and just find they need to add air every few weeks or months etc.
NO tire will remain at the same psi setting after a month or so, which is why he pointed out that folks always have to add air every few months.
 
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