Touching Stories, especially those that are Gripping Tales

[DaveWooster]

This is proposed to be a place where we describe how we make physical contact with our bikes.
The emphasis is on how we use our hands and fingers to work our bike's two main levers, to hold and steer with the left grip, and to hold, steer with, and operate the right twist grip.

I will start this off by just describing how I do such things. (If you want the full story of how I came to do it these ways, then ssk me for some of the details.)

I first put a sort of strangle hold on both grips using the thumb and index finger of both hands. )Then I pull the clutch lever all the way and rotate my left strangle hold to make sure the lever does not come down on the main joint of my left index finger.)

I find my ST1100/A clutch lever a bit hard to pull and hold, so I put at least my left middle and ring fingers on it if there is even the slightest prospect that I will need to pull that lever.

On the right side, I rest only one finger (not my index finger) on the brake lever, pretty much at all times - unless I anticipate that throttle control is very important and that I will have no immediate need for the brakes. Normally, I then let my right ring and little fingers grip the twist grip for improved throttle control - unless I anticipate that I must do really hard braking, and that the throttle action can be put on the back burner.

In summary, I feel I have a really adequate grip with both hands at all times on the handlebar, for as much steering action as I ever need - even for a quick, emergency swerve. For me, two fingers on the brake lever means middle and ring fingers. And there is little chance of having a lever seriously crush a finger of mine - even if I run into something that hits one of those main levers.

Notes: My ST1100A is of the older, ABS I type. I currently do a lot more urban commuting than I do highway riding, or for long stretches. And the constant finger on the brake lever can work against me if I am trying to move my bike around with only my legs (because I inadvertently sometimes pull the brake lever with one finger).

Now, do you care to have a go at it and to tell us how you grip your grips, steer, and operate your other bike controls at the same time? (Or maybe you will describe how you use your feet to, for example, quickly apply your brake pedal.)

 

[Larry Fine]

I usually maintain a lighter grip and steering. I am 6'3" and 225-ish lb, and I've been an electrician forever, so I have relatively large and strong hands, and I can brake or clutch with two fingers.

My finger-parking depends on the road and conditions. I don't cover either lever all the time, but I do more so as I approach intersections, driveways, etc., always watching vehicle front wheels.

I discovered counter-steering on my own after about three years of riding, and use it 100% of the time. I even use my left hand on the right grip to move my right arm around on long rides.

Overall, I find a gentle tough works for me, like on bridge grating, gravel, and campground roads, where I usually use only my right hand, and let the bike micro-manage itself, so to speak.

 

[DaveWooster]

... I even use my left hand on the right grip to move my right arm around on long rides.

Overall, I find a gentle touch works for me ...

I personally would sooner use a throttle lock to free up my right arm. Even though I've ridden bikes off and on for 60 years, I find it nearly impossible to ride with my hands switched, left to right. (But I might try it on a bicycle, just to see.)

If I have either hand off of the bar, I usually will practice some countersteering in both directions using only the hand that remained on the bar.

The idea of using a gentle touch should help on long rides by helping the rider relax a bit, avoiding stress and fatigue.

 

[Larry Fine]

I personally would sooner use a throttle lock to free up my right arm.

I have an N.E.P., which works perfectly, but sometimes i still need to steer or change throttle.

Even though I've ridden bikes off and on for 60 years, I find it nearly impossible to ride with my hands switched, left to right. (But I might try it on a bicycle, just to see.)

I do it by remembering which grip to push or pull on, not which hand to push or pull with.

If I have either hand off of the bar, I usually will practice some countersteering in both directions using only the hand that remained on the bar.

Been doing that for decades. Pushing is easier than pulling with one hand on harder curves.

The idea of using a gentle touch should help on long rides by helping the rider relax a bit, avoiding stress and fatigue.

Exactamundo. Riding should provide a great deal of cycle-therapy.

 

[DaveWooster]

...For me, two fingers on the brake lever means my middle and ring fingers. ...

And the two I use on the clutch are also my middle and ring fingers.

... I have relatively large and strong hands, and I can brake or clutch with two fingers. ...

Have you noticed which two fingers?

I prefer to use my index finger to pull on the hand grip; I do not use it to pull on a lever.

 

[gmtech94]

I use all four didgets most of the time . I have been doing this for a while to avoid pinching my fingers ,I think I have better feel of the controls by this method . Light grip on the bars and let the feel of what the bike is doing under me give me feed back .

 

[Upt' North]

Howdy Dave, it all depends dunnit.
If I'm on an EU motor expressway at 80 mph in light traffic I'd just be sitting there with my hands lightly on the grips. Like gmtech said, and feel for what's being fed back.
Now on your typical English twisty, for most of the time I'd be accelerating or braking, changing gear or direction pretty much all the time. Always with both hands lightly on the grips until either the clutch or brake are required.
If operating the brake or clutch it would always be four fingers on each. It doesn't feel right to do it any other way and the pressure applied never seems to be too much or two little.
The only exception would be if approaching a hazard, then I would cover one or both levers with all fingers which I can manage without losing throttle control.
Upt'North.

 

[ad.hom]

Always with both hands lightly on the grips until either the clutch or brake are required.

This man makes sense...

The only exception would be if approaching a hazard, then I would cover one or both levers with all fingers

...except for that bit.

I tend to rely on one or two fingers on the levers, but still with a light grip on the bars with the rest. Probably a mis-spent youth on trails bikes with short stubby levers (of course, short levers help prevent them snapping when they hit the ground).

Sure, I get the argument that you have more yanking power (and probably more control) with a full 4 finger sandwich, but really, in the heat of the moment, who's got a force gauge handy anyway?

PS. do thumbs count as fingers these days? That could be interesting, but would put an end to me being all fingers and thumbs...

 

[Al st1100]

maybe next time I ride I'll think about it.. probably not but what I will say is that I have found a good use for my middle finger

 

[GGely]

I use a light grip on the bars and two fingers on the levers. One of the instructors I had when learning to fly said that a light touch was all the aircraft or a motorcycle needed. I’ve taken that to heart and always work to keeping the lightest touch possible.

Now that I have a friend called Arthritis spending more time with me, I’m changing the hardware on the bike to reduce his influence but I doubt I’ll change technique. There are a few posts on this topic so I’ll let you review those.

Interesting observations with absolutely no hope of objective reasoning intruding into the conversation:

1. I changed to Helibars and the bike became almost weightless to steer. That was it, no other changes. Absolutely no effort or thought.

And then,

2. I started wearing Lee Parks Sumo gloves. Call it delusional, call it what you will, I don’t care. With these gloves on, the ST is “alive”. And no, I don’t know any other way of saying it. A very strange feeling of being directly connected to the bike and that’s independent of which bike I’m riding. None of my other gloves have this attribute.

 

[DaveWooster]

To simplify a bit, my basic hand grip is to have both of my hands shaped as shown in this attached photo:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OK#/media/File:OK_Sign.jpg

That hand shape is known as an "okay" hand gesture.

My thumbs and index fingers encircle both grips solidly for quick steering, and the right hand in particular has good control of the throttle grip.

Three of my fingers rest on each lever, which provides strong leverage on each lever, without the need to make any steering change even while pulling hard on either lever.

One more thing: I move both hands as far towards the center of the bike as possible before taking a grip. (I had an MSF instructor who had me move my right hand that way when he felt that I was rolling off the throttle too much when I started to swerve my bike.)


(The main person who caused me to think about, and try out, these "okay" grips was ST1100 rider Martin Belof of northern California, USA.
And I think it was Martin Brunner of Austria who once posted that some say that symmetry of the hands, and prevention of finger injuries, are two recommended aspects for positioning ones hands when riding.)

The photo is in the Wikipedia, in an article called "OK". And MSF is the Motorcycle Safety Foundation.

 

[DaveWooster]

I always have both of my index fingers holding a grip, so that I can steer quickly and control the throttle well, regardless of what I am doing with the hand levers.

In town, I have both my middle and index fingers resting on a lever, so that I can operate either lever instantly, without the delay of shifting fingers to the lever.

