Aftermarket Regulator (28 amp)

Just to let everyone know.
For all of us out there with 28 amp systems. Oregon Motorcycle Parts has completed their replacement regulator for the ST1100 and will be shipping them out shortly.
In speaking to Tony (the owner) he said he is going to be selling the regulators for $99 each and is willing to give free shipping to all who pre-order.
Check out his web site and check out his guarantee.

E-mail address:
sales@oregonmotorcycleparts.com
Web site:
www.oregonmotorcycleparts.com
Here is the direct link to the regulator:
http://oregonmotorcycleparts.com/Reg_rec_units.html
Part Number:
VRR6ST11

Make sure to mention that you are from the ST Forum.

Cheers,
Adam
Cheers,
Adam

Forgive me for being ignorant, but when the 28 amp alts fail, is this usually the source of failure (and this upgrade be the fix?)?

If I'm wrong I'm sure I will be corrected, but I was always told that the regulator was the source of failure for the 28 amp alt. The reg would burn out and cause damage to the alt. Thats why they say if you change out the burned out reg, you should cut some of the wireing harness that may have been damaged.

If I can spen $99 instead of 1K for the 40 amp upgrade I'm all for it. SO far my 28 amp system has worked fine and I have not had a need for extra amps.

Cheers,
Adam

juddspaintballs said:

Forgive me for being ignorant, but when the 28 amp alts fail, is this usually the source of failure (and this upgrade be the fix?)?

Click to expand...

Hi Jed. Depends on what part of your 28amper's system fails. If it's just the OEM voltage regulator rectifier (pn:31600-MS2-601) and not one of the three stator windings (which usually results in a toasted VRR), then this is a cheaper aftermarket replacement. Service Honda wants ~$158 for the OEM VRR. This looks like a quality replacement part. Time will tell...

Just a word of caution here. I've been following ST1100 28amp alternator failures for years now. Anecdotally, there are too many acounts of replacement VRRs also failing in short order, to ignore. Something caused the original to fail and this must be identified and corrected if there's any hope of longevity of the replacement, OEM or aftermarket.

My recommendation: if your 28amp'd ST is getting a little long in the tooth but your voltmeter still shows the charging system operating OK, and you plan to keep it for some time to come, start saving for the 40amp upgrade parts. Keep your eye out for a salvage unit and you might be able to upgrade to a bulletproof 40amper for around twice the price of a 28amper's VRR.

Just my humble opinion. FWIW

Regards, John

93NJST said:

If I can spen $99 instead of 1K for the 40 amp upgrade I'm all for it. SO far my 28 amp system has worked fine and I have not had a need for extra amps.

Click to expand...

I looked up all parts new from discounthonda and it came to about $450 in parts (all necessary for the swap).

I am interested in this "fix" though, because I could very easily handle spending $100 should mine poop in the near future, but $450+ (probably closer to $600) would be harder to spend. I would like the 40 amp in the future, but this could be a good temporary fix at least.

Historically, failures of the stator itself seem to out number failures of the VRR by itself. I'll bet it's 10:1. Replacing a blown VRR is probably a waste of time as you will eventually have to do the upgrade anyway and now you've added another $100 to the cost of doing that!

I just installed the aftermarket reg and it seams to have bumped my system.
My OEM reg was only about three years old. I warmed up the bike and tested it at 2500RPM for both regs. Here is what I got:
OEM: 15.02
Aftermarket: 16.04

at 1100 RPM
OEM: 13.61
Aftermarket: 15.93

Not sure how everyone else's 28 amp system is but my headlights would get brighter around 1500+ rpm. With the aftermarket it gets bright at 1000 rpm. I'm trying to post the pics of the amp meter with the numbers listed above. For some reason they will not post. If anyone knows how, I can send them to you.


Cheers,
Adam

send pictures to jlgregory@cedarville.edu with "st1100 ammeter pictures" as the subject (i get lots of spam so i don't want to delete the email) and i'll host them for you, or at least try.

I just sent it to you.

Cheers,
Adam

there you go!

Interesting thread.

As I've posted in another thread, I hope to develop a mod that uses the 28amp's drive with the GL1500 or similar alt. The parts are arriving as I type.

Buddy at work (winger) donated an old GL1500 alt that needs brushes, and George graciously sent an old 28amp unit for the donor parts. I hope to start into this in the next week or two.

The GL alts can be picked up for $50-100 and if the conversion is fairly simple this would make for a much less expensive mod.

I'll keep you posted...

I've been interested in your modification, sirepair, from the first time I saw you mention it. Maybe if you get it worked out before I make it around to a 40 amp upgrade I could give your method a swing. 'Wing alts are easy to come by (my local starter/alt rebuilder has a few on his wall for sale even).

