Steering Head Grease Interval

lomita

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Having finished rebuilding the front forks, now is the time to re-grease the steering neck bearings, if needed. I have a 2001 with 26k miles. I'm sure the mileage is okay, however concerned the time interval, may have given the grease time to dry out. The swing test from side to side evidences no bearing wear.

What is the general consensus of relubing the neck bearings as regular maintenance, interval etc.?

Do the seals need replacing as part of the bearing lube maintenance?

Is there an upgrade to better bearings?

TIA
 
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Having finished rebuilding the front forks, now is the time to re-grease the steering neck bearings, if needed. I have a 2001 with 26k miles. I'm sure the mileage is okay, however concerned the time interval, may have given the grease time to dry out. The swing test from side to side evidences no bearing wear.

What is the general consensus of relubing the neck bearings as regular maintenance, interval etc.?

Do the seals need replacing as part of the bearing lube maintenance?

Is there an upgrade to better bearings?

TIA
Once you have it apart, you can better tell if those bearings are worn, but with that low mileage, I'd bet they are fine. I stripped the front end of my '96 when I bought it two years ago with 72,000 km on the clock and they were in good shape. Slathered the balls up with the Moly 60, which may or may not receive the approval of others here, but my thinking was, it is a high pressure lube and those balls do experience some high pressure hits on bumpy roads, so . . . that's what I went with. You would only be replacing seals if you were changing out the entire bearing sets.

You will need a special Honda tool to preload the bearings though and a good spring scale is handy to be sure you have that set correctly.
 
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There is the upgrade to tapered roller bearings, but if yours are good as is, I wouldn't go to that trouble. The steering head outer bearing races are pressed into place and difficult to remove and install without proper tools.
 
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It's worth greasing them with a good grease if they've never been done. If you use synthetic, you may never have to do them again. Moly is OK but overkill, those bearings will never generate any heat.
 
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lomita

lomita

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So, due to the difficulty factors, if the bearings are good, just slap some fresh grease down the steering neck?
 

John OoSTerhuis

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Do you want to borrow the STOC steering stem races/bearings R&R tool kit? Makes that job a snap.

Just now reading your forks thread, the STOC loaner tools kit for that job would have saved you a bit of your reported difficulties. I do that job solo with the right tools.

John
 
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So, due to the difficulty factors, if the bearings are good, just slap some fresh grease down the steering neck?
only if you want to make a mess. The grease you throw down there won't end up anywhere its needed anyway. If you want to pull the top triple clamp and grease the top bearings, that's not a lot of work, but the lower bearings would require your pulling the entire triple clamp out of the stem. My guess is you're overthinking it, just leave it alone and go ride. Bill Clinton was pres the last time I greased mine, and I have 4x the mileage yours has.
 
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So, due to the difficulty factors, if the bearings are good, just slap some fresh grease down the steering neck?
The bearings are sealed top and bottom to keep out water, so not sure how you could get grease to them without disassembly. The steering stem is hollow top to bottom, so adding grease to that won't achieve anything at all.

You'd need to remove the top nut, loosen the top triple and slide it up off the stem, undo the locknuts for the bearing, then lift the top bearing out for greasing. Then lower the forks/lower triple enough to get to the lower bearing; these would probably need to drop down by 30mm or so. It would be easier at that point to have removed the forks completely and then the lower triple and stem can be pulled right out.
 
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lomita

lomita

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Better to have and not need than to need and not have.

Thanks for the offer John. I assume I loosen and remove the top nut, drop the upper and lower tripe trees, then use a puller to remove the bearings. But, that's just a guess.

Yes, I would like to take you up on the tool loan. New roller bearings, seals. Umm, like mom's apple pie.

How do I get started?
 
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lomita

lomita

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The bearings are sealed top and bottom to keep out water, so not sure how you could get grease to them without disassembly. The steering stem is hollow top to bottom, so adding grease to that won't achieve anything at all.

You'd need to remove the top nut, loosen the top triple and slide it up off the stem, undo the locknuts for the bearing, then lift the top bearing out for greasing. Then lower the forks/lower triple enough to get to the lower bearing; these would probably need to drop down by 30mm or so. It would be easier at that point to have removed the forks completely and then the lower triple and stem can be pulled right out.
Hey Terry. Got the forks out right now and just finished the Racetech Gold Valve Kit installation. Man, those puppies are solid now. Progressive springs were right box but wrong length, so returned them and bought the 1.0 Racetech springs. Have decided to change out to tapered roller bearings, All Balls kit. So, I might get done by Christmas.
 
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Better to have and not need than to need and not have.

Thanks for the offer John. I assume I loosen and remove the top nut, drop the upper and lower tripe trees, then use a puller to remove the bearings. But, that's just a guess.

Yes, I would like to take you up on the tool loan. New roller bearings, seals. Umm, like mom's apple pie.

How do I get started?
The top nut on the upper triple clamp is a regular hex nut, but underneath the triple clamp is a special Honda nut that requires a special tool. that's the nut that adjusts the torque on the bearings, the upper nut just holds the upper triple clamp onto the steering stem. I'm assuming that tool is included in the tool set John has for loan, so you should be covered there. If your bike still has the old OEM ball bearings its worth the trouble to replace them with the roller bearings.
 
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Hey Terry. Got the forks out right now and just finished the Racetech Gold Valve Kit installation. Man, those puppies are solid now. Progressive springs were right box but wrong length, so returned them and bought the 1.0 Racetech springs. Have decided to change out to tapered roller bearings, All Balls kit. So, I might get done by Christmas.
Hope you're happy with the forks Fred. I just received new compression valves for the CBR600F4 forks on my VFR, and will be shifting the compression valves from that to the ST shortly. I also have some 1.1 Sonic Springs that I tried, as well as the 0.9 springs from my VFR which I have had in the bike for a couple of rides, and think I prefer.

