1600 Faster than C14, But At What Costs?

[Gamecock]

I see in the new Cycle World that its testers preferred the $24,500 BMW K1600GT to the $15,500 Kawasaki C-14. Really!?! At that price, you'd hope so, right?

The reality is that you can generally find a new C-14 for the $13K range, so the price disparity is even greater than they indicated. Based on their figures, for a mere $10,000, you can shave all of 0.1 seconds off of the C-14's 0-60 time. Unfortunately, the Kawasaki will beat you to the quarter-mile mark by a couple of tenths.

I'm not a BMW basher and I'm not trying to start a thread that goes down that road. But I am always amazed when the glossy motorcycle magazines seem to jump all over the newest and fastest bandwagon while barely addressing SIGNIFICANT issues with a new bike. In this case, the price of the newest BMW sport-tourer is a significant issue, in my opinion. Kudos to Kawasaki for building a $15,000 (or less) bike that can hold its own with a $25,000 bike.

 

[Mellow]

Re: Faster, But At What Costs?

I see in the new Cycle World that its testers preferred the $24,500 BMW K1600GT to the $15,500 Kawasaki C-14.

Preferred doesn't simply mean the bike was faster... there are lots of things on that new BMW that are not on the C14.. some 'prefer' that and some 'prefer' a bike with less 'things' on it...

The 1600 is a pretty cool bike but just like the wing, out of my price range. Whatever new ST comes out... it just may be out of my range as well so when it's time to replace my ST1300 - I just don't see that happening soon - it just may be my next choice of Sport Touring bike - which is a C14.

 

[W0QNX]

Re: Faster, But At What Costs?

I quit worrying about fastest bike I could buy in 1979 the year after I bought my XS1100. Don't need to go faster then that bike would ever again.

I'm into miles of comfort at a low cost by far now. ST does that pretty good.

Raymond

 

[Bones]

Preference is indeed a difficult thing to quantify. I had a chance to check out the K16GT and K16GTL side by side up close and personal (short of a test ride) with their respective owners and other riders at QuebecSTOC. They have some very cool features, not all of which I'd want on a motorcycle, but cool nonetheless. The complexity of these machines is mind boggling, a testament to BMW's creativity and innovation. I guess "simple is good" has long since gone by the wayside with touring bikes as they just keep getting more and more complicated. BMW is introducing new machines in this category, and other manufacturers are either working on new ones or making incremental upgrades to their existing ones, which is more than we can say for Honda.

One feature that stood out to me is the bars seem very long, more like tillers than handlebars, even more so than the Wing. The dash is bright, legible and busy as hell...will the sheer volume of information available turn operators into distracted riders? I don't know, just curious. I wonder if BMW has decided that symmetry in design is categorically bad. The flip out air scoops are a nice touch and well designed. I like how BMW mounts air valves.

What's looks good is subjective but neither of these K's looks good to my eye. The face looks like an owl, the body doesn't flow from front to back, the bags look huge but are small inside...overall it just doesn't do it for me. "Quirky" fits. Especially if I was dropping that much coin on a motorcycle I'd want the design to make my spine tingle just looking at it. Not happening. The K13GT is a much nicer looking bike if you ask me, and the RT better looking yet. I'd probably be riding an RT if it came with a motor I like. I still love the look of the ST...no other sport tourer integrates its bags so well into its overall design. On every other sport tourer they look tacked on. The flip side is the ST looks wrong with the bags off, but I never ride with the bags off so that's not a concern.

Someday I'll get down to the BMW dealer in Connecticut and take a K16GT for a spin. Like to take a new Tiger 800 for a spin, too (they're in the showroom next door) as that would be an ideal step or two up from my Versys. I'm eagerly awaiting the Triumph Trophy (as Triumph has been impressing me more than any other manufacturer the past couple years) and also the next ST (as I still like Honda's approach to things...assuming there ever is a new ST).

 

[DaveST]

BMW is a good ride. That's why I ended up with a ST13 instead of a BMW R12 in 2007. Number one issue with BMW was cost and the K bikes where/ are higher yet. I liked almost everything else better on the R!2 (ride, weight, wind management, factory accessories) but I just couldn't do that money on a motorcycle. A toy in my case. I rode it to work often but didn't need to. I have other cars. If the BMW was closer in cost I would have gone for it.
That's got to be one hell of a motorcycle for $25k of my dough. I thought I never would spend $14k on a bike when I bought the ST13. Crazy.
I agree with Bones. My next bike might be a Triumph. I like the looks of the Tiger but have not rode one yet.

