Avon STorm Split

I took my bike in for its first STealer service at 12K miles about a week ago. Everything checked out fine, but the shop pointed out a split in the sidewall of my rear tire. The guy asked if I had had any road damage and if I stored it inside or out. He recommended that I see the STealer that sold the tire to me about warranty replacement.
It has only been on the bike for a year and the bike is always parked inside. I called the guy at Hillside Honda in Lakeport. First he asked me to find the lot number on the tire. It was 1008, and then he asked me to bring the tire in next week for the Avon sales rep to see it. He said that Avon usually will replace the tire, which is cool, but that I would have to pay for labor to mount it. All of that is good. At least the guy at Hillside took the time to deal with it, and if Avon is good for a new tire, then I guess I got a year's worth of riding for the cost of mounting. My question is this... Has anyone else had a STorm sidewall split? Would it be something to be wary of in the future when it comes time to put on a new tire? I have been considering the PR2's but I really like the way the STorms handle. Anybody? Bueller?

Mike

A split or a cut? Kinda hard to tell I would imagine.

There's tons of stuff we run over that we probably never see and some could easily get caught between the frame/tire or other places.

Glad it was caught and hopefully Avon will replace it for ya, I've heard of them doing that before which if cool.

The Avon road hazard warranty is good for the first mm of tread depth. If I remember correctly they start out at 6.6 mm so if you have worn the tire past that first mm Avon may not replace it under the road hazard warranty. Still, they are the only tire mfg I know of that has any road hazard warranty at all so that's good. I had a rear Storm replaced after a piece of bone punched a huge hole in the tire at 1600 miles. Bone shards in the road are definitely road hazards.

If the split is a mfg defect I would think the rep has the acumen to replace the tire no question.

I have been using Avon's on both STs for a combined 140,000 and haven't had a side wall issue on any of them.

mpgar said:

I took my bike in for its first STealer service at 12K miles about a week ago. Everything checked out fine, but the shop pointed out a split in the sidewall of my rear tire. The guy asked if I had had any road damage and if I stored it inside or out. He recommended that I see the STealer that sold the tire to me about warranty replacement.
It has only been on the bike for a year and the bike is always parked inside. I called the guy at Hillside Honda in Lakeport. First he asked me to find the lot number on the tire. It was 1008, and then he asked me to bring the tire in next week for the Avon sales rep to see it. He said that Avon usually will replace the tire, which is cool, but that I would have to pay for labor to mount it. All of that is good. At least the guy at Hillside took the time to deal with it, and if Avon is good for a new tire, then I guess I got a year's worth of riding for the cost of mounting. My question is this... Has anyone else had a STorm sidewall split? Would it be something to be wary of in the future when it comes time to put on a new tire? I have been considering the PR2's but I really like the way the STorms handle. Anybody? Bueller?

Mike

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I have a rear sitting in the shop now with several splits in the side wall that show cord. I took this off a local guys wheel, he had severe bulges in the front tire in about 3000 miles and it was replaced at his expense on a trip.
He went ahead and ran the rear and over time noticed the splits.
When I dis-mounted the tire I noticed the carass was very soft. When we looked we found that the sidewall is only 2 ply as apposed to to other mayjor brands that are 4 ply.
I mount a lot tires and have run numerous brands and I would go with the PR`s. I have worn out several sets with never a problem,take it for what it`s worth. These were on the 1300.
You can also do a search on Avon Storms on this website and find more problems.

Larry Ramel said:

I have a rear sitting in the shop now with several splits in the side wall that show cord. I took this off a local guys wheel, he had severe bulges in the front tire in about 1000 miles and it was replaced at his expense on a trip.
He went ahead and ran the rear and over time noticed the splits.
When I dis-mounted the tire I noticed the carass was very soft. When we looked we found that the sidewall is only 2 ply as apposed to to other mayjor brands that are 4 ply.
I mount a lot tires and have run numerous brands and I would go with the PR`s. I have worn out several sets with never a problem,take it for what it`s worth. These were on the 1300.
You can also do a search on Avon Storms on this website and find more problems.

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Tell us what type of Avon tire is two ply. Most modern radial motorcycle tires are one ply sidewall as is the Storm. The Avon Storm rear is 4 ply in total, at least mine was 5 minutes ago when I looked at it. 2 rayon, 1 polyester, 1 aramid (Kevlar). The Michelins on another bike in my garage are 2 ply. So it is important to compare apples to apples.

Larry Ramel said:

I have a rear sitting in the shop now with several splits in the side wall that show cord. I took this off a local guys wheel, he had severe bulges in the front tire in about 1000 miles and it was replaced at his expense on a trip.
He went ahead and ran the rear and over time noticed the splits.
When I dis-mounted the tire I noticed the carass was very soft. When we looked we found that the sidewall is only 2 ply as apposed to to other mayjor brands that are 4 ply.
I mount a lot tires and have run numerous brands and I would go with the PR`s. I have worn out several sets with never a problem,take it for what it`s worth. These were on the 1300.
You can also do a search on Avon Storms on this website and find more problems.

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Stories like this is why I went with the PR2's, not alot of them, but have not seen any on PR2's

I'm on my 3rd set of Avons for the ST13 and no problems . When I got a nail in a rear avon with just 113 miles on it they replaced it. I also ran avons on my old ST11 and never any problems then either. just my 2 cent.

I think I am on my fifth front and seventh rear Storm with no need to try another brand yet. Bridgestone, Michelins, & Metzelers on this bike were good too but not Avon good.

For ReSTored, I buy what ever is cheap and handy.

For STick, I buy Avon STorms.

Gotta say I can't really tell the diff (especially with STick's current suspension probs.)

Usually get ~9000 miles from a set of STorms. Last set of BT020R rear, Excedra front on Restored went 15,000. Figure dollar cost average, the Bridgestones are a better deal.

Oh, yeah, STick fell down on the STorms, no fault of mine (except maybe myopia), ReSTored only fell down when I forced the issue (mental myopia??)

Maybe I need to rethink the tar thingie but I do really like the STorms.

dduelin said:

Tell us what type of Avon tire is two ply. Most modern radial motorcycle tires are one ply sidewall. The Avon Storm rear is 4 ply, at least mine was 5 minutes ago when I looked at it. 2 rayon, 1 polyester, 1 aramid (Kevlar).

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I stand corrected it was 1 ply with the cords showing, most others are 2 and three ply sidewalls. And I am looking at PR with 2 and a Metzler with 3, Dunlop 3, Bridgestone 3 Continental 2. It is amaizing that yours has 4. The Storm I am talking would be several. years old now.
Don`t forget we are talking sidewalls.
There has been numerous problems with the Storms on the 1300`s . Tim at Two Brothers even stopped selling and installing them on 1300 for that reason.
Let`s get back to the point here, his is cracked, Richards rear was cracked, his front had massive bulges at 1000 miles (and there were and still should be pictures on here check the posts by KTMRACER on 8-14-07) Also check post by dhuber on 8-29-08. Two Bros. stopped selling them for the 1300`s.
I don`t sell tires so I don`t have a vested interest other than safety. The man asked a question and I gave an answer. Run them if you feel safe your butt is your choice.

Larry Ramel said:

I stand corrected it was 1 ply with the cords showing, most others are 2 and three ply sidewalls. And I am looking at PR with 2 and a Metzler with 3, Dunlop 3, Bridgestone 3 Continental 2. It is amaizing that yours has 4. The Storm I am talking would be several. years old now.
Don`t forget we are talking sidewalls.
There has been numerous problems with the Storms on the 1300`s . Tim at Two Brothers even stopped selling and installing them on 1300 for that reason.
Let`s get back to the point here, his is cracked, Richards rear was cracked, his front had massive bulges at 1000 miles (and there were and still should be pictures on here check the posts by KTMRACER on 8-14-07) Also check post by dhuber on 8-29-08. Two Bros. stopped selling them for the 1300`s.
I don`t sell tires so I don`t have a vested interest other than safety. The man asked a question and I gave an answer. Run them if you feel safe your butt is your choice.

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The plies are in total. The 2 and 3 ply tires you mention are less than 4 ply. But tires vary greatly. Like I said, I have Michelin M62s with 2 plies and some Bridgestones on the other bike with 8 plies - 4 sidewall and 4 tread. Apples, oranges, and kumquats it's hard to generalize unless you describe the tire model name or number and compare with a like tire in another brand.

Before you place words in Tim's mouth you might go back and read why he won't sell Avon Storms.

And search for other tire problems - other brands are represented here besides Avon.

