If Honda asked for input on a new ST what would you suggest?

I've demoed BMW, the new VFR 800...........every time I get back on mine it feels like home. I find I'm comparing fueling, wind protection etc. to my ST.........and they don't measure up. Nope, I'll be on mine a while.
 
fnmag said:
Maybe this icon would be more suitable.:BDH:
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If you see that beating a dead horse is not achieving results you can always:
1. Buy a stronger whip.
2. Change riders.
3. Say things like, "This is the way we have always ridden this horse."
4. Appoint a committee to study the horse.
5. Arrange to visit other sites to see how they ride dead horses.
6. Increase the standards to ride dead horses.
7. Appoint a tiger team to revive the dead horse.
8. Create a training session to increase our riding ability.
9. Compare the state of dead horses in today's environment.
10. Change the requirements declaring that "This horse is not dead."
11. Hire contractors to ride the dead horse.
12. Harness several dead horses together for increased speed.
13. Declare, "No horse is too dead to beat."
14. Provide additional funding to increase the horse's performance.
15. Do a Cost Analysis study to see if contractors can ride it cheaper.
16. Purchase a product to make dead horses run faster.
17. Declare the horse is "better, faster and cheaper" dead.
18. Form a quality circle to find uses for dead horses.
19. Revisit the performance requirements for horses.
20. Say this horse was procured with cost as an independent variable.
21. Promote the dead horse to a supervisory position.

Here on the forum it seems that we as a group always got to #2. I propose that in the future we pick one of the other 20 choices. :D
 
or this........

You picked the wrong day to quit sniffing glue .......

JpvGw9M.gif
 
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I'd tell them to make an updated version of the ST1100 but sticking mostly to the original design, and a new vfr800 fi, based on the 98-01 bike,gear driven cams and no vtec,maybe using the 6th gen vfr frame.with abs and traction control.
they would be 2 bikes worth buying.
 
After up shifting into a non existent 6th gear for the first 2 weeks of ownership you would think I would have listed that first. And the stock seat is utterly inept as the package is built for touring more than the occasional weekend outing. A bump in horsepower to keep up with the competition also a great plan. I honestly think the visual styling of the st1300 holds up today with some minor tweaks they would be able to brand it all-new.
 
veefore said:
I spoke with a Honda rep directly from California at Americade last weekend. I demo rode a VFR800 and a CBR650f and we chatted for a good ten minutes. I told him I've had six Hondas and loved them all and asked where the next sport tourer is.....I even suggested the 800's bodywork on the VFR1200's running gear. Long story short, they feel it's a diminishing market and don't hold your breath. Seems they are headed toward adventure bikes...........I told him I have no interest. What's next for me, I'm not sure.....but it won't be a chrome roadblock or a 700 pound dirt bike.

BTW - the 800 was really nice, slightly taller screen and bar risers and I'd be there........but the passenger accommodations are a deal breaker for me
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I've had the same conversation with Honda reps at the Long Beach MC show and at the Honda display at Laguna Seca. The "diminishing market" comment is a self-fulfilling prophecy in Honda's case right? I mean, refuse to update (or even advertise) the existing model in any way for 10-12 years (whilst BMW, Yamaha, Kawasaki and others keep at it and then fail to introduce a 3rd generation machine at all. What would they expect to happen??

The rep I spoke to said the bigger segment is Adventure touring, to which I replied "OK, so where is Honda's adventure tourer then??" No answer. The newly announced Africa Twin may be a partial answer but so far it seems to be much more focused on dirt than what BMW, Yamaha, and KTM are offering, time will tell if it really qualifies as any kind of tourer.

Seems like, with the exception of Motocross and sport bikes (and they haven't done a hell of a lot new with the latter either) Honda has lost it's confidence to compete directly with anyone else. And before someone points out the new RC213 road bike - that one doesn't count, reportedly costing north of $100K.
 
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wjbertrand said:
I've had the same conversation with Honda reps at the Long Beach MC show and at the Honda display at Laguna Seca. The "diminishing market" comment is a self-fulfilling prophecy in Honda's case right? I mean, refuse to update (or even advertise) the existing model in any way for 10-12 years (whilst BMW, Yamaha, Kawasaki and others keep at it and then fail to introduce a 3rd generation machine at all. What would they expect to happen??

The rep I spoke to said the bigger segment is Adventure touring, to which I replied "OK, so where is Honda's adventure tourer then??" No answer. The newly announced Africa Twin may be a partial answer but so far it seems to be much more focused on dirt than what BMW, Yamaha, and KTM are offering, time will tell if it really qualifies as any kind of tourer.