John has been sending me lots of alternator information, but until someone sends me a free alternator in the mail, I'm going to keep looking for the cheapest and still reliable solution.

Same here. If it's easy to do, I'm all in. Keep us posted. Will it use a gold wing reg or still work off of the original?

Cheers,
Adam

I have not examined the GL alt yet (just brought it home tonight), but I think the regulator is internal, as with the 40 amp. I'll let you know what I find out.

2500 rpm
OEM reg pic 0827
Aftermarket pic 0850
Image 0851 of bike at 2500 rpm

1100 rpm
OEM reg pic 0829
Aftermarket pic 0852
Image 0853 of bike at 1100 RPM
Image 0837 of the new reg in place.
I'm no mechanic and I had it in place in about 15 min. It was almost
longer to remove the seat, saddle bag, and side panel.

The guy said the part has a warrantee for life of the bike.

Cheers,
Adam

Click to expand...

Wow, almost 16 volts! I'm pretty sure that's above spec for the OEM unit. Will that high a system voltage cause any problems? Overcharged battery, blown bulb filaments, ECU errors/damage?

juddspaintballs said:

Click to expand...

Hmmm... The aftermarket VRR install knocks the main-fuse/starter-relay out of its mount...? If it were mine, I'd drill and tap some new holes in the muffler/footpeg holder plate and reorient this VRR. I see the OEM VRR 6-P connector is not used. How does this VRR connect to those 6 circuits?

[edit: answer to my Q from the Oregon website - "We have been unable to obtain the OEM plugs Honda uses to connect the regulator/rectifier unit. Our VRR6ST11 unit comes with a connector harness with 6" of wire and the necessary supplies to splice it to the wiring harness on your ST1100."]

Pat O:

I hope to develop a mod that uses the 28amp's drive with the GL1500 or similar alt. The parts are arriving as I type.

Click to expand...

IMO, the key to adapting an air-cooled, automotive type alternator like a GL1500's to the ST1100, is the interface between the alt and the alternator shaft assembly (the part that plugs into the engine and engages the flywheel). Assuming this alternator has a male splined input shaft, you're gonna have to go with the 40amper's female splined alt shaft. There's just no way to connect an alternator like that to the 28amper's alt shaft assy design, which simply has its stator bolted to it. You'll have to get a 40amper alt shaft assy or buy the extra parts and transfer the others from a 28amper, as per the upgrade procedure. Here's a picture that shows the obvious differences between the units:



28amp parts at the top, 40amp upgrade parts at the bottom.

[edit: OK, here's another picture showing the front of 40amper with the recess that engine oil splashes around in, and the O-ring on the outside of its front boss that fits into the alternator base. In front of the alternator is the Alternator Shaft Assembly that plugs into the engine and whose split-gears engage the flywheel.]



In my view, any non-ST1100 OEM 40amp alternator will have to have a splined shaft that matches the 40amper alt shaft assy's. In any case, I strongly suspect that a new alternator base will have to be made from scratch to match and interface with the front of the substitute alternator.

Keep in mind that engine oil lubricates the bearing at the base of the alternator shaft and passes thru it and the alternator base into the space between the outside of the alternator base and the front surface of the OEM 40amper (that's why there's the additional O-ring on the front of it). This may require that a replacement/substitute alternator have its front casing modified somehow... dunno what to say about that...

Also, other considerations are:
- is there enough room between the engine case and the frame crossmembers for the new alternator?
- can the new alternator pass between the frame crossmembers or must the engine be removed to install it?
- does the new alternator's bolt pattern match those on the ST1100 engine case?

Regards, John

Jeff,
I asked the shop if that was too many volts and they say yes. Here is what I was sent:
>Your bike is over charging. This is usually caused by a voltage drop
> between the red and black wires. The red wire is the output from the
> rectifier but the charging voltage is sensed at the black wire. The
> problem is usually caused by corroded contacts in the ignition switch
> but can be from corroded connections anywhere in the system.
>
> With my reg/rec you should still see full charging at 1200~1500 RPM
> but right now you're getting too much...

He also sent me a detailed e-mail on what to look for and how to correct the issue.


John,
Yes you do have to splice in a new connector but it was pretty easy.

Cheers,
Adam

John O, and all;
I did a quick inspect of the 2 alts last night. The GL1500 alt appears very similar to the one pictured above. I have to pull the front drive off to see if the shaft is splined or just an interference fit. Otherwise, it looks very promising.

I realize that I'll prolly have to make the adapter plate, but I have access to the necessary machinery.

More to come....

Pat, has the 28amper arrived?