Wow oh Wow! Rode a K1200GT today! Did I say Wow?

skyboybry said:
Why do you have to take your hand off the bar to activate the turn signal?

sbB
Click to expand...

Actually, what I think he meant to say, I can attest to this observation as accurate as I had the ST and now back to an RT as well and like the BMW apporoach better to turn signals... is this:

To activate the left and right turn signal on the ST, you have to move your thumb up and off the grip by an inch or so, if not more if memory serves me correct... at times, necessitating the awkward reach to hit that switch in certain circumstances where you DON'T want to take the hand off the grip or loosen it up, say in a turn.

On the BMW style of switch, you are literally millimeters for the activation of the switch, hardly having to move a thumb at all... much easier to activate ergonomically speaking. Even the cancel switch, full grip on the right bar, just flick up the thumb ever so slightly, and the signal is canceled.

Was that right, Cali?

Chris
 
Chris Parker said:
Actually, what I think he meant to say, I can attest to this observation as accurate as I had the ST and now back to an RT as well and like the BMW apporoach better to turn signals... is this:

To activate the left and right turn signal on the ST, you have to move your thumb up and off the grip by an inch or so, if not more if memory serves me correct... at times, necessitating the awkward reach to hit that switch in certain circumstances where you DON'T want to take the hand off the grip or loosen it up, say in a turn.

On the BMW style of switch, you are literally millimeters for the activation of the switch, hardly having to move a thumb at all... much easier to activate ergonomically speaking. Even the cancel switch, full grip on the right bar, just flick up the thumb ever so slightly, and the signal is canceled.

Was that right, Cali?

Chris
Click to expand...
It comes down to how you grip the bar. If you are a drop wrist kind of gripper the Honda's switch is too high to thumb without lifting the wrist or stretching a long thumb. If you utilize a straighter wrist the thumb is right on the switch. Could it be that the BMW RT sit-up-and-beg riding position with levers set at more horizontal angles favors or encourages the drop wrist grip while the lower bars/levers and more weight on the wrists ST1300 position makes riding with a straighter wrist easier?

My observation is that I don't really grip the bars as much as rest my palms on them with the thumb dropped down to hook the bar for pushing. When folks complain about the reach to the switch the only way I can relate is their wrist is held much lower than mine.

At any rate, the German engineers have spoken and gone back the Japanese style. One can't satisfy everyone I guess.
 
Last edited:
Chris Parker said:
Actually, what I think he meant to say, I can attest to this observation as accurate as I had the ST and now back to an RT as well and like the BMW apporoach better to turn signals... is this:

To activate the left and right turn signal on the ST, you have to move your thumb up and off the grip by an inch or so, if not more if memory serves me correct... at times, necessitating the awkward reach to hit that switch in certain circumstances where you DON'T want to take the hand off the grip or loosen it up, say in a turn.

On the BMW style of switch, you are literally millimeters for the activation of the switch, hardly having to move a thumb at all... much easier to activate ergonomically speaking. Even the cancel switch, full grip on the right bar, just flick up the thumb ever so slightly, and the signal is canceled.

Was that right, Cali?

Chris
Click to expand...

That is exactly correct. I guess you have a better way with words than I do. The bmw puts the buttons you use the most where your thumbs are already at. requiring little movement. I dont see how anyone that has used both systems for more than a few weeks can argue the BMW controls but it is a personal item still. Alot like seats, grips, handlebars, etc... were all differnt and I guess even our brains are programmed differently. I just blame the magazine reviewers for their lack of capacity to understand this and hammering BMW in all their reviews. IMO this is the reason for BMW to change and these *******s should be held accountable. They have made this one item the one piece keeping the K1300GT as being the ideal bike for me.

The standard japanese turn signals required alot more but had they not been so far off from the grip may not have been as bad. I will be intrested in seeing the new BMW controls as it seems the position of the turn signals are significantly closer to the thumb by the pictures but a test in real life will tell the story.
 
EASt said:
I disagree. I bought an '03 and it came with none of those things. 10 years after BMW started 'em... I got screwed.

Even 15 years later, Honda has only added the adjustable windscreen and ABS. For the Honda owner, it's farkle-city.

And although I'm a huge fan of the BMW, it always comes down to the same point: price. I couldn't afford to enter sport-touring on a BMW. I could barely afford to enter sport-touring on the ST1300. In the end, though, I'm happy to be sport-touring, and I think the ST has done a more than admirable job of getting me there. The BMW would've done the same thing, I'm sure.

I just didn't want to wait another two years while I saved the extra cash - I wanted to hit the road and get some pie. And to that end, I am a Honda fan as well. Although BMW could've turned me into the rider I've become, Honda did it for less.

