2006 ST1300 / Notchy Shifting

Great suggestion to try DD...such a test would eliminate linkage or shift dog and would confirm the shop's belief that it is the clutch.
 
I'll give the clutchless shifting a try if I'm still experiencing the issue when I get the bike back. Waiting on a bearing for the water pump. While they have the front end of the engine apart, I told them to go ahead and replace any seals, gaskets, bearings, etc.
 
Have them replace your t stat and snug all your hoseclamps while they are in the open.
 
"Have them replace your t stat and snug all your hose clamps while they are in the open."

They did! The tech called this afternoon. It's back together and ready to be picked up. He said that it's shifting "as smooth as glass". I'll find out tomorrow afternoon if that's the case. I plan to follow whatever instructions Honda recommends. I'm curious if they recommend doing anything special with each oil change to prevent the build up of anything on the clutch plates so that this doesn't occur again.

I will post again every 1000 miles and report how it's going. Since nothing within the transmission or the shift linkage was touched, it appears that the problem was caused by a "dragging clutch", as in that the fibrous and metal clutch plates were not breaking free when the clutch was engaged.

Thanks for all of the input guys!
 
I am wondering if during that 8000 miles on the bike prior to you owning it someone put in "Energy Saving oil" that caused your problem.
 
970mike said:
I am wondering if during that 8000 miles on the bike prior to you owning it someone put in "Energy Saving oil" that caused your problem.
Click to expand...
Wouldn't that make the clutch plates slip instead of stick together?
 
dduelin said:
Wouldn't that make the clutch plates slip instead of stick together?
Click to expand...

I've thought the same thing. I've also wondered if the something in the "energy saving" oil might damage or soften the fibrous clutch plates. When I pick it up tomorrow, I'm going to ask if Honda recommends doing anything special in conjunction with an oil change to keep the engine as clean as possible. I've heard over the years of additives being dumped in just prior to an oil change to break down anything sticking to parts to keep sludge from building up. Regardless, I'm going to follow Honda's recommendations to the letter so that they can't come back and say that the problem is being caused by something I'm doing.

Besides replacing the fibrous clutch plates and the six compression springs, they replaced the clutch push rod bearing and the water pump bearing. I told them to go ahead and replace any seals, gaskets, bearings, etc. while it's torn apart. The total bill for me on this venture is $98, so it looks like a large chunk of it is being covered by the extended warranty!
 
For $98 bucks for all that, and fixing the problem too, great!

Oils today are so good I can't imagine Honda will say anything but stick to the owners manual recommendations of oil and interval. Every time if have the valve covers off I'm pleased to see how clean my 150k ST's engine looks.
 
Well, I picked it up this afternoon. The notchiness is gone! I only felt a hint of it once or twice on the 12 mile, back roads ride home. They asked me if I had replaced the clutch plates because they looked like new, even with 45K on the odometer. I told them that they were the original plates, and that I don't "ride" the clutch at all. I looked at the plates, and they did look like new.

They told me that one of the things they did to evaluate the problem was to put it on the center stand with the engine off and in first gear. They pulled the clutch in and tried to spin the rear wheel by hand, and it took a lot of force to get the clutch plates to break free. They performed the same procedure after it was back together, and the clutch plates broke apart very easily.

The best they could figure is that the issue was due to the oil that I was using. I used Shell Rotella T6 5W-40 for the last 3-4 oil changes. I'm going to stick with using Honda GN oils for now and see how it goes.
 