Tire problems are not always manufacturing defects. DIY mounting with pipes/cheater bars slipped over tire irons for "extra leverage", 90+ psi to "get that dang bead to seat", running low tire pressures, road hazards, overloading - the ST has an allowable payload of barely more than 300 lbs. Two up with luggage may exceed that.

We don't even know how the split occurred in the OP's tire. You assume a defect and it might be. It might also be road damage or vandalism.

dduelin said:

The plies are in total. The 2 and 3 ply tires you mention are less than 4 ply. But tires vary greatly. Like I said, I have Michelin M62s with 2 plies and some Bridgestones on the other bike with 8 plies - 4 sidewall and 4 tread. Apples, oranges, and kumquats it's hard to generalize unless you describe the tire model name or number and compare with a like tire in another brand.

Before you place words in Tim's mouth you might go back and read why he won't sell Avon Storms.

And search for other tire problems - other brands are represented here besides Avon.

Tire problems are not always manufacturing defects. DIY mounting with pipes/cheater bars slipped over tire irons for "extra leverage", 90+ psi to "get that dang bead to seat", running low tire pressures, road hazards, overloading - the ST has an allowable payload of barely more than 300 lbs. Two up with luggage may exceed that.

We don't even know how the split occurred in the OP's tire. You assume a defect and it might be. It might also be road damage or vandalism.

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I stand buy what I have said! All the tires I mentioned were ST rears 170/60/17 or 160/70/17. And yes I have talked with Tim personally about this. And if you have an Avon Storm 170/60/17 rear with 4 ply sidewalls this truly amazing.
Go ride this is getting to be a big waste of time after the fact.

Done!

Larry Ramel said:

I stand buy what I have said! All the tires I mentioned were ST rears 170/60/17 or 160/70/17. And yes I have talked with Tim personally about this. And if you have an Avon Storm 170/60/17 rear with 4 ply sidewalls this truly amazing.
Go ride this is getting to be a big waste of time after the fact.

Done!

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Tim actually posted here that Avon notified him that they would not back up his liability for certain tires his business sold if they were improperly mounted which by his wording included mounting Storms on ST1300s. He noted that there were no failures in the original post from 9/3/2008. The fact that many retailers continue to sell and mount the tire leaves room for an interpretation different from Two Brothers. If the ST1300 did not have the weave reputation it does it would be a non-issue. I don't blame Avon for being lawyer-whipped. If someone goes and kills themselves on a Avon-shod ST1300 they are going to be named as a defendant in the lawsuit that may follow. The fact that the ST can wobble on the OEM tires taints all including Avon.

https://www.st-owners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49123

I never said it was 4 plies in the sidewall. I said it was 4 plies in total.

I think you are still mixed up and looking at bias ply tires and comparing them to radials that generally have one, maybe two plies in the sidewall. But so what. If the load index is the same 72W for a 10 ply tire that doesn't mean it is any better - just stiffer, heavier, and of giving less feedback. Check and see if the 160/70/17s and 170/60/17s lying around are actually 170/60ZR-17's.

The ST1300 does not take 160/70ZR-17 rears unless you or your friends mount undersize tires or tires of a size not recommended by Honda. All the more reason to think you are comparing apples to oranges.

Big Red said:

ST1300 is too heavy for Avon Storms but that is my opinion

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I agree and apparentily Avon also. As I said in my corrected statement 170/60/17 radial (all we have ever been referring to in this tread are radials) has a 1 ply sidewall and some are cracking.

Larry Ramel said:

I stand corrected it was 1 ply with the cords showing, most others are 2 and three ply sidewalls. And I am looking at PR with 2 and a Metzler with 3, Dunlop 3, Bridgestone 3 Continental 2. It is amaizing that yours has 4. The Storm I am talking would be several. years old now.
Don`t forget we are talking sidewalls.
There has been numerous problems with the Storms on the 1300`s . Tim at Two Brothers even stopped selling and installing them on 1300 for that reason.
Let`s get back to the point here, his is cracked, Richards rear was cracked, his front had massive bulges at 1000 miles (and there were and still should be pictures on here check the posts by KTMRACER on 8-14-07) Also check post by dhuber on 8-29-08. Two Bros. stopped selling them for the 1300`s.
I don`t sell tires so I don`t have a vested interest other than safety. The man asked a question and I gave an answer. Run them if you feel safe your butt is your choice.

