Just got a ST1300P/PA 2011 and I need help!!!

[Reckless]

I'm recently a new owner of an ex-cop ST1300 and I am having trouble with it starting. I know it can ground itself with all the different wires that get cut when they sell these. With that being said, I was looking for help starting with removing all things police wire harness. I have the service manual and will use the diagram. Just looking for easier visuals since I'm partially colorblind and this part ALWAYS sucks

Reply

 

[Ryan_B]

Uh-oh! Well, definitely not an expert, but I do have one that was never commissioned that I can look at to compare if needed. Just FYI, the de-commissioned police cruisers are generally pretty abused. Some on here have PTSD from working on them, so if the responses seem short and to the point, it is just because they have seen all the problems before and you are digging up painful memories.

Can you be more descriptive of your starting problem? Is it cranking but not starting (fuel/spark problem), or is it not cranking at all?

Also, if you can list everything you have checked already, it will help eliminate guess work.

Thanks,
Ryan

 

[Reckless]

When I first looked it over, it cranked up no problem and I rode it a couple blocks no issues. I was trailering it back from Cali. We stopped in some nice weather, pulled it out and I rode for close to two hours no problem. Pulled over to talk to my friend and take a second and it wouldn't start after that. It will crank like everything mechanically is good. Initially it just sounded like the battery was dead, which makes sense if there's a bunch of cut wires exposed on the bike. Once I got it home it hasn't cranked and seems like the battery has been drained. I haven't charged the battery yet, but figured it would have the same shorting problem if I did only that. I want to remove all the unused police wire set up since I have no reason to have most of it. The strobe lights still work and I might be able to rewire the siren to a speaker for fun (no plan on using that feature on the public road) but all the wire connections for the red and blue lights that are no longer there and the hook ups for the radio I want to remove but don't want to mess up the main wiring of the bike. I haven't started pulling wires because I didn't want to pull the wrong ones. I've taken off the seat and the brackets to expose all the wires underneath and disconnected the battery. I'm basically at the beginning and ready to start pulling wires and fuses

 

[Ryan_B]

These batteries are somewhat notorious for being "just enough". If you pull over for 5 minutes and don't turn off the key/lights, it could be enough to discharge it and not allow it to restart. Having said that, cut/open wires are never a good thing and I agree that you should see about removing excess and possibly repair the main harness.

Near the tail section, under the radio bracket, there are several connections for the right hand switches and over mirror harnesses. I would start by disconnecting anything there (I believe it is 4 connectors). I don't have a picture handy since we had the site server crash recently, but it looks kind of like a softer plastic amber bell about 3" in diameter. Everything in there you should be able to unplug as it is not part of the "normal" harness (it is all additional wiring for the PA). This *SHOULD* disconnect any added accessories that run off the right hand switches. I say should, because if they hacked into a power wire somewhere else, you won't know unless you pull all the plastics and check for voltage on the cut wires.

After that, I would charge up your battery and see if it starts, once it starts I would verify voltage output ~13.5-14.5 to make sure you have a working alternator and then go from there. You might just have a weak battery.

Good luck! I am happy to provide pictures if needed, but there will be a delay.
Ryan

 

[Reckless]

Thank you for the encouragement! I will look at tackling those first when I get home! I did order a stronger battery, I was reading the battery could be a weak point with all the extra electrical. I'll get home later this afternoon and can take pictures of what I'm looking at. Thank you for your response man!

 

[Ryan_B]

I just re-read your description and you mentioned it was cranking and not starting initially and now the battery is dead. Let us know if it restarts with a fresh battery, if not - you will need to diagnose if it is a fuel or spark problem. The fuel gauge may not be working correctly and it may just be out of gas, but don't put more than a couple of cups of fuel into it to verify. You don't want a completely full tank if you need to get to the fuel pump.

If it does restart, I still think you might have a fuel delivery issue - if it shows up when the bike is hot again your tank might not be venting correctly. I believe a clogged charcoal canister can cause this (easy way to check is to open your fuel filler and see if it is under vacuum).

Just keep the information coming once you get a chance to look at it. Lots of knowledgeable folks on here that can help point you in the right direction.

Ryan

 

[JohnK]

Where in WA are you located? Im thinking of hosting a tech day in May - we could make it the subject bike for the day.