I'm wondering WHAT they really did to your bike...I suspect it may be what I found tonight on an 07 ST1300A. Guy was complaining (rightly so) about notchy shifting etc. After I flushed and bled the clutch, still there, after I changed the oil to his choice (motul V300 fully synthetic), shifted worse, and rattled more on top of that!, I removed the rubber boots on the shifter linkage and cleaned and greased them, a little better, but still no banana...I drained the synthetic **** out and put in some Delo 400 10w-30 HDEO, and it smoothed out better than with his stuff....
I still was not happy, I checked everything that you did etc.
He said he took it to the shop for an inspection and was told that his entire clutch would need to be replaced, as well as some parts in his tranny and shifter etc. Big bill, bike would be down a couple weeks....he brought it back to me...
As I was sitting on the floor staring at it when A light bulb went off over my head...I quickly removed the lower right cowl (black trim piece) and was looking at the shaft that comes straight out of the back of the transmission, where the first elbow is attached with a 10mm head bolt. There it was! the bolt had loosened up just enough that every time he shifted, it was walking off the splined shaft. There was splines showing between the tranny and the lever, and the shaft was recessed inside the lever about a quarter of an inch. I loosened the bolt all the way, removed it, and cleaned and lubricated it, then pushed the arm ALL the way back onto the shaft and tightened the bolt. Smooth as glass shifting once again....or as he says smooth as buttah...
I suspect the shop knows this happens and uses it to their advantage in generating service work.
I also checked my 07 tonight, and sure enough, mine was starting to walk off just a little bit, but enough to bind the shaft movement, despite the joints.
You may want to check this one bolt from time to time. I know I will from now on.
Larry
 
Igofar said:
There it was! the bolt had loosened up just enough that every time he shifted, it was walking off the splined shaft. There was splines showing between the tranny and the lever, and the shaft was recessed inside the lever about a quarter of an inch. I loosened the bolt all the way, removed it, and cleaned and lubricated it, then pushed the arm ALL the way back onto the shaft and tightened the bolt. Smooth as glass shifting once again....or as he says smooth as buttah...
I suspect the shop knows this happens and uses it to their advantage in generating service work.
I also checked my 07 tonight, and sure enough, mine was starting to walk off just a little bit, but enough to bind the shaft movement, despite the joints.
You may want to check this one bolt from time to time. I know I will from now on.
Larry
Click to expand...


Sounds like you are on to something!! :)
 
Well, the weather finally warmed up enough today to enjoy a decent ride. I rode for about 90 minutes in temps in the low 50's. It took a while, but once the bike was up to full operating temperature and I have ridden a combination of back road and highway miles, the notchiness returned. It felt pretty much like it did before it was serviced. It feels as it something is hitting as it shifts from one gear into the next. I'll have more time later this week to take it out again and put it through a series of shifts, and I'll note the details. I'll perform a series of shifting patterns and see if it's only happening between certain gears. If it's happening between all gears, then that would indicate that there's something amiss in the main mechanism as opposed to just one or two gears.

I did take a peek at the outer rear shift linkage, and there's less than 1.8" of spline showing between the outer collar of the shift arm and where the splines end close to the casing. I'll loosen and adjust it so that the collar is even with the end of the splines.
 
Let us know if that helps...
Have you checked the play you have in the rear wheel / u-joint? I wonder if your u-joint is starting to wear enough to cause alignment issues when you shift?
 
How smooth are you expecting it to shift? I often feel a little catch in the gears when shifting. On at least half of my shifts I feel nothing but the other half is just a little notchy. Using the Delo over the Rotella Syn helps quite a bit. I would like them all to be butter smooth but that has never been the case on this bike since new. I ride a 2006 with 58K on the odometer. It would be interesting to hear how many members bikes shift butter smooth an all shifts. I know some of it is the technique used to shift. Some bikes you don't have to do much to make it butter smooth but my ST is not one of them. It is not very forgiving of poor shift technique.
 
Are you getting lazy while shifting? Meaning are you pulling the lever in just enough to engauge the clutch then shifting where ever you happen to be rpm wise? I paid close attention to mine this morning trying to get it to do what yours is doing, and it did when I didn't load the lever, or tried to shift at unloaded rpm. Try doing this: pause a little just before you shift after pulling In the lever, make sure your rolling the throttle completely off when shifting, and just before you shift blip the throttle to raise the rpm to help sync everything.
Let us know what happens.
One last thing iirc you said you were using 5-40 oil prior, and now the oem 10w-30 semi syn hond brand oil.
You may want to try the 15w-40 delo on your next oil change.
 
Forgot one last question...do you think the mechanic installed the plates in correctly? Meaning sharp edge out, and soaked the new ones in oil for a couple hours before putting them in? The shops around here don't care about direction and since they are flat rate part changers they don't soak them correctly either?
.02
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom