Test ride on a Harley Pan America

[Andy D]

After my last two trips to Mexico, I had the idea that the ST wasn't the ideal bike for the trip (see attached). Anyhow, yesterday I test rode a new Pan America 1250. It was ...eh. I mean, it makes standing up more natural and would probably be a whole lot easier on my poor dick and balls, but the ST is just so brilliant in comparison -- it is low, tight and responsive...and engine still amazes me every time I ride it. It is astonishing to me that Honda stopped making it.

I will say one thing about (at least the local) dealerships...Berkeley Honda won't touch my bike; whereas, I see Oakland Harley is working on bikes from the 80's.

 

[Mellow]

You should take a look at Mike's Super Tenere for sale.

Bike For Sale - 2015 Yamaha Super Tenere ES | Bikes For Sale

This bike is ready to hit the road or trails. All maintenance is up to date and the tires are new. The ES has factory cruise, electronic adjustable suspension, and heated grips. Mileage is 56,000 Asking $6400 Extras Eastern Beaver PC-8 fuse panel Trail tech 70mm LED lights for forks...

www.st-owners.com

 

[SMSW]

After my last two trips to Mexico, I had the idea that the ST wasn't the ideal bike for the trip (see attached).
I will say one thing about (at least the local) dealerships...Berkeley Honda won't touch my bike; whereas, I see Oakland Harley is working on bikes from the 80's.

For that kind of terrain, you should probably have a dual sport bike, but none of those will have the feel of an ST. On the other hand, there was a video posted a while back of a couple of guys who were riding Goldwings off road. Your choices are to get another bike, or learn to ride the ST like those cowboys in the video.

I think that ST's are slightly more complex than Harleys and the supply chain is longer. Having said that, there really is no reason for the fact that so many dealerships will not service older bikes. My local BMW dealer refused one of our club member's 7 yr old GS and K bike. He was a repeat customer, he just had not bought the bikes from that dealership. I suspect the real problem is finding mechanics who know which end of a wrench goes on the nut.

 

[Igofar]

You've never worked behind the scenes in a dealership have you? Or had someone ask you to work on a 1980 Goldwing? Or most any Jap bike older than 10 years
There are several reasons why dealerships refuse to work on older bikes.
1. There are often no parts available for bikes after 10 years or more.
2. Most of the young mechanics that they hired to work at dealerships don't know how to work on any of the older bikes.
3. All the seasoned, knowledgeable mechanics were laid off and replaced with the young kids that work for 1/3 of the pay.
4. Most of the new young mechanics turn to youtube videos for answers instead of taking the time to follow procedures in the service manuals
etc. etc. etc.

 

[Hound]

If you want a V4, shaft drive, dual sport Honda, plus DCT if you want it, look no further than the VFR1200X!

 

[Andy D]

You've never worked behind the scenes in a dealership have you? Or had someone ask you to work on a 1980 Goldwing? Or most any Jap bike older than 10 years
There are several reasons why dealerships refuse to work on older bikes.
1. There are often no parts available for bikes after 10 years or more.
2. Most of the young mechanics that they hired to work at dealerships don't know how to work on any of the older bikes.
3. All the seasoned, knowledgeable mechanics were laid off and replaced with the young kids that work for 1/3 of the pay.
4. Most of the new young mechanics turn to youtube videos for answers instead of taking the time to follow procedures in the service manuals
etc. etc. etc.

I understand their reasoning but, still, it's a little annoying that they won't even change your tires. My wife has a 2004 SL500...the Mercedes dealership has no problem taking our money.

 

[Uncle Phil]

I understand their reasoning but, still, it's a little annoying that they won't even change your tires. My wife has a 2004 SL500...the Mercedes dealership has no problem taking our money.

Try taking a ST1100 to a dealer for service - it ain't happening!
They don't hardly know what it even is.

 

[ReSTored]

Personally, I'd stay far away from the HD Pan American. New model to HD, new technology, reports of poor reliability. Big heavy bike.

If you want a full size Adventure bike there is the GS, the VFR1200X (if you can find one), the Yamaha ST ES (the one for sale is a good deal) and lots of other options out there.

Problem with servicing old bikes is the large number models out there and, relative to cars / light trucks, very low numbers sold. To dealers, this means huge learning curve for new mechanics and parts issues in terms of availability at all and lead time for delivery. No one wants 10 bikes sitting around a shop for days waiting for parts to arrive.

For HD, much of their technology is ancient and the basic construct of the bikes has been the same for decades. I'm generalizing I know. Also, my impression is that HD dealers are able to charge more as customers are less price sensitive and overall HD reliability means customers spend more time at the dealer getting their bikes serviced and building a relationship with the dealer.

 

[PmodelinUS]

You just need to find the old guy working in the parts dept for the last 35 years. They will get you the parts you need. Lol. Love the old guy at my dealership. He even knows how to fix ST's. Lol

 

[Mellow]

You just need to find the old guy working in the parts dept for the last 35 years. They will get you the parts you need. Lol. Love the old guy at my dealership. He even knows how to fix ST's. Lol

I think that's the last old guy working at a dealership...