I fitted AllBalls bearings a few months back with no more tools than a 14" pry bar with a 1/2" chisel end, hammer and cold chisel, and my dremel tool. The pry bar worked great to reach through the steering stem and tap out the old races from the frame. I carefully cut the old bottom inner race through with the dremel and then drove that up off the lower triple with a cold chisel. I also put a sawcut through the old outer races, and used these as drivers to avoid damage to the new bearings; the sawcut allows the old bearings to collapse slightly so they don't get caught in the frame.

If you already have the forks out, this is probably a two hour job at worst. It can take a few tries to get the final bearing tension correct, the taper bearings seems to be more sensitive than ball bearings in that regard.
 
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It can take a few tries to get the final bearing tension correct, the taper bearings seems to be more sensitive than ball bearings in that regard.
yeah, and also check them every few hundred miles after installation. Depending on how fully seated you get them initially, they might loosen up a bit as the weight of the bike pounds them that last fraction of a mm into the stem.
 

John OoSTerhuis

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Steering stem races and bearings removal and replacement AOW article: http://www.st-riders.net/index.php?topic=3576.0
The tools: http://www.st-riders.net/coppermine/displayimage.php?album=21&pid=969#top_display_media
No need to Dremel anything. The lower race on the stem gets started off with a cold chisel (in the kit). I recommend the tapered roller bearings from CBR Bearings. Shouldn't have to readjust later if you use the races press tools in the kit. Phil's waterproof bearing grease from your local bicycle shop. Moly 60 is a poor choice for this application.

Fork seals R&R AOW tips article: http://www.st-riders.net/index.php?topic=907.0
Some of the fork tools: http://www.st-riders.net/coppermine/displayimage.php?album=21&pid=971#top_display_media
What would have made your right fork C-clip install a lot easier: http://www.st-riders.net/coppermine/displayimage.php?album=21&pid=444#top_display_media

To borrow any of the STOC tools kits (with how-to documentation packages): http://www.st-riders.net/index.php/board,15.0.html
Register if you haven't already.

John
 
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lomita

lomita

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Thanks John. Got registered and waiting for final approval to enter the site. The tool info is a real plus.
 
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lomita

lomita

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Hope you're happy with the forks Fred. I just received new compression valves for the CBR600F4 forks on my VFR, and will be shifting the compression valves from that to the ST shortly. I also have some 1.1 Sonic Springs that I tried, as well as the 0.9 springs from my VFR which I have had in the bike for a couple of rides, and think I prefer.

I fitted AllBalls bearings a few months back with no more tools than a 14" pry bar with a 1/2" chisel end, hammer and cold chisel, and my dremel tool. The pry bar worked great to reach through the steering stem and tap out the old races from the frame. I carefully cut the old bottom inner race through with the dremel and then drove that up off the lower triple with a cold chisel. I also put a sawcut through the old outer races, and used these as drivers to avoid damage to the new bearings; the sawcut allows the old bearings to collapse slightly so they don't get caught in the frame.

If you already have the forks out, this is probably a two hour job at worst. It can take a few tries to get the final bearing tension correct, the taper bearings seems to be more sensitive than ball bearings in that regard.
Yup, the forks are out. I admire how you succeeded the bearing swapout with the dremel, chisels, and pry bar and may follow your lead.

Necessity is the mother of invention. I'll have a gander in the morning.

Looking foward to the completion of the bearings r&r.

It's a great feeling to be bringing this machine back to life again, knowing it's rock solid. I'll be able to sink myself into the ride. Yee haw! Haven't ridden this machine more than 30 minutes since buying it 3 years ago. I sold my 1500 LC back in 2003.
 
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I admire how you succeeded the bearing swapout with the dremel, chisels, and pry bar and may follow your lead.
If you do it this way its not that hard, the only trick is to get enough contact with the lower bearing in the stem to drive it out. The stem diameter expands at the bottom, where the bearing resides, so the bearing is hiding behind the wall of the stem if you look down the inside. A straight line from the top will only graze the edge of the bearing, and not provide enough drive, so you need something with a little bend or protrusion at the end to follow the curve in the stem and sit firmly enough on the bearing surface to provide the required force. When I did it I used a threaded rod I happened to have in the garage at the time and I bent the last half inch or so about 30 degrees in a vise, and that worked.
 
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Getting the old lower bearing race off the triple tree was a pain. Used a chisel. Put a cork in the bottom and fill it with ice water when you go to install the new bearing and seal there. Heat the bearing. Cut through the old race with a dremel and use it as a driver with a pipe of the appropriate inner diameter. +1 on the CBR tapered roller bearing kit. My ST1100 steering head bearings were toast at 70k miles.
On my ST1300, the best thing I found for driving out the old steering head races was an old pipe, but I am thinking the ST1100 does not have those generous cut outs the ST1300 does. You will need a big punch with a sharp edge, or a bearing puller. HF sells one but I am not real happy with it. You need to make absolutely sure the new races are fully seated in the steering head before reassembly, great investment here:
http://www.harborfreight.com/10-piece-bearing-race-and-seal-driver-set-95853.html
You can use threaded stock and nuts/washers at either end to get them started. Freeze them and heat the steering head.
Use waterproof lithium grease, and a lot of it, BelRay makes a good one.
Initial torque I used on the adjustment nut was 28 ft/lbs, backed off to zero, then re torqued at 31 inch/lbs. Worked perfectly. Tapered bearings require much less preload than ball bearings.
 
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lomita

lomita

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Hey Terry, piece of cake, like you said, quick job. Ready to install roller bearings in the morning. Thanks for the inspiration.
 
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lomita

lomita

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John, won't need tooling. Thanks anyhow.
 
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