Now I'm glad we only have Pan Weave to worry about

[sky.high]

Check out

@ 8:30 min

 

[Erdoc48]

Quite interesting…I know of the Pan Weave (not a general known thing on the 1100), but I will state that, according to my brother who has the 04 in the garage in Colorado, after tightening up the swing arm with the Honda specialty tool (and the bike has the OEM top box), he’s had the bike well up in the speed range, and, well…nothing. No weave, straight as an arrow. Just conjecture of course, but I do wonder if Pan Weave is a function of the swing arm lateral movement at its pivot point, even if a trivial amount. Watching that HD ultimately spin out was painful to watch.

 

[Sadlsor]

I've never been, and in all probability never will be, a Harley fanboy.
I know, I know.
It's a personal problem. But guess I'll just have to learn to live with it. (And not to worry, I have.)
That said, I no longer feel the need to make fun of them (but I sometimes will make fun of the riders, if it's called for.)
Enough rambling. Fortnine is one of the most entertaining and creative video producers out there.
And the fact that his videos are bike-centric doesn't hurt at all!

 

[Kevcules]

I think there is quite a large group of "never been Harley fans". I'm in there also.
Why wouldn't you want a bike that costs an arm and a leg, shakes worse than a six cylinder with three bad cylinders, leaks oil for fun and seems to enjoy breaking down?

 

[rwthomas1]

It is interesting that he focused on the twin shock rear suspension setup of the Dyna. As if twin shock swingarms were a Harley only design. Everyone knows that the twin shock swingarm was used by virtually EVERY manufacturer in the past. Every Single One. So why was the Dyna singled out? My guess is that the frame, and swingarm itself are/were not rigid enough. Its not a bad configuration when there are so many other successful iterations of it. I'm not about to condemn a machine based on one video, when I don't know the history of that machine. I suspect that a properly maintained Dyna, that is with the swingarm clearances in spec, is not a problem when ridden normally. I'm not a Harley fan either, don't really care for the styling, and to be honest the "culture" that surrounds them. All that said, I have some time in a Road King saddle. Its a very nice all around machine. Yes, big and heavy, but I can pop down to the store and put my purchases in the hard bags. After that I can ooze down the highway effortlessly, and indefinitely in relative comfort. And with stock pipes and no mods they are quiet and from what I have seen, reliable. I've ridden a lot worse....

RT

 

[sky.high]

I learnt quite a bit from this video, never new the Fatboy was named after 'the bomb' happy to say I never made that connection and the synchronised plug firing trick is more than lazy, its hilarious. Great the way Ryan explains how 'beneficial' the engine vibration is when the bike is in motion when the Japanese manufacturers solve that problem by just making incredibly vibration free engines in all types of configurations LOL

 

[rwthomas1]

the synchronised plug firing trick is more than lazy, its hilarious.

Its called a "waste spark ignition system" and it is very common. Used on air-cooled BMW's, and many other machines. Its done to make the ignition system simpler and more reliable, in the era prior to coil-on-plug ignition. In fact, due to the fact that our ST's have only TWO ignition coils, the system is firing TWO plugs every time. I'm willing to bet thats one plug on on the power stroke, and one on the exhaust when this happens. Which would make it a waste spark ignition system as well....

RT

 

[Mophead]

Yeah and if you want a real tank slapper grab one of their Springer front ended bikes. I personnally know two who have gone down on those and they were both very veteran riders. When a Harley rider swears off on a Harley you had better listen.

 

[Andrew Shadow]

...... I do wonder if Pan Weave is a function of the swing arm lateral movement at its pivot point, even if a trivial amount.

Have a read of the ST1300 section of this article for an explanation;
THE TRUTH ABOUT THE ST1300

 

[Sadlsor]

Its called a "waste spark ignition system" and it is very common. Used on air-cooled BMW's, and many other machines. Its done to make the ignition system simpler and more reliable, in the era prior to coil-on-plug ignition. In fact, due to the fact that our ST's have only TWO ignition coils, the system is firing TWO plugs every time. I'm willing to bet thats one plug on on the power stroke, and one on the exhaust when this happens. Which would make it a waste spark ignition system as well....

RT

Are you channeling Kevin Cameron?
(Cycle magazine, TDC column for those too young to remember.)

 

[Sadlsor]

Have a read of the ST1300 section of this article for an explanation;
THE TRUTH ABOUT THE ST1300

I must say, that's a tad disconcerting.
Fortunately in my case, I've never experienced anything like that weave on my US-spec 1300.

 

[SupraSabre]

That Harley Tariff of the mid 80's screwed up the one bike I liked back then....the V45 Sabre! Honda (and the other manufactures) dropped it down to 700cc (instead of 750cc) to get around the tariff. I had a '85 Canadian V45 Sabre and other than the paint, it was pretty much the '83 V45 Sabre.

