ECM FAILURE POLL AND DISCUSSION

[Bmacleod]

Why not swap in a late model ECU to an early model bike? It would require a new wire harness from a late model bike but I have no reason to believe that all the other sensors, components and connectors on the bikes are any different between the early models and the late models. Can anyone confirm this? I would think that should work. I have always figured if this issue ever struck me, that is the route I would at least try. Apparently the late model ecu's don't have this issue so you should be good for the rest of the life of the bike if that's the case. I see late model harnesses on eBay sometimes... I saw one the other day for 80 bucks plus shipping. This is also assuming availability of late model ecu's. I recall another thread where someone said that they could get one but it was on backorder... And pricey

 

[Mellow]

Why not swap in a late model ECU to an early model bike? It would require a new wire harness from a late model bike but I have no reason to believe that all the other sensors, components and connectors on the bikes are any different between the early models and the late models. Can anyone confirm this? I would think that should work. I have always figured if this issue ever struck me, that is the route I would at least try. Apparently the late model ecu's don't have this issue so you should be good for the rest of the life of the bike if that's the case. I see late model harnesses on eBay sometimes... I saw one the other day for 80 bucks plus shipping. This is also assuming availability of late model ecu's. I recall another thread where someone said that they could get one but it was on backorder... And pricey

The early 2002-2007 ECMs are physically different than the 2008 and newer ones.. There's a pic here somewhere.

 

[MidLife]

He doesn't list any Honda products:

https://www.ivansperformanceproducts.com/ecu.htm

Yvan did a lot of work for us trying to implement his FCE (Fuel Cut Eliminator) and sell it to Owners.

(FCE) Fuel Cut Eliminator for ST1300 - On-Off Throttle Issue Resolved | ST1300 Related

I just picked up my bike with Ivan's new fuel cut eliminator for the ST. Throttle response is flawless. I put 210 miles on the bike today under various riding conditions from high speed riding to traffic jams. The throttle now seems more like a rheostat connected to a electric motor than a...

www.st-owners.com

In the process, he became very familiar with the ST's ECU (even built his own harness to talk to it).

I was merely suggesting that if we end up having to go down the route v8-7 is talking about here

There are several stand alone computer options that would work .
I think a microsquirt or a megasquirt would be a good low cost option option .

and we need to consult with an expert with ST ECU knowledge for setting it up, Yvan might be such a resource.

 

[The Dan]

The early 2002-2007 ECMs are physically different than the 2008 and newer ones.. There's a pic here somewhere.

Are the 08 and newer not failing?

 

[MidLife]

The early 2002-2007 ECMs are physically different than the 2008 and newer ones.. There's a pic here somewhere.

I think this is why he indicates that we would have to work on the harness to adapt to the physically different ECU?

 

[Igofar]

Are the 08 and newer not failing?

I have seen a few 08 and newer PD bikes have them fail, but to be fair, they were on escort bikes that had a mess of jury rigged wiring which probably killed them.

 

[Igofar]

Here’s a thought nobody have mentioned, could folks be damaging the ECU themselves trying different attempts to fix the knock sensor codes?
Shorting wires, not disconnecting batteries etc.
It could have been a simple melted knock sensor wire repair, but their attempt to fix it incorrectly toasted the ECU.
Just thinking out loud here.

 

[Mellow]

Yeah, one reason why I had P and non-P bikes in the pole and 2008+ and pre 2008. To see if the different ECMs were better or not... obviously, 2008 and newer bikes are newer so if time is a factor it delays some of the numbers... also, I don't remember the sales numbers so perhaps pre 2008 bike sales were larger so more of them would fail, that's the assumption..

It's impossible to build a poll that covers more than a specific slice of info as everything starts skewing the numbers... but it's a start.

 

[Willsmotorcycle]

Common error(s):
Fi code 25 left knock sensor - Unfortunately we cannot repair this error
Fi code 26 right knock sensor - Unfortunately we cannot repair this error
We are able to copy keycodes if needed to other (second-hand) ECU

My research shows 2010 and up

High Performance ECU Flash Tuning Honda / BMW (Stage 2) [Motorbike ECU-Flash-3 (Stage 2)] - €354,55 : Carmo Electronics - Motorbike Electronics

Carmo Electronics High Performance ECU Flash Tuning Honda / BMW (Stage 2) [Motorbike ECU-Flash-3 (Stage 2)] - Indien u gebruik wenst te maken van een High Performance ECU Flash Honda / BMW passen wij onder andere de injectie en/of ontstekingsmappen aan. Hierbij richten wij ons op betere...

www.carmo.nl

High Performance ECU Flash Tuning Honda / BMW (Stage 2)

• Home
• Tuning
• Honda ECU-flash
• Motorcycles
• ST1300>2010
• High Performance ECU Flash Tuning Honda / BMW (Stage 2)

The following limiters can be adjusted or removed:
- Top speed limiter
- Rev limiter
- Limiters in specific gears
- Throttle valve limiter

The following fault codes can be removed:
- O2 sensor
- Exhaust valve servo motor
- Steering damper
- Closed Loop system
- PAIR / AIS Valve
- Knock sensor
- Other fault codes

 

[Mellow]

Here’s a thought nobody have mentioned, could folks be damaging the ECU themselves trying different attempts to fix the knock sensor codes?
Shorting wires, not disconnecting batteries etc.
It could have been a simple melted knock sensor wire repair, but their attempt to fix it incorrectly toasted the ECU.
Just thinking out loud here.

Impossible to prove or for anyone to admit to.. lol

Here's one... I did have to buy an ECM for my 2008 ABS... why? Lightning struck my house, took out strange things like the washing machine, not the dryer, an electric toothbrush but not the electric shaver on the same circuit.. it took out the bikes ECM because a battery tender was attached and even though it blew the fuse that had direct to the battery it must have jumped and hit the ECM via some other wire... I replaced it and it never had an issue after that. Lightning follows some interesting paths...

 

[Mellow]

My research shows 2010 and up

High Performance ECU Flash Tuning Honda / BMW (Stage 2) [Motorbike ECU-Flash-3 (Stage 2)] - €354,55 : Carmo Electronics - Motorbike Electronics

Carmo Electronics High Performance ECU Flash Tuning Honda / BMW (Stage 2) [Motorbike ECU-Flash-3 (Stage 2)] - Indien u gebruik wenst te maken van een High Performance ECU Flash Honda / BMW passen wij onder andere de injectie en/of ontstekingsmappen aan. Hierbij richten wij ons op betere...

www.carmo.nl

High Performance ECU Flash Tuning Honda / BMW (Stage 2)

• Home
• Tuning
• Honda ECU-flash
• Motorcycles
• ST1300>2010
• High Performance ECU Flash Tuning Honda / BMW (Stage 2)

The following limiters can be adjusted or removed:
- Top speed limiter
- Rev limiter
- Limiters in specific gears
- Throttle valve limiter

The following fault codes can be removed:
- O2 sensor
- Exhaust valve servo motor
- Steering damper
- Closed Loop system
- PAIR / AIS Valve
- Knock sensor
- Other fault codes

Check post 13

Common error(s):
Fi code 25 left knock sensor - Unfortunately we cannot repair this error
Fi code 26 right knock sensor - Unfortunately we cannot repair this error
We are able to copy keycodes if needed to other (second-hand) ECU

 

[Bmacleod]

The early 2002-2007 ECMs are physically different than the 2008 and newer ones.. There's a pic here somewhere.

That's why I mentioned changing the harness to a late model harness. That will overcome that physical difference. the only question that would remain then is if the late model harness will plug into the rest of the early model bike. I have no reason to believe it wouldn't, but I don't know that

 

[Mellow]

That's why I mentioned changing the harness to a late model harness. That will overcome that physical difference. the only question that would remain then is if the late model harness will plug into the rest of the early model bike. I have no reason to believe it wouldn't, but I don't know that

I get you... hmmm... seems like a maybe... I think the ABS module also changed... I think.. I don't know if individual sensors are different and ergo would or could send different data or voltage or whatever the sensor does...