 

[SMSW]

Never leave a lead acid battery discharged. They really don't like that and a deep discharge can loosen sponge lead from the plates. Said pieces can sometimes fall between plates and short out a cell. Always best to charge a low battery asap.

 

[Reckless]

Where in WA are you located? Im thinking of hosting a tech day in May - we could make it the subject bike for the day.

I'm in Bremerton area, Kitsap County. I would love to learn more about this bike as I grow as a rider

 

[JohnK]

I'm in Bremerton area, Kitsap County. I would love to learn more about this bike as I grow as a rider

Pierce countyBonney Lake - whats the mileage on your bike? Post some pics etc. look for tech posts im doing a show of interest for May

 

[Bikeric]

Welcome to the forum from Cornwall UK. Good luck with your project, looks like you are getting lots of advice.

 

[leondante]

Hello. I am doing a wiring rebuilding thread soon, maybe a week or two ahead. Mine had all the engine harness burned down and had to make them again. Also I'm installing a GPS tracker, alarm, radar warning setup, heated grips and a couple more things. Maybe you could be interested in it.

For your bike, first thing, wires are just a piece of copper getting to other place. Is not a monster, do not be afraid of it, you can do it, it just need PATIENCE, a lot of it sometimes. Don't get dissapointed or down because of it, the solution is there and it's just a matter of work and some time.

I'm telling you what I would do first.

Some engines can crank and don't turn on because low voltage. It can be your situation.

Get that battery full loaded and try again, it sounds like a broken alternator to me at first "glance". Check out battery voltage with engine on, should be around 14, anything under 13 is bad. It can be under 13 V if you are not riding with lights ON, but it depends on a lot of things.

If it start good with a full battery, can be the alternator. BUT also it can be a bad battery. They last like 5 years, even if you are not using them. They degrade chemically in spite of they don't get bad as soon like when you are using them frequently.

As someone already said, can be a bad gas gauge. Check out if you really have gasoline. Also it can be a bad pump. I've had situations where pumps failed only when hot, after half an hour of use. THREE TIMES did I have this situation. Be aware not to start dissasembling stuff without checking that. Our gasoline pump it's a high pressure pump that's ON al the time when riding the bike. It gets broken like the consuming product it is. For last, if you have spark, good cranking and gas level, try the pump. Having low gas level so it doesn't get spilled, you can take the returning hose from the intake and see if it returns gas with good pressure. Also it can return gas but have no pressure, don't be fooled because of that, you need pressure for that in order to spray the gasoline properly.

I hope all this helps.

Also, it can be that the extra stuff of the wiring could be easily detected, I'm sure it's a paralel wiring, but I never touched something like yours and that should be taken in consideration. I would look for an extra big, long wiring harness just plugged in a couple places. THAT should be all those wirings you want to take out.

 

[tnbill]

I will give three words that has caused a lot of aggravation. Grounds grounds grounds!

 

[Reckless]

I just re-read your description and you mentioned it was cranking and not starting initially and now the battery is dead. Let us know if it restarts with a fresh battery, if not - you will need to diagnose if it is a fuel or spark problem. The fuel gauge may not be working correctly and it may just be out of gas, but don't put more than a couple of cups of fuel into it to verify. You don't want a completely full tank if you need to get to the fuel pump.

If it does restart, I still think you might have a fuel delivery issue - if it shows up when the bike is hot again your tank might not be venting correctly. I believe a clogged charcoal canister can cause this (easy way to check is to open your fuel filler and see if it is under vacuum).

Just keep the information coming once you get a chance to look at it. Lots of knowledgeable folks on here that can help point you in the right d

Hello. I am doing a wiring rebuilding thread soon, maybe a week or two ahead. Mine had all the engine harness burned down and had to make them again. Also I'm installing a GPS tracker, alarm, radar warning setup, heated grips and a couple more things. Maybe you could be interested in it.

For your bike, first thing, wires are just a piece of copper getting to other place. Is not a monster, do not be afraid of it, you can do it, it just need PATIENCE, a lot of it sometimes. Don't get dissapointed or down because of it, the solution is there and it's just a matter of work and some time.

I'm telling you what I would do first.

Some engines can crank and don't turn on because low voltage. It can be your situation.

Get that battery full loaded and try again, it sounds like a broken alternator to me at first "glance". Check out battery voltage with engine on, should be around 14, anything under 13 is bad. It can be under 13 V if you are not riding with lights ON, but it depends on a lot of things.

