Shop installed both pads on same side of rotor, what's the damage?

[coleridge]

I had a local mechanic that until recently had always been good and cheap. I used to remove my wheels for tire changes and take them to cycle gear, but this guy would remove the wheel and put the tire on for $30, so the last few changes I've been using him.
Cutting to the chase...I show up last Friday and there is a new face, I ask and he says he bought the shop from the previous owner. I asked about the mechanic that worked there and he says he isn't there either, but that he does have a mechanic.
It's just a tire, I'm there, so I leave the bike and the new tire. I come back the next day and I get the "your brake pads are almost gone" pitch and some discussions of pad brand name and noise. I'm not feeling comfortable, I leave and drive about 2 miles, park the bike a few hours, and drive about 3-4 more miles home. I noticed the first time I was at low speed that it was louder than usual with no brakes applied, and there was more of a grinding noise than the usual hissing noise, but it stopped ok. I'm on a new front tire, so I'm not stopping aggressively. I do remember taking off at a green light and getting up to 60, so I definitely used the front brakes in my 6ish miles.
One week later, I haven't ridden, I'm going to check the pads this rainy morning and see if he was truthful about them being thin, and see if I can find out why they were loud when I wasn't applying them. This is what I find!

You can see it shined the side opposite the calipers:

I drive an 03, I'm a nice guy. I'm certainly angry and I believe had the weather been better, I would have been on mountain roads riding aggressively before I caught this, and that is scary. But if you all tell me this probably didn't do any damage, I will just tell him how disappointed I am and never go back. On the other hand, if you all think this could have damaged the rotor, then I will push for him to replace (or provide for me to replace might be better).
Thoughts?
Questions?
I can't visibly see that the rotor is warped, but if I spin the front wheel, I can hear a little hiss at one point on the rotor, so something isn't perfect. I haven't ridden yet and won't until I get more info.
Thanks!

 

[JoeP]

I would first attempt to put it back correctly with the old pads and see how it brakes, sounds, etc. Then you should have a better idea of how to proceed. If it appears to be ok, then try new pads. Then, if warped, you should have a good idea of whether you need to replace the rotor or caliper or both. During the trials, you should probably make very short test runs, taking care not to get too far from home, just in case.

 

[KTD1911]

yea that is aggravating. I had a stealer change my tires once "never again $450.00 out the door I was ridding with another gentleman and after a few miles I noticed the rear brakes were sticking. I stopped looked and found the caliper bolt was not threaded in so when I used rear brakes the caliper would rotate on the axle bolt and pinch the rubber brake line what a mess trying to fix that on a backroad was not easy. arghhh!!!!! @#$#%%# if the other rider had not had a socket set with him I was screwd

 

[coleridge]

Thanks! I reassembled correctly and just spun the wheel while off the ground (center stand and weights on back). That is when I noticed that there is one spot on the rotor where the pads are touching. This could be unrelated to this incorrect assembly I guess. I haven't pushed the brake lever yet. Of course the thin metal piece on the back of the pad was previously wearing directly against the rotor. I will replace pads on both rotors very soon, the side that was wrong actually had a lot left, the other side was getting thin.

 

[Igofar]

Sir, you are talking about your safety and the bikes Brakes! Yes, it appears that the rotor now has damage (see damage in your photo), and yes, at the very least, you probably now have piston and seal damage since the pistons were scraping along the rotor and catching on every single hole they went by. Did you remove the pin and pads out of the second picture? or was that the other side, that they didn't do correctly as well?
I would strongly recommend replacing the rotors, and calipers (complete) for piece of mind and liablity and safety reasons.
.02

 

[DonMac]

The "Mechanic's" ineptitude has caused you several hundred dollars damages. I don't think he could do what he did without AT LEAST bending either the bracket the caliper bolts to or the rotor itself. I would also be concerned about the fork alignment on that side as well.

