No spark on ST1300 honda

[Albert Brandt]

I check all wires for corousion, all fuses and replace all relays on the st . Check wires leading to ECU to coils , I just don't know how to check if the ECM is faulty. It's started once when all covers were off after the check , but after assembly, it would not start.
So now it just crank and no spark at plugs.
Albert.

 

[Gus1300]

Possibility is that something was pinched or disconnected accidentally during reassembly. Since it cranks but you're not seeing any spark, the 'logic train' to get that far is intact. I would focus on that specific path and see what you can find. Others will likely jump in with additional assistance.

 

[dduelin]

Does the fuel pump make the whirring noise when the key is turned ON?

 

[jfheath]

Do your ST1300s have HISS in South Africa ? Bikes equipped with the Immobilisor system have HISS printed on the speedo dial in the lower right quadrant - to the left of air temp and the time display.

If it has, then the issue is to do with the key or the antenna. The keys have a chip inside them. You may be using a key without the chip.

When the ignition key is turned on, the fuel pump should whirr into life for a couple of seconds, then turn off. If the kill switch is off or faulty, or if the proper chipped key is not used in a bike with HISS, it will not whirr.

 

[Albert Brandt]

No where from fuel pump when ignition is switch on. On previous instance during this process I remove fuel pump and tested is and the pump is working outside when 12 volts is applied.

I do t think my key is chiped, when I bought it it has a regular key " JMA HOND25p"

 

[jfheath]

I looked at a couple of photos of bikes for sale in South Africa. The ones that I saw - 2 of them that had a photo of the dash - had HISS on there.

So I'll ask again - does your speedo show the letters HISS ?

Eg this one was for sale in Gauteng https://www.automart.co.za/bikes/honda-st1300-2007-id-6013776

Note the letters HISS in the lower right quarter of the speedo circle below km/h
If yours has these letters, then your JMA key will not start the bike. Ever.



Sorry to be so demanding, but if your bike has the HISS system, there is absolutely no point in looking anywhere else until you use the proper key.

 

[Albert Brandt]

I looked at a couple of photos of bikes for sale in South Africa. The ones that I saw - 2 of them that had a photo of the dash - had HISS on there.

So I'll ask again - does your speedo show the letters HISS ?

Eg this one was for sale in Gauteng https://www.automart.co.za/bikes/honda-st1300-2007-id-6013776

Note the letters HISS in the lower right quarter of the speedo circle below km/h
If yours has these letters, then your JMA key will not start the bike. Ever.



Sorry to be so demanding, but if your bike has the HISS system, there is absolutely no point in looking anywhere else until you use the proper key.

Thank you

Thank you

It show the "HISS"

 

[jfheath]

So if it shows the HISS, you must have another key - one with a chip in it.

In post #1, you said :

It's started once when all covers were off after the check , but after assembly, it would not start.

So you must have had the correct key when it started that once. When you find it, let us know what happens when you put it in the ignition, turn it on and press the starter button.

If that is your only key, you will probably want to buy a new blank key with a chip in it, get it cut and program it. If you lose the only remaining key with a chip, the bike can not be started without buying a brand new ECU and key set.

 

[Rob20111]

A common issue is dirty kill switch contacts.
Open the cover and clean with electrical contact cleaner spray, then work the switch thoroughly.
You can also test for voltage while in there.

 

[DannoXYZ]

I check all wires for corousion, all fuses and replace all relays on the st . Check wires leading to ECU to coils , I just don't know how to check if the ECM is faulty. It's started once when all covers were off after the check , but after assembly, it would not start.
So now it just crank and no spark at plugs.
Albert.

Unless you're Superman and can see electrons moving inside wires, there's absolutely ZERO way any human can just look at wires and determine its ability to conduct electricity. Luckily we have instruments that can... This is 5-minute fix with multimeter...

Note that EFI system is on completely different circuit than starter. You can remove entire EFI system: ECU, injectors, coils, sensors, fuel-pump and tank and all their wiring and bike will still happily crank all day long without starting. Just because it cranks, doesn't mean EFI system is OK. Lots of possible causes of this.

1. HISS not satisfied with key. When you turn key ON, HISS light should light up solid, then go out after 3-5sec. Does it do that?
If HISS light stays ON, ECU's not happy with ID from chip and it won't fire sparks or injectors.
Use original key that started bike when covers were off.
Take close look at key and make sure ID chip hasn't fallen out. Many aftermarket keys have this problem where ID chip isn't securely attached.


2. wiring problem. With key ON, start/stop=RUN, measure voltage at ECU, injector and coil connectors. If there's no power, then you've got ign-switch, kill-switch, relay, fuse, sensors or wiring problem.

Sure way to verify ECU is to measure grounding-pulses on injector & coil trigger lines with oscilloscope. High most of time at battery-voltage with intermittent drops to zero when ECU fires coils & injectors.

3. IF ECU does send out grounding pulses, problem may be wiring downstream between ECU and injectors/coils
4. IF NOT, still may be problem upstream from ECU with ign-switch, kill-switch, relay, fuse, sensors or wiring problem

I say restore bike to previous state when it did run. Reverse your steps and remove bodywork in reverse order you installed them. You may have pinched & cut some wiring internally somewhere. Or disconnected a plug, etc.