If it start good with a full battery, can be the alternator. BUT also it can be a bad battery. They last like 5 years, even if you are not using them. They degrade chemically in spite of they don't get bad as soon like when you are using them frequently.

As someone already said, can be a bad gas gauge. Check out if you really have gasoline. Also it can be a bad pump. I've had situations where pumps failed only when hot, after half an hour of use. THREE TIMES did I have this situation. Be aware not to start dissasembling stuff without checking that. Our gasoline pump it's a high pressure pump that's ON al the time when riding the bike. It gets broken like the consuming product it is. For last, if you have spark, good cranking and gas level, try the pump. Having low gas level so it doesn't get spilled, you can take the returning hose from the intake and see if it returns gas with good pressure. Also it can return gas but have no pressure, don't be fooled because of that, you need pressure for that in order to spray the gasoline properly.

I hope all this helps.

Also, it can be that the extra stuff of the wiring could be easily detected, I'm sure it's a paralel wiring, but I never touched something like yours and that should be taken in consideration. I would look for an extra big, long wiring harness just plugged in a couple places. THAT should be all those wirings you want to take out.

Yes I would be interested! I want to install some extra creature comforts later so absolutely!

 

[Reckless]

Pierce countyBonney Lake - whats the mileage on your bike? Post some pics etc. look for tech posts im doing a show of interest for May

It's about 22,000 miles here's some pics of the extra wiring at a glance. I did get a new battery just came in so I know it will crank over. I just want to eliminate the extra grounding potential while I'm here

 

[Andrew Shadow]

Personally, I wouldn't be in any rush to remove the extra wiring harnesses, switches, etc., that were added and are not part of what was delivered from the Honda factory. The extra wires and switches can turn out to be very useful later on if you decide to add any electrically powered accessories. I would definitely disconnect all of them to get back to the original Honda wiring configuration. This will give you a good baseline to start from to diagnose whatever problems are present. Once you have it all sorted out and running properly you can reattach as many of those wires and switches as you need for whatever accessories you decide to install. While doing that is the time to make sure that they are properly routed and connected to the proper power and ground sources to eliminate any future electrical problems caused by poor installation and/or removal methods.

 

[Reckless]

Personally, I wouldn't be in any rush to remove the extra wiring harnesses, switches, etc., that were added and are not part of what was delivered from the Honda factory. The extra wires and switches can turn out to be very useful later on if you decide to add any electrically powered accessories. I would definitely disconnect all of them to get back to the original Honda wiring configuration. This will give you a good baseline to start from to diagnose whatever problems are present. Once you have it all sorted out and running properly you can reattach as many of those wires and switches as you need for whatever accessories you decide to install. While doing that is the time to make sure that they are properly routed and connected to the proper power and ground sources to eliminate any future electrical problems caused by poor installation and/or removal methods.

That's basically what I'm trying to accomplish. I have a new battery and want to ensure the guts are solid. Then reintroduce that extra harness as other useful things (Nav,Radio, Radar, LED, ect)

 

[Ryan_B]

It's about 22,000 miles here's some pics of the extra wiring at a glance. I did get a new battery just came in so I know it will crank over. I just want to eliminate the extra grounding potential while I'm here

So, it is cranking but not starting? Can you hear the fuel pump turn on with key on, ignition on (should sound like a higher pitch "whir" for 3 seconds)? You can flip the kill switch back and forth to restart the fuel pump prime sequence, it should give you a 3 second whir each time.

Here are some pictures of how mine came stock (6 total connections in the tail piece). 4 wires are for the over the mirror lights, the other connection block is your switches on the right handle, and the last one is power/ground, etc., that I assume would got to a power distribution block - this is the ones I would disconnect and it should disconnect most (if not everything) that is extra on your bike:



Ryan

 

[Reckless]

She starts and runs!! I'm just worried about if those exposed wires causing a short....and those strobes, are they attached to that pin that I took out? Trying to give power to the strobe but not the sirens or anything else.

 

[leondante]

It's about 22,000 miles here's some pics of the extra wiring at a glance. I did get a new battery just came in so I know it will crank over. I just want to eliminate the extra grounding potential while I'm here

That's a stupid amount of extra wires. Pretty worse than I expected. If you take out the extra-useless extra-wiring the thing will get pretty neat.