Sorry to keep crying the dollar mantra, but in the end, I've got two wheels spinning under me, and I'm plenty happy. I'm not as concerned with where my motorcycle's lineage comes from as I am in where my lineage as a rider does.
Click to expand...

True, in some areas Honda still hasnt caught up with BMW 10 years ago. Even the wing doesnt even have an adjustable windshield which I am truel suprised at.

I cant knock the price tag issue. Not everyone has alot of money to spend on a bike. However, in my years of experience with japanese bikes and BMW, if you finance you can get finance deals on the BMW that will make your payment lower than a japanese bike costing several thousands less. If you buy used like I do as I have a hrd time justifying the hit of a new bike, then its just a matter of finding a good deal. I sold my St1300 for the same price I bought my RT for. Same model year too! I have a harder time understanding price after doing the research and comparing the big picture, becasue I am not a rich person myself. I guess I just have a way of acquiring what I want in the price I can afford.
 
cali_rider said:
I dont see how anyone that has used both systems for more than a few weeks can argue the BMW controls but it is a personal item still.
Click to expand...

It must be personal. When I had the RT, I loved the front suspension, though some complain it is "vague." I loved the stock shield and the stock seat. I even liked the grabby power servos that most beemer riders disliked and which BMW dropped posthaste. In short, I was pretty easy to please.

But each time I used that weird turn signal system, I liked it less. I enjoyed the first half of the operation, but that cancel button was awkward. In fact it was Rube Goldberg. Thank goodness for the Kisan Tech SignalMinder I added. Then it worked the best of all turn signal systems: once to activate, once to cancel. [Plus it added running lights.] I liked that combined system better than the UJM single switch, but I find the UJM preferable to the old system that BMW is dumping.

Funny about those little things that get some in a dither: I just read someone on the BMWRT board who wrote that the final drive issue wouldn't drive him away, but the turn signal change would. Hooooo-wheeeeeee. :nuts1: Reminds me of some of the . . . different people I was around in academia: The fights were vicious because so little was at stake.
 
Like my grandfather said: agree to disagree, agreeably.

Ride what you've got...let's find pie.

(I trust my Beemer friends won't tire out their thumbs too much signaling turns on the way. ;))
 
I can't believe BMW, saying that the "R1200GS is the best bike in the world" doesn't offer at least a 3 year unlimited mile warranty standard... if they truly want to stand behind their product :rolleyes:

They are very proud of their products, but don't seem to be able to stand behind them on paper.

I wanted a K1200R... that WAS going to be my bike... but as I started to learn more about their warranty... extended warranty... towing policy... and other little things, I went with a Wing.

I have another year left on the Wings standard warranty... maybe BMW will change some of their policies... maybe Honda will debut that new V4 :D Maybe I'll win the Lotto and none of this will matter :bow1:
 
sherob said:
I can't believe BMW, saying that the "R1200GS is the best bike in the world" doesn't offer at least a 3 year unlimited mile warranty standard... if they truly want to stand behind their product
Click to expand...

Sherob,

I think you are spoiled by the ST1300 3 year unlimited warranty which is the anomaly in the motorcycle business. Heck, even Honda's other offerings don't match that warranty except the GoldWing... and I believe Kawasaki, Suzuki and Yamaha's warranty is not that great to write about. Just because the warranty is better in the mileage department does not equate to quality. I am sure that Kawasaki C14 and Yamaha FJR fans would agree with me on that note.

And to the R1200GS, a lot of people ride these anywhere and everywhere and it is shame that Honda does not try to compete in this market... seriously, in the U.S., what bike do they sell that comes close... the only UJM bike that can touch it maybe is the VStrom 1000.

The GS is a Swiss Army knife in the motorcycling world. It is not perfect, but what is? People go on trails, gravel, dirt, mud, asphalt, you name it. I rode several and was just amazed at it's handling on the tarmac. Will hang with most sport bikes.
 
sherob said:
I can't believe BMW, saying that the "R1200GS is the best bike in the world" doesn't offer at least a 3 year unlimited mile warranty standard... if they truly want to stand behind their product :rolleyes:........:bow1:
Click to expand...

You guys think ST riders put on miles ??????......:rolleyes:

BMW used to have unlimited mile warranty but too many riders went over 100K miles in 3 years (I put over 75K on mine in 3 years and I wasn't out of the ordinary)..........

Then there's where some GS riders rode their "dirt" bikes and wanted warranty repair .........

Last thing Honda rider's fall WAAAAY short is: you guys are REALLY amateurs when it comes to being anal (my clock didn't automatically adjust for DST and I want it FIXED or I want a new bike and 3 months free gas) :mad:.