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Thats funny I don't think the STorms have been around that long. The Azaro was the tire befor the Storm came out 2- 3 years ago. I have run them both with no problems.

Larry Ramel said:

I agree and apparentily Avon also. As I said in my corrected statement 170/60/17 radial (all we have ever been referring to in this tread are radials) has a 1 ply sidewall and some are cracking.

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I really wish more research was done before posting rumors.
There is a lot of it going on here, much of it just posting prior unfounded rumors.

I posted a thread complaining about how bad my first storm was. Hopefully no one used that as a basis to avoid Storms. Since then, and many miles later, I would never run anything but Storms.

ST1300 weight has nothing to do with Avon not listing a size for the ST1300.
How could it when they do the list the Storm for the ST1100, which weighs more.

Avon is based out of GB, which on that side of the globe the ST1300 high speed wobble is/was more of an issue. Look there if you want to see why they do not recommend a tire.

As to storms splitting sidewalls because it is 1 ply, and should not be recommended, huh?

Looks like tread is 4 plies made up of 3 plies Rayon and one ply Aramid, while the sidewall is simply 3 plies Rayon.

Besides this, look at other tire threads. PR2 shot at 4000 miles is a current one. Most likely due to improper inflation, which is also a common cause of a sidewall type looking split.

Click on image below to see the word Storm along with the 3 ply sidewall and 4 ply tread stampings.

RobsTV said:

I really wish more research was done before posting rumors.
There is a lot of it going on here, much of it just posting prior unfounded rumors.

I posted a thread complaining about how bad my first storm was. Hopefully no one used that as a basis to avoid Storms. Since then, and many miles later, I would never run anything but Storms.

ST1300 weight has nothing to do with Avon not listing a size for the ST1300.
How could it when they do the list the Storm for the ST1100, which weighs more.

Avon is based out of GB, which on that side of the globe the ST1300 high speed wobble is/was more of an issue. Look there if you want to see why they do not recommend a tire.

As to storms splitting sidewalls because it is 1 ply, and should not be recommended, huh?

Looks like tread is 4 plies made up of 3 plies Rayon and one ply Aramid, while the sidewall is simply 3 plies Rayon.

Besides this, look at other tire threads. PR2 shot at 4000 miles is a current one. Most likely due to improper inflation, which is also a common cause of a sidewall type looking split.

Click on image below to see the word Storm along with the 3 ply sidewall and 4 ply tread stampings.

Click to expand...

Yes you are correct, the 160/70/17 ZR Storms have more plys and the ones I have seen are holding up just fine, there is no problem mounting them on an 1100 that I know of.
And what I am posting is not rumors they are tires that I have seen first hand.

sigh.....

If a tyre manufacturer does not list a tyre as a 'Recommended Fitment' then you fit it at your own risk.

I run Storm ST's on my ST1100 and they are better by far than the BT020 I started with.

If I had a 1300 I would need to fit something else as the Storm's are not recommended.

It doesn't matter how many you have run or how well they have performed if they are not recommended by the manufacturer.
If you have an accident and the loss adjuster spots that you run Avon Storms on your ST1300 your insurance could effectively be invalidated.

Good tyres for the 1100, not good for the 1300.

As for splits on tyres, the worst I have ever seen were on Firestone car tyres.

My 2p worth.

Larry Ramel said:

Yes you are correct, the 160/70/17 ZR Storms have more plys and the ones I have seen are holding up just fine, there is no problem mounting them on an 1100 that I know of.
And what I am posting is not rumors they are tires that I have seen first hand.

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Nope, not a ZR.
They are just normal 160/70R17 Storm AV56 tires.
The only ones you can get. (some catalogs list them wrong, but tire is stamped correctly as a Z not a ZR).
Might be time to visit the optometrist

EDIT: just looked at receipt to see what info it has (does not mean it is correct info).
Front lists as AV55 110/80ZR18. This skinny tire stamped 110/80ZR18, 4 ply tread, 2 ply sidewall.
Rear lists as AV56 160/70VR17. Tire stamped 160/70R17, 4 ply tread, 3 ply sidewall.

Larry Ramel said:

I stand buy what I have said! All the tires I mentioned were ST rears 170/60/17 or 160/70/17....

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Your prior post you mentioned the Storm in the 160/70/17 size as one of the bad ones with one ply sidewall. Just posting that you have obtained some bad info and that you need to do more research.