 

[Andrew Shadow]

overall HD reliability means customers spend more time at the dealer getting their bikes serviced

I know absolutely nothing about the HD Pan America and have not read about it or its reliability, so this comment may well be justified.

Poor reliability is a reputation that Harley earned very well in the past, and no one could argue with you about that. I have to wonder if claims of continued poor reliability with regards to modern Harleys is grossly overstated however. Without researching any statistics and based soely on my personal experience with modern Harleys, I have to wonder if that reputation is now based as much on an urban myth that dies hard and a strange lingering desire to bash Harley as it is on reality. I have ridden hundreds of thousands of KM's with people riding mid 1990's and newer Harleys and have never experienced even a whisper of a problem with any of them. It makes me wonder if this reputation is one best left in the past or is it still justified.

 

[dduelin]

For that kind of terrain, you should probably have a dual sport bike, but none of those will have the feel of an ST. On the other hand, there was a video posted a while back of a couple of guys who were riding Goldwings off road. Your choices are to get another bike, or learn to ride the ST like those cowboys in the video.

I think that ST's are slightly more complex than Harleys and the supply chain is longer. Having said that, there really is NO REASON for the fact that so many dealerships will not service older bikes. My local BMW dealer refused one of our club member's 7 yr old GS and K bike. He was a repeat customer, he just had not bought the bikes from that dealership. I suspect the real problem is finding mechanics who know which end of a wrench goes on the nut.

There are lots of reasons dealerships won't work on older vehicles. I worked for a dealer that had the “We don’t work on bikes older than 10 years” policy but it actually came down to a judgement call of the service writer. If we had a relationship with the owner and knew the owner and bike’s history it was likely he wouldn’t get turned away unless he was a jerk or an unfriendly disrespectful sort. Unfortunately there are people like that. Even a first time customer might get in if the bike looked in good overall shape, was unmolested/modified by previous owners, and the service was simple like an oil change and it wasn’t a model covered in a plastic fairing. Over time fairing parts and other plastic parts on weathered bikes get brittle and possibly unavailable from Honda. Who wants that liability? Even the experienced techs at that dealership (10+ one and 20+ years) might crack a fairing piece during R & R and the owner naturally would expect the dealer to make it right. Wiring gets brittle and fittings get corrosion, switches can break, etc. Bikes with electrical problems can easily turn into a money pit that the owner walks away from when the diagnostic time adds up. Lots of reasons.

For my own curiosity I googled if car dealerships would work on 10 year vehicles and the same policy exists over there. Like motorcycles it’s not a universal policy by dealer or brand. Some will and some won’t.

 

[Andrew Shadow]

My American made truck is a 2010 model year. Millions of them sold and still on the road and I can't get an OEM air filter, OEM shock absorbers, OEM fuel gauge, etc... If the parts are not easily available through their own parts system, I can see why dealers don't want the headaches involved with chasing parts for older vehicles.

I remember going to a Chevrolet dealer in the late 1990's to ask about engine valve rockers for a 1940's GMC truck. GM still stocked them. I ordered them and had them two days later.
Things have certainly changed!

 

[bdalameda]

An Africa Twin may meet your needs. I love mine.

 

[Sadlsor]

It's sites like st-owners that keep old iron (and plastics) on the roads today.
I prefer to do my own work anyway, to learn for myself how it works, and because paying loads of money to a dealer service department does not mean you have a properly repaired or maintained motorbike.
Quality service is still available, but continues to be more difficult to find.
And it's not getting any cheaper.

 

[bdalameda]

If you want a V4, shaft drive, dual sport Honda, plus DCT if you want it, look no further than the VFR1200X!

These are great bikes but rare as hen's teeth in the US.

 

[ReSTored]

I remember going to a Chevrolet dealer in the late 1990's to ask about engine valve rockers for a 1940's GMC truck. GM still stocked them. I ordered them and had them two days later.

That's because the same rockers were still being used in late '90's Chevy trucks............

 

[Hound]

These are great bikes but rare as hen's teeth in the US.

They do come up for sale from time to time on the Crosstourer forum. Last one I saw was in Atlanta, Georgia, in February. Probably still has it!

The Africa Twin was very much the focus of Honda's sales drive and the VFR1200X became a little-known secret.

 

[Uncle Phil]

A feller had a Pan American at RanchSToc and it was pretty impressive machine.
And for him, so far it had been really good.
And some of the riders at the BRG ran into a rider on one blasting along the 'rough stuff' from all places - Bavaria.
He told them he had very few problems with his.
I have to give HD credit - they did an apparently really good job of features on it and it is the water cooled version of the engine.

 

[Sadlsor]

I remember that gentleman, he was from Austria, and yes he was "tearing it up."
Helmut ...was that his name?
Oh, no... that's the name of my hair stylist.