My mid 80's Honda Sabres

Basic Mid 80's Honda Sabre info

 

[rwthomas1]

Are you channeling Kevin Cameron?
(Cycle magazine, TDC column for those too young to remember.)

Ha! I aspire to be at least 10% as smart as Mr. Cameron. He and Peter Egan were the only reason I read that rag.

RT

 

[sky.high]

Have a read of the ST1300 section of this article for an explanation;
THE TRUTH ABOUT THE ST1300

Have we ever run a survey by ST1300 year, weave or no weave @ greater than say 100mph, it would be interesting to see if our group confirms Dave's article, my 2005 is rock solid at all speeds ... so far

 

[Sadlsor]

Ha! I aspire to be at least 10% as smart as Mr. Cameron. He and Peter Egan were the only reason I read that rag.

RT

Sadly, I didn't appreciate KC for years.
Fortunately, I never threw them away (but I have, since) so I had dozens of his articles to binge-read, by the time I realized it was "cool" to actually know that stuff.
I probably started subscribing when I was 15, and did so for many years.
Keep meaning to order his books. (I did get Egan's books a few years ago.)
Hey!
Today might be the day!

 

[TourNut]

No weave on my '07 ...

 

[MaxPete]

Its called a "waste spark ignition system" and it is very common. Used on air-cooled BMW's, and many other machines. Its done to make the ignition system simpler and more reliable, in the era prior to coil-on-plug ignition. In fact, due to the fact that our ST's have only TWO ignition coils, the system is firing TWO plugs every time. I'm willing to bet thats one plug on on the power stroke, and one on the exhaust when this happens. Which would make it a waste spark ignition system as well....

RT

This is precisely correct on the waste spark issue.

I have a small fleet of three 1970's Yamaha XS650 twins (think BSA / Triumph / Norton - but with actual working lights) and one of them is already equipped with a Honda MP08 coil which is the used <I think> on the STs. Mine was an evilBay buy and came off a Gold Wing - but virtually all multi-cylinder Hondas used that coil for many years. I have a couple more coils that will be going on the other two bikes as I restore them.



Anyhow, the Yamaha XS650 is a 360 degree vertical twin so both pistons rise and fall together with one on the power stroke and the other on the exhaust stroke. The original Yamaha ignition system had two separate sets of Kettering point and two separate coils (oddly complex) and the coils were known to be....weak, at best. I have upgraded the bike to a PAMCO electronic ignition with an electronic advance unit and the Honda coil is also an upgrade from the standpoint of electrical energy output and reliability. It simply fires both plugs simultaneously and it works just fine.

The waste spark on the exhaust stroke has no effect on how the bikes starts or runs - it simply reduces the parts count and complexity of the wiring harness.

Pete

 

[Sterno]

re: Have a read of the ST1300 section of this article for an explanation;
THE TRUTH ABOUT THE ST1300

Andrew-thank you for that. I am relatively new here, so thanks for sharing! ...this DEFINITIVE article is a wonderfully simple and clear (and believable) dissection of the weave subject... so far this is the most believable version I have read.

 

[TerryS]

Are you channeling Kevin Cameron?
(Cycle magazine, TDC column for those too young to remember.)

He's still very active and as good to read as ever.
https://www.cycleworld.com/blogs/ask-kevin/

 

[Team2010]

Yeah and if you want a real tank slapper grab one of their Springer front ended bikes. I personnally know two who have gone down on those and they were both very veteran riders. When a Harley rider swears off on a Harley you had better listen.

Yesterday, I went for a short ride to burn fuel out of the top tank. My plan is to swap-out the 5-way T and lines.
Heading up Bouquet Canyon, poking along before getting into the twisties, I moved right to let a Ducati and his buddy pass.
Turns out the 'buddy' was on a full dress Harley. Well, I was a little miffed at myself for pulling over for a HD. A full dresser at that !
I figured great, now I'll have to follow him all the way through the canyon. I have to say, he was on it, riding that thing as fast as he could.
In no big hurry, I decided I'll keep-up and just follow without getting too close, always letting him see me in his mirrors if he dare look. He's hitting the brakes, sidebags coming close to the ground while leaning. Quite impressive (and a bit concerning). When he couldn't shake me, he started riding with hands off the bars and swerving from one side of the lane to the other. I just KNEW he was a HD man and wanted to show-up a Honda.
I hang back a little further in case he looses it. At one point along a straight, we got up to 110. He's trying to pull away, but I'm still setting the distance. A short time later, I see the back of the HD going side to side uncontrollably. I've never seen anything like that on any bike. I was scared for his safety.
I fall back a little further as he gains control, hoping he doesn't feel the need to press the matter any further. He got the idea and decided to slow-up a bit. Fun ride!