 

[Kevin_56]

you probably now have piston and seal damage since the pistons were scraping along the rotor and catching on every single hole they went by.

Look again, the pads are against the pistons based on the brake line attachment point to the caliper assembly. The brake pad backing plate and the caliper housing were contacting the rotor. Is the rotor damaged to the point of replacement? Not likely, but I can not see that from a picture. It sure looks like the pin is removed as you can see the threaded hole and the hole the pin fits into once it is fully installed.

Bad deal, you bet.

 

[sofawizard]

firstly take take the calipers off theres likely some damage on them from the disk contacting the soft alloy the disks will be slightly marked on there rear face but I would doubt there to be damage to worry over your calipers on the other hand may be scrap depends on the level of wear that's been caused you may get lucky if theres just scrapes you can reuse them but deeper damage may make the pads sit at an angle and warp the disks! go get the gorilla who did this to help if you cant do this yourself its there fault not yours

I had a local mechanic that until recently had always been good and cheap. I used to remove my wheels for tire changes and take them to cycle gear, but this guy would remove the wheel and put the tire on for $30, so the last few changes I've been using him.
Cutting to the chase...I show up last Friday and there is a new face, I ask and he says he bought the shop from the previous owner. I asked about the mechanic that worked there and he says he isn't there either, but that he does have a mechanic.
It's just a tire, I'm there, so I leave the bike and the new tire. I come back the next day and I get the "your brake pads are almost gone" pitch and some discussions of pad brand name and noise. I'm not feeling comfortable, I leave and drive about 2 miles, park the bike a few hours, and drive about 3-4 more miles home. I noticed the first time I was at low speed that it was louder than usual with no brakes applied, and there was more of a grinding noise than the usual hissing noise, but it stopped ok. I'm on a new front tire, so I'm not stopping aggressively. I do remember taking off at a green light and getting up to 60, so I definitely used the front brakes in my 6ish miles.
One week later, I haven't ridden, I'm going to check the pads this rainy morning and see if he was truthful about them being thin, and see if I can find out why they were loud when I wasn't applying them. This is what I find!

You can see it shined the side opposite the calipers:

I drive an 03, I'm a nice guy. I'm certainly angry and I believe had the weather been better, I would have been on mountain roads riding aggressively before I caught this, and that is scary. But if you all tell me this probably didn't do any damage, I will just tell him how disappointed I am and never go back. On the other hand, if you all think this could have damaged the rotor, then I will push for him to replace (or provide for me to replace might be better).
Thoughts?
Questions?
I can't visibly see that the rotor is warped, but if I spin the front wheel, I can hear a little hiss at one point on the rotor, so something isn't perfect. I haven't ridden yet and won't until I get more info.
Thanks!

 

[sennister]

Look again, the pads are against the pistons based on the brake line attachment point to the caliper assembly. The brake pad backing plate and the caliper housing were contacting the rotor. Is the rotor damaged to the point of replacement? Not likely, but I can not see that from a picture. It sure looks like the pin is removed as you can see the threaded hole and the hole the pin fits into once it is fully installed.

Bad deal, you bet.

Yeah, I tend to agree. I would say that the calipers are aluminum and are softer than the rotors. The softer of the two materials will loose out. However the backside of the pads are likely steel. What is the weaker of the two metals now? It comes down to the type of steel used. While you are likely still fine being the backing plates on pads are going to be cheap steel where the rotors are going to be a harder steel. I still don't know that I would trust them.

Two problems that I see. The first is that the part of the caliper that is worn. When a pad is in there properly it will not mate with the rotor properly. Though after a while the pad will wear and take care of the issue. However this may cause slightly degraded pad life on that side. The second problem is what happened to the side of the rotor that had the back side of the pad against it. These are brakes, you said you ride mountain roads. That is enough for me to say I wouldn't trust it. Document it as you did show him the issue and send him the bill. I wouldn't take it back to him to correct it. You know he screwed up that wheel. Did he also do the other? If so I would be pulling it and inspecting his work. Probably never used moly paste and who knows what they did.

 

[coleridge]

Sir, you are talking about your safety and the bikes Brakes! Yes, it appears that the rotor now has damage (see damage in your photo), and yes, at the very least, you probably now have piston and seal damage since the pistons were scraping along the rotor and catching on every single hole they went by. Did you remove the pin and pads out of the second picture? or was that the other side, that they didn't do correctly as well?
I would strongly recommend replacing the rotors, and calipers (complete) for piece of mind and liablity and safety reasons.
.02

When you say rotor damage, are you talking about the dark rings on the rotor?
I don't know what I'm looking for in the way of damage.

 

[coleridge]

I only gave him a front tire to change. I will glance at the back, but I'm assuming he didn't pull the rear wheel by mistake.

I expect him to claim no damage to the rotor and probably also claim that the shiny area on the caliper housing (on the opposite side of the pistons) is either "not damaged" or the damage doesn't matter. I think it will rust if it is steel though, I assume it is coated steel? There was some confusion, but I think people commenting cleared it up. The rotor was in contact on one side against the back of a brake pad (the thin metal perforated piece), and on the other side of the rotor it was in contact with the caliper housing and it caused that shiny area in the picture with the pads removed. This is the right rotor looking from the rear of the bike forward. The left pads were installed correctly, but the rubber washer on the end of the "pad pin" was missing or came off when I removed the pin. I think I read that people replace this pad pin, and I haven't in 20k miles, and it's less than $5, so I have gone ahead and ordered two of those. I never know how best to approach situations like this, but I'm not good at it because I usually don't feel like I won. A month ago a car wash machine took the paint off the fiberglass wheel covers on my wife's car and the manager at the place just said "it didn't happen", "there is nothing in this machine that would do that". I believe it did, it was so obvious that we both noticed as soon as we got home and got out of the car. But I don't know what can be done to prove it to him, so I was just left standing there angry after he denied it. I plan to send him the bill to repaint the wheels, but I doubt that will do any good.
On this issue...I want a fair resolution, but I don't know what that is, which is really why I'm here. If the caliper housing isn't really a problem, I don't expect him to replace it, and that is the only visible damage I know of. I can believe that a new pad would just sit a few thousanths of an inch at an angle and might wear a little faster than usual, and I mentioned rust, but other than that, I don't know what else is damaged and should be replaced. I know I will post negative reviews on Google/yelp, here, Georgia Sport Bike forum, and everywhere else I can think of if he doesn't take responsibility and is a jerk about it, but I need some coaching if I'm going to try and get him to replace the caliper assembly ($300) the rotor ($315), the nearly gone pads ($40) etc. I mean I paid him $50 to replace a tire and I'll be asking him to do $1000 worth of work at a dealer, I'm pretty sure I'm not going to get that to happen. I'll keep checking here, so if someone else has wisdom, please share.
For all the responses already, thanks!

 

[vinny]

It appears from the picture, the pads were doubled up on the piston side of the caliper. The backing (anti rattle) plate on the pad scrubbing the rotor for a short period of time may not have done much damage to the rotor. The rotor rubbing on the fixed side of the clam shell could possibly wear it to the point the pads do not seat properly. That part of the caliper if worn at all from the rotor should be replaced at a minimum. You should ask them to replace the pads if there were any life left in them because the anti rattle (backing plate) more than likely is also damaged. If there is any, any warped places in the rotor then ask them to replace that also. If you take it to a trusted shop, let them make the diagnosis and make sure they itemize the bill, then take it up with the previous shop.

 

[CBR 46]

If it was me, I'd be looking for a new disc, pads, pistons, seals and caliper rebuild....by someone other than the person who did the work on your bike....I'd give the shop an opportunity to put it right.

I know that accidents can happen and mistakes made, especially when you're under pressure for time....or doing something for the first time, but any decent business owner will look to make good.

 

[CarSalesman]

Cole - from the tone of your notes, it sounds like you just want what is necessary, and not a big fight. From the pictures I haven't seen anything permanently damaged. Looks like plenty of clearance between the rotor and the other side of the caliper (opposite side of where the pads are now sitting). Possibly the clip made some marks in the rotor, but probably not of any consequence. If the clips are damaged you might replace the pads. I suspect the pads were fairly worn to begin with, or it would be hard to put back together the way they did. Sounds like you know how to put it back together properly yourself. If everything works correctly after reassembly, I'd show the pictures to the shop owner, tell him you're not looking for a fight, but you want your $50 back. It sounds like you want to be reasonable with them, hopefully the shop owner will do the same. The owner really needs to know his mechanic is this incompetent.

 

[nhdiesel]

Looking at the photos there is obvious damage to the rotor & caliper, and the back of the pads got scored. If this was something you did yourself, much of this damage could probably be repaired. I repaired a rear rotor on my 1300 that had gotten scored when a brake pad delaminated and the friction material fell out during a ride. That was 30k+ miles ago.

Being that this was the fault of a shop you paid money to, and trusted to do your work, and handed them a bike in good condition, you are entitled to receive a bike back in the same condition. I would push for replacement of the pads, caliper (the caliper itself got damaged), and the rotor. The shop should have insurance to cover this type of thing.

In a perfect world you would be able to take it to a dealer, have them repair it, and have the incompetent shop pay for it. But in most places you are required to give the shop a chance to make it right first. Show them the damage, show them the photos, and ask them what they are going to do. If they are willing to replace the damaged parts, let them, then check it before leaving the shop. If they do it correctly (and ALL of it), then leave and never go back. If they aren't willing to replace what got damaged (yes, even scratches are damage), go get an estimate from a dealer and see a lawyer. The rotor & caliper are a good chunk of change, worth pursuing in court.

I'm now a shop owner. If something like that somehow left my shop (I hope it never happens) I would be bending over backwards to make it right.

 

[The Dan]

I can't see it well enough in the pictures, need to feal the parts to know if it is serviceable. Take it to a trusted shop and have them look at it. We all can look and form an opinion by the pic's but touch and experience is the only truth here when your life is at stake.

In small claims court you don't need a lawyer for up to $5K in SD.

 

[TotaledTL]

Unreal- I've never heard of that happening. Obviously he failed to even inspect his work once complete. He shouldn't be permitted near any

.

 

[mean13]

Best to see a professional. Contact a lawer. Negligent Endangerment. He owns a business that is libal for customers safety. This shoddy work could have seriously injured you, or worse! You might be doing him a favor...before his mechanic hurts or kills someone. At least so far there is no bodily injury.

 

[sennister]

The way I look at it is he can claim that any "damage" isn't damage all he wants. He has validated his mechanical ability be screwing up a brake job and I wouldn't trust his opinion on the matter. It is your life not his.

 

[The Cheese]

This sucks no matter how you slice it. I'd have to inspect the bike to be sure, but here is my thoughts. It could be a simple mistake. An honest mistake by a competent wrench. Try to see what the shop will do to make you happy. Perhaps they will offer to fix it, or pay to fix it. Ya never know.

That said, If I was in this situation, Id be pissed. That twit put your life on the line. Honest mistake or not, it was dangerous. No excuses for such a thing. I'd want this shop to pay to replace the rotor, caliper, and pads. They don’t really look close to being worn, btw. This mistake could have damaged them to the point of failure. Maybe not today, or tomorrow, butt it would always be in the back of my mind. A crack in a part today could turn into a failure down the road. Above said, I'd just replace the rubber in the caliper, pads, pistons, rattle clips, and inspect everything close. Very close. Pull the rotor and check for warping. Pull caliper and check for cracks, or worn spots. Probably need to replace the rotor too.