 

[jfheath]

I've posted 3 videos which show the behaviour of the dash lights and pump motor of a bike equipped with HISS when:

1) The correct matching Honda Chipped key is used
2) A key without a chip is used, or a chipped key that doesn't match the HISS system
3) When an unchipped key is used with the fob from a broken key placed alongside it

(2) ST1300 - HISS - Dash behaviour with paired and unpaired keys. | ST1300 Related | ST-Owners.com

 

[DannoXYZ]

Here's page from owner's manual on HISS operation. You can actually turn OFF HISS blinking. But it'll still operate normally when turning key to ON.

 

[jfheath]

I'd forgotten about that. I prefer to have it blinking, it alerts people to the presence of a theft deterrent.
I suppose in that case, it would be better to rely on the FI light going out once the HISS system has recognised a matching key and turned on the stuff that makes the bike go Vrooom.

It would be nice to hear from @Albert Brandt again - see if he has found a key or can shed any light on how the bike started in his first post.

 

[TerryS]

Speaking from personal exerience, my 04 was supplied with three keys, two were genuine and probably original, one was a copy made by a local locksmith. The last key had no HISS chip, and after the first big dismantle and clean, I used that key to (try to) start the bike; I was about to launch into major fault-finding exercise when I remembered the HISS system. The non-HISS key works perfectly, the dash lights up like normal except no fuel pump noise and no sparks. The engine spins on the starter just fine. With the correct HISS-equipped key, the bike runs perfectly. The PO used the extra key just for the saddlebags.

 

[Hound]

It would be nice to hear from @Albert Brandt again - see if he has found a key or can shed any light on how the bike started in his first post.

He was here viewing this thread less than an hour ago, so he's still around, even if he's keeping things secret!

 

[Albert Brandt]

Unless you're Superman and can see electrons moving inside wires, there's absolutely ZERO way any human can just look at wires and determine its ability to conduct electricity. Luckily we have instruments that can... This is 5-minute fix with multimeter...

Note that EFI system is on completely different circuit than starter. You can remove entire EFI system: ECU, injectors, coils, sensors, fuel-pump and tank and all their wiring and bike will still happily crank all day long without starting. Just because it cranks, doesn't mean EFI system is OK. Lots of possible causes of this.

1. HISS not satisfied with key. When you turn key ON, HISS light should light up solid, then go out after 3-5sec. Does it do that?
If HISS light stays ON, ECU's not happy with ID from chip and it won't fire sparks or injectors.
Use original key that started bike when covers were off.
Take close look at key and make sure ID chip hasn't fallen out. Many aftermarket keys have this problem where ID chip isn't securely attached.


2. wiring problem. With key ON, start/stop=RUN, measure voltage at ECU, injector and coil connectors. If there's no power, then you've got ign-switch, kill-switch, relay, fuse, sensors or wiring problem.

Sure way to verify ECU is to measure grounding-pulses on injector & coil trigger lines with oscilloscope. High most of time at battery-voltage with intermittent drops to zero when ECU fires coils & injectors.

3. IF ECU does send out grounding pulses, problem may be wiring downstream between ECU and injectors/coils
4. IF NOT, still may be problem upstream from ECU with ign-switch, kill-switch, relay, fuse, sensors or wiring problem

I say restore bike to previous state when it did run. Reverse your steps and remove bodywork in reverse order you installed them. You may have pinched & cut some wiring internally somewhere. Or disconnected a plug, etc.

He was here viewing this thread less than an hour ago, so he's still around, even if he's keeping things secret!

I started it with the same key that I started it I do not know if the previous owner did something but this bikes key that I bought with has no chiped key.
What I also discovered yesterday , the fuel pump do not prime when ignition is switch on. Albert.

 

[jfheath]

I started it with the same key that I started it I do not know if the previous owner did something but this bikes key that I bought with has no chiped key.
What I also discovered yesterday , the fuel pump do not prime when ignition is switch on. Albert.

Exactly - the fuel pump will not prime if you try to start it with a key that doesn't have a chip in it. I posted 3 videos in the link above. Watch Video #2 - that is my HISS bike, attempting to start with a JMA key. Link to Video #2 here. These are exactly the symptoms that you describe.

Of course other things could cause the same symptoms. But you have an HISS bike. You have a key without a chip.
If you do not eliminate that as the reason, then you are wasting your time. That bike will not start without a chipped key unless the original owner has done something to to by pass the HISS system - which seems unlikely.

Also watch this link to Video #1 which shows the same bike being started with a Honda key with a chip.

You said that it started before. You need to think about which key you had and where you were when it started. Were you with the owner ?
I have a suspicious mind. If the bike was started when you bought it and you were at the owners, and the engine was left running, and he gave you just the one key - the JMA key - then you would be able to get home with the engine running perfectly - until you stop the engine. Then it will not start again. But in that case, he has kept the chipped key that is needed to start it.

Contact the previous owner to find out whether you should have a chipped key or not.
If not, you need to know what he did to it to make it work without a chipped key ?
For example, he might have changed the ECU. (But I do not think that you can just buy one and plug it in).

In a different thread, you posted this picture. Is this the same bike ?



Is the model number of the ECU printed on a label ? There are two units there. One is the ABS control unit the other is the Engine Control Unit.
If you don't know which is which, post both numbers.