 

[squirrel Hunter]

Re: Faster, But At What Costs?

I quit worrying about fastest bike I could buy in 1979 the year after I bought my XS1100. Don't need to go faster then that bike would ever again.

I'm into miles of comfort at a low cost by far now. ST does that pretty good.

Raymond

Pretty much sums it up for me to, I bought my 84 V65 Saber because it had a shaft drive and water cooling and the BMW was twice the price but not twice the bike.

When the ST1100 came out things were reversed, it was twice the bike at half the price

 

[DonMac]

Re: Faster, But At What Costs?

I loved my 84 V65 Sabre. At the time it was the baddest and best bike around. Now my 98 ST1100 is the "sleeper" the Sabre was.
Don McDonald

 

[Coop]

If we all liked the same things, we would all be wearing the same color Speedo's!!

 

[charliebrown]

I agree with Raymond. I decided there was a lot of things more important about a bike than its 0-60 times or top speed. Ergonomics for one. The best engine in the world won't do me much good if the bike stays in my garage because it's too uncomfortable to ride. I guess that's why people argue about bikes so much. What's important for me may not be so important for the next guy.

 

[George]

If we all liked the same things, we would all be wearing the same color Speedo's!!

The man really knows how to cut it to the core. Thanks, Coop.

 

[jimbeauxk]

I have a new ST, purchased at the end of June of this year. Truth be told, I was out to get a 1200RT. What turned me off was that I went to the BMW dealership to take a look, and all the bikes they had were dressed to the top of the line, and priced as such. When I asked if there were any without the excessive options (satellite radio system, etc.), I was told no, there was such high demand and low supply that the dealership had to pay extra freight just to get them in, and that cost would be passed onto me, so I should buy one of the premium bikes in stock. I guess in this economy, I wasn't buying it. Literally.

Not out to bash BMW, and sometimes I still wonder "what if?", but I'm at peace with the $7k or so less I had to pay for the ST. I, too, really question all the comparisons that are made among the sport touring bikes, with BMW consistently coming out on top. Not sure it's an apples to apples comparison, it's almost like putting a Lexus in with a Camry and saying the Lexus comes out ahead, then footnoting that there's a premium you will pay for the Lexus. Sometimes you have to assess your needs and figure that into the calculation, and I needed that $7k more than I needed the satellite radio.

 

[pepollock]

Jim, I picked up a 2011 R1200RT in May. It didn't have every gadget known to mankind, or even BMW, but I had to wait a bit for it to come down the pipeline - pretty much like I wanted it. It didn't cost me $7K more than I could get a new ST13 for, either. (I don't understand Honda dealers trying to get sticker price for a two-year-old leftover that's been taking up space in their showroom for -well- two years.) Still plenty of $$$ more for the BMW, anyway. Of course, there are no 2011 STs, or maybe no more ST1300s ever. I was quite impressed with the R-RT and was tired of waiting for the next-gen Honda ST.

The Concours is, and has always been, the best bang-for-the-buck sport-tourer, hands down. What's good about Kawasaki is they fixed a couple of problems that owners complained about (heat, mainly) without jacking the price. Hello Honda, are you listening??? The Connie 14 is a great motorcycle. Like the FJR I just had, I never managed to bond with it or get comfortable for more than a hour. So my choice came down to the RT or the ST. But don't bash the BMW K1600s. They are pretty terrific bikes, just not the bang-for-the-buck winners.

And, sorry, Coop. I don't wear Speedo's. We should all be glad for that!

pete

 

[86Magna]

I love my ST and would keep it if it were just me riding it. Currently I have over 35K miles on it.
But the the wife wants to come along and having to have a GW in the garage too I'm looking to only have one MC. I pretty much put the same amount of miles on both the last two years and was looking for something that fit our needs. The K1600 GTL seems to fit the bill. For me the Connie would be more of the same and just keeping the GW........well let's just say it wasn't for me. The wife likes the K1600 so everyone is happy. Am I excited to pay 26K? No. But the kids are now off to college and we have more time to do what we like. For me its not about speed its about having what works for us. Just my two cents.

 

[Lanny]

They all have strenths and weaknesses and greatly varied pricing. After doing all my research and riding the ST was the right fit for me. If my wife liked riding 2 up I can't say I wouldn't take a hard look at the K1600GTL..

 

[nhdiesel]

When I bought my ST I had been shopping and choosing a bike for a while...truth be told, ever since just after buying my KLR back in '06. At that time I "settled" by buying a lesser bike than I wanted (DL1000) to save cost. I regretted it within weeks, although I did enjoy the KLR. I just found I ended up doing almost 100% street riding and a little touring, rather than hitting some trails and lots of dirt roads, as I had planned.