If BMW motorcycles had unlimited mile warranty's they'd be trying to borrow money from Ford:D.

Tom
 
TPadden said:
You guys think ST riders put on miles ??????......:rolleyes:

BMW used to have unlimited mile warranty but too many riders went over 100K miles in 3 years (I put over 75K on mine in 3 years and I wasn't out of the ordinary)..........

Then there's where some GS riders rode their "dirt" bikes and wanted warranty repair .........

Last thing Honda rider's fall WAAAAY short is: you guys are REALLY amateurs when it comes to being anal (my clock didn't automatically adjust for DST and I want it FIXED or I want a new bike and 3 months free gas) :mad:.

If BMW motorcycles had unlimited mile warranty's they'd be trying to borrow money from Ford:D.

Tom
Click to expand...

LOL... there are some high mileage wingers that try to get Honda to pay for stuff within a year or two of ownership - on a bike with 100k+ mileage. Apparently, the 'unlimited' mileage is not so unlimited... The last I looked, which has been a while, they were saying it was unlimited based on normal or average yearly usage which 100k does not fall into.
 
I don't think I'm spoiled... I consider a bike costing that much $ and the type of bike that it is, it should come with a substantial warranty... heck even HD/Buell and Triumph give you 2 years unlimited miles on their rides.

I am buying a Sport Tourer in this case, or in the case of a R1200GS, a World Tourer :D I'm spending some serious coin... sort of like a Caddy, Lexus, or BMW (car) buyer. :cool:
 
sherob said:
... heck even HD/Buell and Triumph give you 2 years unlimited miles on their rides....... :cool:
Click to expand...

Yeah ......... but they don't warranty their real profit products ....... ever try to get warranty service on a Tee shirt after you've worn it ???:rolleyes:
 
I generally don't seem to consider the warranty in the case of a motorcycle. The ST1300 was waste of warranty for me - it's never needed service.

Some other ST owners can't make that claim though.

If I had the means and desire to buy the K1200GT (and good golly, do I have the desire), I'd accept that, like the ST, there could be mechanical issues that I'll have to work on. I'll find a book, or maybe a shop I trust, and take care of it. Most the stuff on motorcycles I've owned breaks because I directly caused it, not because of manufacturer defect. Things that major tend to get recalled anyhow.

I think that motorcyclists love to complain about brand-specific problems. But truthfully, I think most motorcycles built these days are pretty resilient. I'd put mechanical faith in a BMW as much as a Honda... and I'd even go so far as to say that HDs probably aren't as bad as we'd like to think. :duck:
 
Whoa. Back to the issue at hand for a second:

I was just reading the brochure PDF from the BMW website on the K1200GT, and in the small print on page 14-15 under Fuel it says:

SuperPlus unleaded 98 octane (RON); can also be operated with miniumum 95 octane (RON) due to automatic knock control.
Click to expand...

confused-smiley-007.gif


I've never seen anything over 92 offered during my travels. Where do you find 95 octane?? Do I have to drive to Germany to fuel up? Is this converted to Euros? Are octanes measured differently overseas? Who's RON?
 
yeah but they're so cool,,,,,,,,,er,,,,,hot....

1193673376.jpg


and you get to be a member of the club.
 
Last edited:
EASt said:
I generally don't seem to consider the warranty in the case of a motorcycle. The ST1300 was waste of warranty for me - it's never needed service.

Some other ST owners can't make that claim though.

If I had the means and desire to buy the K1200GT (and good golly, do I have the desire), I'd accept that, like the ST, there could be mechanical issues that I'll have to work on. I'll find a book, or maybe a shop I trust, and take care of it. Most the stuff on motorcycles I've owned breaks because I directly caused it, not because of manufacturer defect. Things that major tend to get recalled anyhow.

I think that motorcyclists love to complain about brand-specific problems. But truthfully, I think most motorcycles built these days are pretty resilient. I'd put mechanical faith in a BMW as much as a Honda... and I'd even go so far as to say that HDs probably aren't as bad as we'd like to think. :duck:
Click to expand...

The only reason the warranty came to play for BMW, for me, was the drive shaft failures (among other things) I was seeing among their bikes when I was considering the K12S. Then I found out it was going to cost me $1500 to upgrade the 3/36k warranty to unlimited miles :rolleyes: Then I found out I was only covered for the first 100 miles to a dealer if I had to be towed :rolleyes:

Now... I was living in Texas at the time... it could be very easy for me to be over a 100 miles from a dealer... just riding to eat BBQ for lunch :cool:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom