2009 ST1300 cranks but no ignition

RVtraveler48

RVtraveler48

Joined
Aug 27, 2018
Messages
26
Location
Jacksonville, FL
I had two Honda dealers, in contact with Honda, each spend 2 weeks with my bike in Omaha where the failure occured. One thing I am not clear on is whether the plugs fire from the alternator output OR the battery. It was suggested that some bike, boat, and of course airplane motors don't use the battery for ignition. An open stator would account for my symptoms but I don't know if either dealer tested the stator. Does anyone know for sure if the ST1300 ignites like an automobile engine, via the battery, or like a flywheel magneto engine like a Cessna or a lawnmower or like many outboard motors. Trying to figure out what to do next - presently 2,000 miles from home in Nebraska heading west then south and it's killing me that I can't ride the bike!! Thanks for any thoughts - shops said they tested the crankshaft position sensor and the ECM and neither were found to be faulty.
 
The ST fires like an automobile engine, and requires good battery voltage while cranking, to allow it to fire.

We’ll get you running, but we need a little more information about the bike. First, do you hear the fuel pump “whine” when turning on the key, or when cycling the stop switch on and off? It’s hard to find a dealer who knows as much as our collective of members have experienced with these bikes.

Ride Safe
John
 
They have coils that need juice from the battery to fire. Magnetos are in Aircraft and mowers. Like John said a little more info...Do you not have spark? Fuel, spark, compression and then if one lacks we can work backwards from there. So many experts on here, alot more than dealers and even Honda engineers in regards to this bike.
 
Nashcat said:
The ST fires like an automobile engine, and requires good battery voltage while cranking, to allow it to fire.

We'll get you running, but we need a little more information about the bike. First, do you hear the fuel pump “whine†when turning on the key, or when cycling the stop switch on and off? It's hard to find a dealer who knows as much as our collective of members have experienced with these bikes.

Ride Safe
John
Click to expand...

Bike has always started and run fine - battery WAS getting up there and when this began cranked too slow to start. I installed another battery I had on the RV - similar vintage but hardly used - charger said green but measured 11.8 volts. When I installed that, turned the key, no dash lights but in Accessory lit briefly then died. Put the first battery back in charged and it started fine. Went right to an auto parts store and got a new AGM battery ($100 range) and when installed, started right up. Ran an errand, but when I left there ignition began cutting out. Did this on and off for 5 blocks, then ran fine 30 miles to a Honda dealer (I was in Omaha in the RV). They played with it for an hour, charged $100, found nothing (because the problem was intermittent). Rode to a friend's I visit every year in the area - no problem. Came out after dinner and it cranked like crazy with the new battery but no ignition. Had it flat bedded to the same Honda dealer where they had it a week, said they had 8 hours in and did I want them to continue. Said they checked the crank position sensor by swapping with a known good one and no change. They were in constant contact with Honda, or so they said. I found another dealer in Council Bluffs who agreed to look at it so sent a trailer to the first dealer. When the bike was wheeled outside awaiting pickup I tried the starter just out of habit - battery was flat dead. They were troubleshooting a starting issue and let the battery get exhausted which pissed me off to where I am complaining to Honda in California. Svc Mgr in 2nd shop acknowledged in writing that it arrived with a dead battery, but they didn't touch it for a week, finally a tech started on it on a Thursday, some on Friday, off Saturday and they said they thought it might be the ECM as there was no spark and no fuel pump activity. No new ECMs available in the US, I was already in a grand for a rental car for the month, so they bought a used one on Ebay from a 99% positive feedback seller. It didn't arrive until Thursday, late in the day they tried it but it didn't help - so either two bad ECMs or two good ones - I was out of time which they noted in my bill (for diagnosis they never finished) but they had the bike 2 weeks so my running out of time on a 6 month outing and almost 2k in the hole between campsites and the rental car, I thought that was a rude entry to make in their notes. So I am now in Colorado (RV needs new batteries) heading south then east with no idea where to turn to get the bike running. My whole reason for the RV has been taking the bike to new places to ride - now it's dead weight and I am not sure what to do about it. Long story I know but you wanted details. One person back home suggested an open stator which they never tested but finally got the answer that this is an automotive engine that gets the spark from the battery which is now charged and healthy. Still spins but won't spark. Grateful for any suggestions where to turn, but keep in mind I'm on the road and have no place to do a major disassembly. Am loathe to go to the Honda dealer back in Jacksonville, FL, as they have shown themselves to be highly priced and under talented in the past. Letters to Honda in CA have gone unanswered except a woman called me, and when I started to talk about it said she had to run to a meeting and that was the last communication from Honda that I had. The bike is an '09, 55,000 miles, runs like a champ and I don't want to give up on it. Thanks for your (collective) thoughts. Peter
 
Shooting from the hip.......... The ST runs fine without a working charging system as long as the battery has enough amps to run ignition and fuel injection. I know this from personal experience of an open circuit alternator.