On a highway with no hazards in slight, I relax a bit and move my ring and little fingers to a hand grip. That allows me to still brake some instantly, and gives me really good control of the throttle grip. But there is then a slight delay for hard braking and/or pulling and holding the clutch lever until I move my ring fingers back onto a lever.

In town, or on a highway, my hand positions are always symmetrical, except sometimes for my little fingers. (My left pinkie prefers the clutch lever; my right pinkie prefers the throttle grip.)

If my right hand goes numb out on a clear road, I put on a throttle lock or cruise control, steer and counter steer with my left hand, try to cover the brake pedal, but never grip the righthand grip with my left hand. (That way, all I have to do is think about how I want my bike to move, and my hands respond instantly with more or less the correct steering.) Added edit: And I still keep my right hand close enough to the throttle lock or cruise control so that I can instantly cancel it.

The problem I see with using all four fingers on a lever is that I cannot pull on the grip (for steering) without pulling on the lever. Also, shifting fingers causes a delay. (And four fingers on the brake lever might make me tend to over brake in a crisis.)

The problem I might see with putting an index finger on a lever is similar; how am I going to pull on the grip without pulling on the lever? Added edit: But a bigger problem with it is that my index finger rests on a lever too close to the pivot point of the lever for that finger to exert much effective pull on the lever. I see an index finger as being ineffective on a lever but very effective for both instantly pulling on a grip and also effective, when combined with a thumb, for controlling the throttle twist grip. (And for those here who are concerned about someday getting a finger smashed by a lever, that does not seem possible for the right hand when riding in town because that lever has limited travel; and for the left hand, before I start my ride in town, I often check that a fully pulled clutch lever will not pinch my left index finger enough to cause serious injury to it.)

 

[Da Bear]

My last bike was a GL500 interstate Silverwing, even with bags, trunk, and every piece of chrome Markland made that would fit it, I could still move it around with just shifting my weight. Riding with one hand on it was no issue at all, so my carpal tunnel issues didn't matter most days. When clutching became an issue, I had surgery, then made an aluminium hook for the wrist brace. I used it to pull the clutch in for shifting. I could still hold the bars fairly well...
The real issue came in 2002, when I sliced the tendon on the top on my left hand little finger at work one day. I didn't have the damned brace with me. Three finger clutching through Portland traffic at rush hour (I worked a weird swing shift) to get to the ER was agonizing. it was worse riding home as they did surgery to repair the tendons and then taped the two outside fingers together. So I had to two finger clutch all the way home.
I tripped last spring and snapped those tendons again. I can grip with the whole hand pretty well, but that little finger won't go straight ever again. I learned though. That wrist brace with hook is in my left hand locking fairing box, along with an epi-pen. I have to find a throttle lock for the ST though. I miss that...

 

[GGely]

There are days when I really miss my GL650 Interstate...

The arthritis in my right hand is often a challenge but switching to the grip suggested by Ryan F9 in this video makes a big difference for me. I have also changed the brake and clutch master cylinders (thanks @beemerphile!) to 1/2" bore units. As a result, I can cover the front brake and clutch with two fingers each and know that they will work.

From time to time I will use the throttle lock for some relief but it's rarely required.

 

[Andrew Shadow]

...... but switching to the grip suggested by Ryan F9 in this video makes a big difference for me.

I haven't tried this, and won't be able to until spring. I can see this being fairly easy and efficient with a sports bike that has short fairly closely spaced clip-ons which allows the hands to remain fairly close to the body. On a touring bike the grips are further apart form each other requiring the hands to be spaced further out laterally from the body. Without having tried this with my ST, it seems like this would be an awkward hand position on a touring bike. So, is it?

 

[GGely]

With my setup, which includes Helibars, I find it works well. I think it reduces the tension I can put into the grips, which helps.

