Considering a Beemer. Questions...

[rickj]

As much of a fan as I am of the FJR, I'm considering moving to a R1200RT. (Actually, a K1300GT may still be in the running.) This is probably earth shattering news for those of you that have ridden with me, but I think I've come to a point where I may want a little less "sport" and a bit more "touring".

There are two main issues that have me considering this move:
1- The creature comforts such as ESA, heated grips / seat, cruise control, better wind protection, and more storage for camping gear, etc.
2- I really like the idea of having a front end that doesn't dive under heavy braking. BMW's design intrigues me.

I'm well aware that I would be moving to a platform that isn't as reliable as the Yamaha, and I am concerned about expensive repairs such as the much publicized final drive issues. I understand that these problems are generally a thing of the past, but I haven't read any specifics. Is anyone aware if there is a model year at which point they had resolved the issues? I'll likely be looking at a 2007. I don't think I can afford one newer than that, and the 2007 model had some improvements over the prior years. Seems like the sweet spot for me.

On the first point, I have a silent secondary goal that Marilyn may actually be more interested in riding with me again if she's more comfortable. The Feejer is pretty comfortable according to her, but the RT would definitely be more comfortable. While I can add some more creature comforts to the Feejer like heated grips and cruise control, I don't think it's smart for me to continue dumping money in to a bike that I feel like I'm outgrowing.

Yeah, I'll be giving up some horsepower, but I'm sure that shedding another 70 lbs. and the flickable nature of the RT will compensate for it. I'm supposed to be slowing down a bit anyway.

Comments / experience with the telelever much appreciated. I did replace my front springs last year, but the valving is likely worn out (or I'm on the brakes too much!)

Any and all comments welcome.

Thanks in advance.

Rick

 

[Gerhard]

I think the year that there was a major redesign was 2010 that resolved a lot of problems for the RT, it came with new switch gear that had some issues for a lot of people knock on wood mine has been trouble free. I know some people don't like the RT's vibration at idle but it isn't like some high pitch vibration that puts your hand to sleep and is gone once you are on the go. The sitting position is a little more upright than I had on my ST1100 and the arms are spread a little wider which makes cornering easier. Cherie really likes this bike she has probably ridden more with me in the last two years than the previous 12 combined. After a days ride with a telelever front end it seems totally normal and you are surprised when riding a normal bike and you experience a lot of dive on hard braking.

Gerhard

 

[CDNolddude]

I also really like the R1200RT and would like to get one but but have the usual concerns.. reliability, dealer network, cost etc.
I've ridden the 2005-2009 version and didn't like it near as much as the 2010 and new version which
is really nice. The vibs on the earlier version bothered me.. the newer one is much smooter to me.

You can get a lot of info here....
http://www.bmwlt.com/forums/cmps_index.php

2007 models built before July do not have a final drive drain plug.. most people say get one that does have it.
good luck

 

[Garry in AZ]

While I generally like the Bavarian products, in my opinion you would be wise to avoid their bikes made between about 2003 or 4 and 2010. For example, in the 2007 Iron Butt Rally, 12 BMW's DNF'd, with the majority of the failures due to final drive problems. Several BMW riders were actually carrying spare FD's with them! However, in fairness, there were 4 BMW's in the top five on that rally, and since then, BMW's have consistently finished well, and my friends who ride the newer versions seem to think the final drive problem is actually fixed. And these are riders who habitually ride more than 30,000 miles per year.
Personally, IMHO, I have ridden an R1200RT, and I certainly prefer my ST. The ST has more grunt, less vibration, better fuel economy and equal if not better weather protection. Options like heated grips and cruise control are easy aftermarket add ons to the ST. I believe it's also less expensive to maintain if you ride a lot. But the RT is a very nice motorcycle, and many folks love them. Good luck with whatever you decide.

Garry

 

[Rambler358]

Perhaps also take a look at the K1600s.

 

[Bravo616]

Rick, I was also once looking at the K1300 and waited for the K1600. The final drive and other issues steered me away. I've heard good things about the RT but still there is inconsistency in terms of reliability. The good thing is that the boxer is easy to wrench on. If you buy used get the service record. Some will have transferrable aftermarket warranties. There are great bargains out there, take your time and find that right bike.

 

[rickj]

Perhaps also take a look at the K1600s.

Not interested or able to consider the K16. I have a buddy with the K16 and I have ridden it. An amazing machine, but way too big for me. Also, my max budget will likely be $10K to $11K, which is why I'm looking at 2007'ish range. Also the reason I'm researching the final drive issue, as it may be the time when there were a fair amount of the failures.

 

[rickj]

I think the year that there was a major redesign was 2010 that resolved a lot of problems for the RT, it came with new switch gear that had some issues for a lot of people knock on wood mine has been trouble free. I know some people don't like the RT's vibration at idle but it isn't like some high pitch vibration that puts your hand to sleep and is gone once you are on the go. The sitting position is a little more upright than I had on my ST1100 and the arms are spread a little wider which makes cornering easier. Cherie really likes this bike she has probably ridden more with me in the last two years than the previous 12 combined. After a days ride with a telelever front end it seems totally normal and you are surprised when riding a normal bike and you experience a lot of dive on hard braking.