 

[MidLife]

That's why I mentioned changing the harness to a late model harness. That will overcome that physical difference. the only question that would remain then is if the late model harness will plug into the rest of the early model bike. I have no reason to believe it wouldn't, but I don't know that

Or find somebody to make a short x-over harness for us.

 

[Bmacleod]

Yvan did a lot of work for us trying to implement his FCE (Fuel Cut Eliminator) and sell it to Owners.

(FCE) Fuel Cut Eliminator for ST1300 - On-Off Throttle Issue Resolved | ST1300 Related

I just picked up my bike with Ivan's new fuel cut eliminator for the ST. Throttle response is flawless. I put 210 miles on the bike today under various riding conditions from high speed riding to traffic jams. The throttle now seems more like a rheostat connected to a electric motor than a...

www.st-owners.com

In the process, he became very familiar with the ST's ECU (even built his own harness to talk to it).

I was merely suggesting that if we end up having to go down the route v8-7 is talking about here



and we need to consult with an expert with ST ECU knowledge for setting it up, Yvan might be such a resource.

The problem may be that even if you have a computer and an interface that could talk to the ECU, if there's a hardware failure, it has to be taken apart and a new component soldered in. I'm guessing that is the issue. The fact that these people that say they can fix ecu's, but state that they can't fix this issue tends to make me think it's a hardware issue.

 

[Bmacleod]

Or find somebody to make a short x-over harness for us.

It would require the plugs from a late harness to plug into the late ecu, but yes, one could either replace the entire harness, cut and splice/graft in the plugs from a late harness to the early harness or the proper way would be to remove the pins from the old plugs and put them into the new plugs but that would require very careful matching of the wires and pins to the proper port. The safest way would be to change the entire harness. That way you would know if you come across sensors or plugs that don't match up then you could simply swap the plugs or get proper sensors from a late model bike

 

[ASPC]

Many of us could repair these ECU's if it were not for the potting material. Our primary goal should be to find an appropriate solvent which at the same time will not dissolve the PCB and its components. If we can do that this would no longer be an issue.

 

[Bmacleod]

Many of us could repair these ECU's if it were not for the potting material. Our primary goal should be to find an appropriate solvent which at the same time will not dissolve the PCB and its components. If we can do that this would no longer be an issue.

I have removed potting material from a few different electronic components over the years. It's not overly hard but it's messy finicky work. My issue is how do you identify the defective component when you get the potting material off. If it's glaringly obvious like a burnt component then you're laughing, but if the component has failed inside with no evidence, that's where you need to be a computer wizard to figure it out, which I'm not.

 

[SupraSabre]

My

2012 ABS - 35K miles : no ECU Problem
2010 ABS - 100K miles : no ECU Problem
2004 Non ABS - 68K miles (I've put on 37K of those miles) : no ECU Problem
2004 Non ABS - 50K miles : no ECU Problem
2005 Non ABS - 174.3K miles : no ECU Problem

Not sure what all the fuss is about?

 

[MidLife]

The problem may be that even if you have a computer and an interface that could talk to the ECU, if there's a hardware failure, it has to be taken apart and a new component soldered in. I'm guessing that is the issue. The fact that these people that say they can fix ecu's, but state that they can't fix this issue tends to make me think it's a hardware issue.

Of course,

But what v8-7 suggested was to REPLACE the ECU with one of the standalone computers available today for that, like a microsquirt or a megasquirt. He was NOT talking about repairing the ECU.

His suggestion is for when there are no more ECUs to be found anywhere, to replace our defective, non-rpairable ones, so we have to come up with an alternate control unit.

If we have to go this route, we will still have to set up the replacement control unit, or even program it, and I only mentioned Yvan as somebody who might be able to help us emulate the ST ECU with such a computer, due to his extensive knowledge of the ST ECU derived from his work on a FCE solution.

Then again, there could be enough knowlege on this forum to tackle this without further help.