You have no fuel pump whine at KEY ON...........If the bike has a KNOWN good battery and has no fuel pump whine with KEY ON the first thing I would do is remove the left side plastics and locate the 24 pin wire harness connector over the left valve cover. Locate the green (ground) wire running into the 24 pin from the headlight side. Fashion a 14 gauge wire jumper and connect the headlight side directly to the frame and see if the fuel pump starts up. If it does the bike should start.
 
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I would suggest contacting some of the local ST owners there are a few in the Jacksonville area they may be able to help. As you are still out west check the RAN list you may find help there.
 
I am going to send this thread to a friend, Dave, who is also on this forum. We were on a trip together about 5 years ago to Colorado. We stopped in Aurora, Nebraska for a bite to eat. Came out to resume journey, and Dave's bike would not start. We withnessed weird electrical nuances, etc. It would crank, but no spark. Flat bedded his bike, a 2005 ST1300 (no ABS), to Honda dealer. No luck. Somehow, Dave and I fiddled with wiring and means of changing a sequence as the ingition was turned on, and..., we got it started. No head lights would come on, horn did not work, maybe a couple of other things did not operate normally. Only his auxiliary lighting worked, and brake lights. Dave decided not to continue with the trip and returned home (about 500 miles). I continued with the trip since I was also visiting my grandkids. Dave is a super high tech mechanic. He suspected that a portion of the main wiring harness was the culprit. He decompressed for a day or so following his return home before he ‘visited' his bike in the garage. For kicks, he turned the ignition, hit the starter button, and...,the damn thing started and stayed lit like as if nothing was wrong. He could not duplicate the problem as we experienced in Aurora, Nebraska. He did tear down his bike to nearly exposing the entire wiring harness (there must be several dozen wire leads in that harness). To this day, he has been riding his bike, without any issues. However, at this time, he feels he does not have a dependable bike.
Anyway, I will ask Dave to respond to your thread...
 
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We had a similar occurrence at Moonshine a few years ago and as Dave said above it was a ground wire in the large connector on the left side.
 
Check the ground wire(s) in the 21 pin connector, and also remove the ground wire(s) from the frame location under the left rear corner of the fuel tank, clean this area off, and replace and tighten ground wires.
Also check the yellow box behind the right headlight/mirror area for burnt wires or connections.
 
All great replies. Open stator...I doubt, but never say never? Well we do not know it has no spark you say. Fuel pump whine, yes you need that. No spark, well if it was the kill switch, the engine would not turn over on the 1300 to check spark so unlikely. I like the ground issue thoughts. Jumping it as Igofar states would be where I would go, and having a fresh battery charge so if starts, one could check the volts and charge since your battery is dead while riding if I read that correctly. I also like the idea of looking for help with the locals on RAN list. Many eyes are good on a problem.
 
Another thing to check is remove the bolts that hold the coils on and clean surface areas.
 
Your original post talks about being in Omaha. Are you anywhere near the Kansas City area? I have shop space and accommodations. Will send you a PM
 
Igofar said:
Another thing to check is remove the bolts that hold the coils on and clean surface areas.
Click to expand...

Going from memory, there is a blue wire to the one coil and ? to the other that supplies the voltage. I would suggest a volt meter to those while cranking to see if there is input? I don't know if that is the proper way but makes sense to me. Larry?
 
Igofar said:
Another thing to check is remove the bolts that hold the coils on and clean surface areas.
Click to expand...

Larry,

Is the white courtesy phone working? I heard you are relocating. OP is in AZ at the moment and would welcome a PM.

Chuck
 
Nashcat said:
Did the OP ever get his problem resolved?
Click to expand...
I spoke with OP yesterday and he is still hauling a dead ST on the back of his RV. Making his way back to FL via my house. Hopefully we can look at it this weekend.
Chuck
 
Checking to see if anyone has a loaner ECM for an 09 St1300 A ABS. Working on a no start issue for RVTraveler48. I have not diagnosed the issue as of yet but trying to locate one in the event it is needed for testing. PN in the fische is 38770-MCS-R12 for 09 st1300A AB
A working unit with a failure code 25 or 26 would work for testing.
Thanks in advance
Chuck
 
i have one available . was bought on here from a wrecked bike and was told it was good .
 
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