Because of what I found my riding to be, when it came time to decide again, my wife told me to buy the bike I wanted, whatever that may be. I agreed. At the time I thought my job was stable, and money was pretty good, so I could have bought any bike I wanted. It was a tough choice, and yes, I did even investigate a few BMWs. While they are nice bikes, I had questions of reliability of final drives (whether a real problem or not, the hesitation was there); and they just don't have the dealer network Honda does. Its nice to know if I break down in East NoWhere, there is a dealer close by. And i just didn't see the extra features being worth all the extra money.

My choice came down to an ST (both 1100 and 1300 were possible) or a DL1000. The DL lost out because its chain drive. After a serious issue with the chain on the KLR which left me stranded, and nearly got me killed (even though its a one in a million thing), it gave me concern...so chain was out. The 1100 finally lost out because I wanted injection, the powered windshield looked nice (and now I love it), and I was just a little concerned about what issues might arise on an older 1100. Again, unsubstantiated, but its hard to fight a gut feeling. that left either new or used 1300. I found new for $14k, but knowing the reliability of the ST, I had no hesitation buying a clean used one for almost half the price.

There are some other bikes with features I would like that the ST doesn't have, but either they are on a bike I don't want, or the cost of the features isn't justified to me. I would love to see what the hype is over the BMW, but for now it isn't the bike for me. The same for a Wing. Maybe someday, if my wife ends up doing more pillion riding, but for now its more bike than I want. Very nice, and I would love to use one for a trip, but I don't want one for my only bike right now.

There will always be a fancier, shinier, faster, better handling, more comfortable, cheaper, etc. bike than an ST, but the ST has the best balance of all the things I want wrapped into one package. But thats just me, and everyone has their own needs and wants.

Jim

 

[TomD]

Before I bought the ST, my heart was set on an R1200RT. I still love the styling on that bike. I didn't like the engine or low speed handling. Although the K1200GTwas more money, not a major factor at the time, and I really fell in love with the power, it wasn't the right bike. The riding position was to sporty for me and the engine felt kind of like every other in-line 4 cylinder bike I ever rode. Although the ST is one of the slower sport touring machines, the engine is great on the street and that is where I ride. Most of all, the bike is comfortable for me. Having more power is always nice, but the ST rockets past 100 MPH. The bike is very well powered and it is useable from just off idle. These bikes are all so fast, I would put power on the rear burner. I did and I am really happy I did.

Tom

 

[86Magna]

If you set your mind to it, DIY service on a 26K bike is no different than on the ST. I did my own service on the GW and originaly it was over 24k without much issue. It's just walking through the steps and research.
The K1600 board is starting to have some good "how to" posts out there that a very thorough. It's the nature of those who ride motorcycles to want to DIY and it's only a matter of time before those things are posted.
BTW the 600 mile service on the GTL is anywhere from $200-250.

 

[lddave]

I have a C14 and took a 30 plus demo ride on the BMW . I would own the BMW but I would have to sell al my motorcycles to have the $ to purchase it . The C14 and the BMW are not in the same class so comparing them against each other is not fair to either .


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- Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Dave

 

[bygdawg]

Having owned both an ST 1300 and a Concours 1400 now, I can honestly say that they are, in my opinion, two of the best sport touring bikes out there for the money. That isn't to say that the FJR isn't good also. It just isn't right for me. In looking at the differences between the BMW and the Connie, I think I would love the on the fly ability to adjust the suspension. I am also sure I'd like a few of the other gadgets. However, I am not sure that I would like the extra weight and the duolever front setup. In the review, I think they missed the mark on stating that the C14 is hard to turn. It is not, providing you have the proper tires and tire pressure. All of that being said, the cost of maintenance for the BMW, the initial up front cost, and the dealer network are all deal breakers for me. However, if you have the money to get the BMW, you probably aren't worried about maintenance cost. This is kind of the same theory I go by with owners of $250,000+ motor homes. I always hear people, in regards to those people, saying, "I bet they hate putting gas in that thing." I just kind of laugh and tell them that I doubt they worry about that too much. Like many others have said, it all boils down to what you like, and what you can or are willing to pay for. Let's face it. We are all splurging a bit on a sport that we enjoy a great deal. After all, you only go around once, right?

 

[Kempo-STer]

But don't bash the BMW K1600s. They are pretty terrific bikes, just not the bang-for-the-buck winners.

It wasn't a bash, simple statement of fact...14K vs 25K...