Gerhard

Thanks for your comments. It would be great if I could pony up and get a 2010, but I doubt that I'll be able to swing that much. I've also read and heard that the 2010 saw some nice improvements. You're confirming what I am hoping though with Cherie though! Perhaps Marilyn will ride more if I had a more suitable bike for her.

Rick

 

[rickj]

Thanks for the feedback so far!

A buddy of mine is recommending that I consider the R1200GS. I have ridden his several times and enjoyed riding it, but I'm not sure if it would work out as my only bike. Main concern is wind protection, and I'm pretty sure Marilyn would be getting far more buffeting on the back as compared to the RT.

Comments welcome though...

 

[pepollock]

The K1300s are every bit as sporty as your FJR. If you want more touring in your sport-touring BMW, that would be the RT. Getting a 2010 or later would be a good thing as they have worked out the reliability issues by then. There are some continuing issues with switch gear and the "fuel strip" fuel level system (replaced by the old float system in 2011 to solve that problem) But I have found my 2011 R1200RT to be as reliable as any bike I've ever owned, including a 2003 ST1300. FYI, there is a current recall on several models and years of BMW for a fuel pump leak but that would be a free fix. Specific details could be found on the NHTSA and BMWMOA sites.

I'm very happy with my RT but I think the ST1300 is even more "touring" and probably more comfortable for two-up riding.

pete

 

[jmcarruth]

A friend traded his 2007 K1300 for a brand new 2012 R1200RT and had multiple suspension and electrical issues with it. Disgusted, he kept it about eight months and traded it for a new 2013 FJR. He is happy with it except it came delivered with warped rotor(s), which were replaced under warranty.
He is a long time BMW rider who now calls them overpriced, overrated German junk and is now a true Japanese bike fan.

 

[Muchmore]

To bad poor posts like this come into a good informative thread for the original poster.

A friend traded his 2007 K1300 for a brand new 2012 R1200RT and had multiple suspension and electrical issues with it. Disgusted, he kept it about eight months and traded it for a new 2013 FJR. He is happy with it except it came delivered with warped rotor(s), which were replaced under warranty.
He is a long time BMW rider who now calls them overpriced, overrated German junk and is now a true Japanese bike fan.

 

[rickj]

The K1300s are every bit as sporty as your FJR. If you want more touring in your sport-touring BMW, that would be the RT. Getting a 2010 or later would be a good thing as they have worked out the reliability issues by then. There are some continuing issues with switch gear and the "fuel strip" fuel level system (replaced by the old float system in 2011 to solve that problem) But I have found my 2011 R1200RT to be as reliable as any bike I've ever owned, including a 2003 ST1300. FYI, there is a current recall on several models and years of BMW for a fuel pump leak but that would be a free fix. Specific details could be found on the NHTSA and BMWMOA sites.

I'm very happy with my RT but I think the ST1300 is even more "touring" and probably more comfortable for two-up riding.

pete

Thanks, Pete. I have another friend I ride with who does have a K1300GT and we have swapped bikes. The K13 feels very similar to the FJR in terms of power, seating position, etc., but much more refined. The bend in the knees is about the same as the FJR, but I don't know of any after-market freeway pegs. My knees do ache on very long rides with the FJR, but I have some freeway pegs to get some relief and I also stand up riding quite a bit. I think the RT would have more of the "tour" that I am looking for.

Great information coming, which I appreciate. I'm well aware tat the Beemers have some reliability issues, but I'm mainly interested in specific years issues to be aware of. Sounds like 2010 was the year that perhaps most of the big "gotchas" were addressed.

Rick

 

[rickj]

Man, to further complicate my thought process, I think a R1200GS may be in the mix for consideration. I am planning a ride to Alaska in the Summer of 2015, and had planned on finding a well used (inexpensive) beater GS12 for that trip. However, a buddy is suggesting that I consider a late model R1200GS as my only bike.

Gotta chew on that for a bit...

I wish I could afford two bikes right now.

Rick

 

[Mellow]

Rick, IMO.. get a super tenere.. you get a GS without the pricetag.. well, sorta..

 

[Garry in AZ]

Not to dissuade you from buying whatever you want, (it's your money, after all) I have to second Mellow on the Tenere recommendation. Great bike, economical to own and operate, and seems like good resale value as well. Better yet, don't buy anything... ride your FJR, and save the money for a better vacation.

Oh, and one other comment regarding your trip to Alaska. You do not need any sort of adventure bike to ride almost anywhere in AK. If you are planning on riding the haul road to Deadhorse, just rent a KLR in Fairbanks. I've been to Alaska three times. Twice on Harley's and once on my ST. Attempted the Haul Road on a borrowed KLR but only made it to Coldfoot due to weather. Next time!

Garry

 

[CarSalesman]

I've owned both Honda and BMW, several models of each. After not riding at all for 20 years, I bought an ST1100 in 2000. Loved it, although since I was basically a beginner motorcyclist it was a lot to handle. Dropped it a few times...