 

[JohnK]

Interesting techniques here.I may practice some next ride

On my ST1300 I firstly make sure my tires (I use ride on for balancing) and are inflated and not cupped, the bars properly aligned, the steering bearings tight, throttle smooth and no slack, forks adjusted to my liking along with rear spring. Also assure reassembly of the front forks and wheel are to the #Igofar standards. It really makes a difference when it’s all buttoned up proper

My brakes are so well bled I can use one finger and oh so light foot to stop. Road testing for any wobble accelerate or decelerate with engine braking and manual - if all good I usually use a flat hand approach with a throttle rocker and try to extend all digits to avoid the dreaded cramps and tingles. I’m kinda ol school regarding no cruise control. I’ll pull the clutch when there’s room or decent down grade to relieve the right hand and find I’m one handing it often on the open straights or slight corners as the bike lean takes care of slight turn needs.

I’ve tried the counter steer when cruising the twisties and a more sport grip around town keeping at least two fingers extended on the levers. I’ve let others ride my bike and often told it is set up like a sport bike. High and tight like a solid hair cut. Ask #dlim

my other bikes similar but the grip and lever usage on the VFR or the Tiger varies dependent on road and speed conditions.

 

[DaveWooster]

... I have to find a throttle lock for the ST though. I miss that...

Who knows of a good throttle lock for his '03 ST1300?

... switching to the grip suggested by Ryan F9 in this video makes a big difference for me....

It seems to me that he is using mainly his thumb and index finger to control the throttle twist grip. (But so am I. And he does not seem to say how he works the levers.)

... As a result, I can cover the front brake and clutch with two fingers each and know that they will work....

I can do the same, using as the two fingers, my middle and ring fingers.
(And at the same time, I can pull on either grip for steering, or change my throttle's position, without affecting my pull on either lever.)

I haven't tried this, and won't be able to until spring. I can see this being fairly easy and efficient with a sports bike that has short, fairly closely spaced clip-ons which allow the hands to remain fairly close to the body. On a touring bike, the grips are further apart from each other requiring the hands to be spaced further out laterally from the body. Without having tried this with my ST, it seems like this would be an awkward hand position on a touring bike. So, is it?

Must you wait until spring to put the bike on its center stand, mount it, and try gripping its grips and working its levers, while not going anywhere?

... My brakes are so well bled I can use one finger and oh so light foot to stop....

I also can stop pretty well with only one finger, namely, my middle finger. But I like symmetry, and my ST1100 clutch lever is too hard to pull and hold with only my middle finger.

 

[Andrew Shadow]

Must you wait until spring to put the bike on its center stand, mount it, and try gripping its grips and working its levers, while not going anywhere?

Yes, I intend to, but a few minutes sitting on the bike wouldn't be a fair test I don't think. It seems like this is one of those things that needs some miles to be fairly evaluated

I wasn't really thinking about working the levers so much as awkward/uncomfortable arm positioning with the wider bars that are on touring motorcycles. Holding the bars this way causes the forearms to be more in line with the grips rather than the steep angle that the traditional position places them. I imagine that this would require spreading my elbows further apart to avoid an awkward wrist angle, which means that I would have to lean forward more to accomplish this. I am just wondering if that would be awkward while riding for a long time. Maybe I misunderstood the intent and this hand positioning is intended to be used when doing a lot of cornering and not all of the time? Would this be uncomfortable for extended periods of time is what I am wondering.

As for the original question, I pretty much have both hands on their respective grips at all times. It is actually a requirement under the Quebec highway code to have both hands on their respective grips at all times while the motorcycle is in motion. I usually hold the grips only and do not keep any fingers covering the levers when out in open road, which is where I ride mostly. As soon as I see something ahead, or I enter a more congested or busy area, or an area where there are intersections/cross streets, I will move a couple of fingers to cover the brake and clutch levers while at the same time my foot moves to cover the brake pedal. It seems to have become instinctual

 

[Bush]

Just came across this thread for the first time and it takes me back to the days of My-mc.com when Dave was regaling us with his threads about mounting the bike while on the centre stand, on the side of the road on a moonlit night and looking up at the moon and feeling his bike's controls without looking. It was verging on being an erotic experience.

I see he is still on that quest for a perfect symbiosis and getting a grip on his STeed.