New Mechanical Seal Installed... Have Questions

[SainT 1300]

I just picked up my front cover with the new seals and bearings installed. I wish I have taken pictures of both sides before I took it in. On the impeller side, I can see what looks like a spring exposed between the cover and the impeller. Then there is a ring and a rubber seal. It seems to me that the impeller is not pressed enough into the cover.

I would like some opinions before I go back to the Honda dealer and make a fool of myself. It's easier to make of fool of myself right here.

 

[970mike]

You may want to post a picture of what you are seeing to give everyone a chance to reply.

 

[SainT 1300]

Cannot upload image!!!

 

[SainT 1300]

See if this picture came thru. There seems to be too much of a gap between the impeller and the case. You can see the metal ring is exposed.

 

[SainT 1300]

Ah ha!!! Finally got the picture to attach. You can clearly see the spring under the seal. I may visit the dealer tomorrow. Also, I measured the shaft tip to the case before I took it in. It was roughly 29/33. It is now 27/32. Seems like it needs to be pressed in some more.

 

[Al st1100]

That looks about right- hold cover in place without gasket. Turn water pump it should spin freely. You could put a piece of play dough inside and press the pump on to check clearance, I don't know if there is a spec. 1/8 or 1/16 should be ok.

 

[SainT 1300]

Thanks for the replies. Checking the clearance between the impeller and the cover was one of the things I will check tomorrow in the shop/garage. It just looks strange with the spring exposed. As long as it doesn't leak I will be happy. I would hate to put it back together and then have to go thru the whole process again.

 

[SainT 1300]

Since I have no Play Doh in stock, I will go to next level of the scientific method. I will see how many layers of tortillas will fit...starting with 1 ...

 

[SainT 1300]

Chapter VI ... As the Impeller Turns.

I checked the clearance between the water pump impeller and the pump cover today. I could tell by just putting the cover on that it was touching. Turning the impeller caused it to scrape some aluminum off the cover. The cover did not lay quite flat. Slightly able to rock the cover because the impeller was too tall.

Back to the Honda dealer and the guys in the shop admitted there is a problem. The shaft is very hard to turn, so they did not press it all the way in. They did have it all the way in at one time and they said it was even harder to turn.

The way it is right now, you cannot turn the shaft with your fingers alone. Yes, you can turn the shaft if you use the impeller, and it doesn't turn easily. Just grasping the geared side with your fingers will not allow you to turn the shaft, almost, but not there. A pair of pliers on the shaft will allow you to turn it without much effort.

They are going to press the shaft all the way home, and it will still be hard to turn the shaft. I hope it will loosen up after the engine runs for some miles. I hope. They don't offer an answer why it is hard to turn at this point.

I am glad that I took some measurements before they got it for service...I should have taken some pictures. I would hate to put the whole schameel back together, only to take it apart again.

 

[ChucksKLRST]

The SERVICE manual says that the shaft should be pressed in 24 mm. I don't have my manual handy. How ever I know it is in the book as I have rebuilt the water pump on my old ST1300.

https://www.st-owners.com/forums/showthread.php?87086-(Urgent)-Water-pump-impeller-depth&highlight=

Do a search on this forum, there is a lot of discussion about the water pump rebuild.

 

[SainT 1300]

Thanks Chuck.

Should the shaft be really hard to turn after a rebuild. That's what's got the Honda dealer service department stumped.

 

[ChucksKLRST]

Thanks Chuck.

Should the shaft be really hard to turn after a rebuild. That's what's got the Honda dealer service department stumped.

If I remember it was a bit stiffer to turn because of the new seals. Not hard just stiffer.

 

[SMSW]

I'm going to stick my neck out here. I have zero experience with the water pump on a 1300, but I have replaced auto water pumps and more than a few automotive related parts with new oil seals. Just on the basis of standard mechanical knowledge, the shaft should NOT be so hard to turn that you need pliers. I'd suggest you PM a member like Larry - IGOFAR - who is, as far as I am concerned, one of the expert mechanics on this site. (Full disclosure, I had a question, I PM'ed him, and he was gracious enough to respond with a phone number and he talked me through the procedure and gave me a lot of help!).

If the local Honda dealer doesn't have enough smarts to figure this out, or experience to definitively say this stiffness is expected or not, I'd start looking for another dealer before you damage your engine.

 

[SainT 1300]

The only dealer in town. Experiences like this push
many of us to turn our own wrenches.

 

[SupraSabre]

I have a brand new cover with the waterpump installed, let me take some pictures and post them!

Okay, here are some pics:




This last one shows how far the shaft should be sticking out the back:

 

[Honda-st-team]

Thanks for the info

 

[Igofar]

I just picked up my front cover with the new seals and bearings installed. I wish I have taken pictures of both sides before I took it in. On the impeller side, I can see what looks like a spring exposed between the cover and the impeller. Then there is a ring and a rubber seal. It seems to me that the impeller is not pressed enough into the cover.

I would like some opinions before I go back to the Honda dealer and make a fool of myself. It's easier to make of fool of myself right here.

Install the water pump shaft into the water pump bearing to 24mms (0.94in) while holding the bearing inner race.
Problem may be the bearing, seal, and shaft should be pressed in with the correct tools, however most the ones I have seen installed (most recent one on a 2012 model) were whacked Into place with a ball peen hammer, which cracked and damaged the mechanical seal etc. The last one I saw replaced by a local dealer leaked worse by the time the owner got home.
I would demand to know what procedure the mechanic followed and if it was pressed in or hammered in.
.02

 

[LetErBuck]

Supra Sabre, how freely does yours turn?? I believe Igofar has hit or maybe pressed the issue on the head

 

[Igofar]

When pressed in correctly, the shaft should turn freely with very little resistance.
The shop should have used a depth gauge, or at least made one (a HD front axle spacer turned down to 24mms works nicely) this way the white ceramic seal is gently pressed into place and not cracked or damage when pounded in with a hammer. If I am understanding your description correctly, if the push it in even further (all the way) then they are installing it wrong and not following the instructions in the honda service manual. I wish you lived closer....
PM me a contact number if you would like to discuss it on the white courtesy phone :call:

 

[SupraSabre]

Supra Sabre, how freely does yours turn?? I believe Igofar has hit or maybe pressed the issue on the head

There is some resistance, it isn't supposed to spin freely. But it's turning about the same as the '05 when I replaced it a few years back.