After a few years I wanted something with more wind protection for 2-up travels. Bought a new 2004 K1200LT. I had zero problems with it, but they don't call the LT the Light Truck for nothing. We never bonded with it. We called it The Buick. We ride 2-up, and every time we would go to the garage and say "which one", it was always the ST. Sold the LT after two years. Nothing bad to say about BMW, just didn't like the LT.

The ST1100 was the only thing in the garage, and I wanted something lighter for dirt road exploring. I wanted an R1200GS but didn't want to spend that much so I bought a used Vstrom. Fixed it up with cases, windshield, bars, etc. Liked it, but it took a lot of customizing to make it into a good bike. Could tell the parts were made by the low bidder.

In 2008 I found a leftover new 2007 R1200GS and bought it. Also a lot of customizing, but not because the bike is weak. Just to make it what I wanted. The GS has never broken. I learned how to do the valve adjustments and other maintenance because the Dealer is 100 miles away, and also because I like to do it. They say the GS engine gets smoother with miles on it, and they're right. About 5k miles it was a different bike. Also changed the header to one without a cat converter, and that made it much smoother. Don't know why but it is. I've had the GS now for six years. The differential has not leaked or broken. The fuel gauge has not broken (I think mine is the mechanical float). The anti theft antenna ring never failed (since replaced under recall). Yes I've done maintenance and upgrades, but NOTHING has ever broken on the GS.

In 2010 I decided that after 10 years I wanted a change from the ST1100. After 10 years nothing had ever broken. NOTHING. I liked the GS but wanted more wind protection for 2-up, so isn't that what the R1200RT is all about? I bought a 2008 R1200RT. Liked it, but not loved it. Especially 2-up it did not have the smooth torque I was used to with the ST1100 (which I still had at that point). Even my wife said "this thing doesn't have enough oomph", because I would have to flog it going up hills. I only kept the RT a few months. On to a new owner. Handles nicely, but the engine which is so nice on the GS just doesn't do it for me with the RT. Maybe its weight, maybe its gearing, I dont' know. It had the rider-adjustable suspension, and although you could change things the basic shocks were so poorly made, there really was no good position.

A month later I ran into a fellow wanting to sell his 1yr old 2010 ST1300. Took it for a ride. Ah... I am home. Has that torque that just gushes with no effort. Engine is glass smooth. The suspension does not have adjustable damping (other than rear rebound) but it still rides better than the RT in any mode.

So... what is BMW ownership like? For me there were no breakdowns or issues with any of them. Other than the GS I just didn't bond with any of them. Leaving an ST for the RT? IMHO that's a downgrade. Now possibly the new K1600? I could see that someday. The R1200GS is a surprisingly good touring bike. Although it doesn't push the wind aside like the bigger bikes, it seems to go through the wind easier with little turbulence. People ride 2-up on the GS but the passenger is very unprotected, my wife won't ride there. If 2-up is not important to you, I would consider a GS.

 

[rickj]

Wow. Some great feedback. Much appreciated.

Joe, I hadn't even considered the Super Tenere, but I may look at it. The main guy I ride with (Maldos) has the R1200GS, which I have ridden several times and like it. He also has a K16, which doesn't appeal to me. I may take a look at the S-T.

Garry, Yeah, I'm aware that I don't need an adventure bike to ride Alaska. (I rode up there in '96 on a FJ1200!) However, I'm hoping to do the South Canol road and the Dempster highway as far as Eagle Plains. I hadn't thought about renting a KLR for the Dempster though. I suppose it's an option. I like the idea of riding up through BC and finishing up in Anchorage where we ship the bikes back. I suppose renting for the entire ride up there is an option, but we'd miss the ride through BC. We're still in he planning phases of the trip so all options are still on the table. Thanks for the tips!

Don, Thanks for the extensive history with your bikes! I have to admit that I haven't ridden the RT yet, but I plan to do so pretty soon. I remember that I had tested an old R1100RT back before I bought my '90 FJ1200 and thought it was way too anemic, and I fell in love with the inline 4 of the FJ. It's interesting that you liked the same engine in the GS far more than the RT. Probably has to do with different expectations a bit, as well as gearing and the extra wind protection that likely robs it of horsepower compared to the GS.

All these comments are much appreciated as I go through this decision process.

Rick

 

[dkjkwood]

I had a 2009 RT and currently ride a 2010 K1300GT. I've put 50,000 miles on each of them and the only problem I've had is a faulty fuel pump controller on the RT.
I wouldn't hesitate to purchase another one.

The K bike engines will be more to your liking, the R bikes will be more comfortable.

 

[HeliMark]

Rick, IMO.. get a super tenere.. you get a GS without the pricetag.. well, sorta..

+1

First off, really loved my '12 RT. Camheads are nice, and very very nice for distance riding. But two things got in the way. I wanted an adventure bike to do both distance, and when I got to where ever I ended up, fire/forrest roads that led to more adventure off the beaten path. Second was the reliability issues and cost that I was having with my RT. I went with the Tenere as I did not want to worry about reliability issues miles in the back country. And what a great bike.

Mark