Seems like, with the exception of Motocross and sport bikes (and they haven't done a hell of a lot new with the latter either) Honda has lost it's confidence to compete directly with anyone else. And before someone points out the new RC213 road bike - that one doesn't count, reportedly costing north of $100K.
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What he eluded to when we spoke was that "adventure" type bikes beyond the Africa Twin were coming but he wouldn't elaborate. Cross Runner.....Cross Tourer????? They have them across the pond but they do nothing for me, might suit some but not me. I completely agree with you about the 10 to 12 year comatose approach they have taken.....I don't get it.
 
veefore said:
What he eluded to when we spoke was that "adventure" type bikes beyond the Africa Twin were coming but he wouldn't elaborate. Cross Runner.....Cross Tourer????? They have them across the pond but they do nothing for me, might suit some but not me. I completely agree with you about the 10 to 12 year comatose approach they have taken.....I don't get it.
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Seriously, my conversations described above were 3-4 years ago! And further, what's wrong with a strong player in both catagories? Yamaha is making that work. It all reminds me why I left Yamaha for Honda back in '83. Yamaha was introducing one cruiser type bike after another, Maxims, Maxim midnights, Viragos, etc., etc. I was looking to replace my XS750E triple and Yamaha had nothing for me. Then I went to the Long Beach (except I think it was still in Anaheim then) motorcycle show and saw the first VF750F Interceptor....
 
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Definitely an element of excitement missing from their lineup; I tried the CBR650f for ha ha's thinking it would remind me of the 89' CBR600 I wish I never sold.......not even close. It was as buzzy as an old 600 Katana and really seemed to be built to a price point.......granted, the demo fleet gets flogged :D

The VFR800 however..........image.jpg
 
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hoowasat said:
I would suggest exactly what Honda is doing ... nothing. I've been riding since 1973, and it hit me like a ton of bricks when I realized that when riding my ST1300 I AM NOT thinking about what bike I want to get next. If I were to lose this bike tomorrow, I would immediately try to find another ST1300A to replace it.

Would the ST1300 benefit from some factory-installed farkles? Sure! Better seat, heated grips & ABS standard, 6th gear, etc., etc. But if any of you found what I did when researching a sport touring motorcycle, you already know the fewest complaints online are about the ST1300. I was originally wanting an FJR because I started out riding a Yamaha. I really liked the technology offered by BMW, but their reliability has gone down the tubes. The ST1300 was the ugliest duckling in the bunch, but I found its online complaints to be far less than the other bikes. So I bought one while biting my lip, and was shocked when I realized I had fallen in love. Do I admire some of the newer sport tourers? Sure do. But after 55k miles, I'm currently aiming for at least 200k before retiring my '06 ST1300A.
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You're not normal!:D
 
bmcdonau said:
You're not normal!:D
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hoowasat said:
OK, I agree.
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Yeah, Normal is to get bored with your current bike within, let's say three years, so you got to have an updated version of what you have...updated means they include all the FARKLEs that you already installed on your bike!

Which makes me wonder why folks are looking for a new and improved ST! BECAUSE THERE's NOTHING WRONG WITH THE OLD ONE! That's why they came out with the ST1300 in the first place, and you just can't improve on perfection, and obviously when they have tried, they have failed! (I think they gave up)

There are plenty of ST1300s around for me, so I don't plan on changing anytime soon! :D

:bl13: :bl13: :bl13: :hat3:
 
SupraSabre said:
...updated means they include all the FARKLEs that you already installed on your bike! Which makes me wonder why folks are looking for a new and improved ST! BECAUSE THERE's NOTHING WRONG WITH THE OLD ONE!....
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I'll file that one with the "handles like a sport bike", and "as soon as it's rolling all the weight disappears" posts ......:rofl1:
 
I agree with that, just don't ever ride a new FJR and realize what perfect fueling is like............or probably anything with ten year newer technology....I still like the old Toyota LandCruiser.......but I believe in being a Luddite too.....where's them carburetors?............ff
 
flyfisher said:
I agree with that, just don't ever ride a new FJR and realize what perfect fueling is like............or probably anything with ten year newer technology....I still like the old Toyota LandCruiser.......but I believe in being a Luddite too.....where's them carburetors?............ff
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The ST is a great, although dated, bike and perhaps Honda also simply recognizes that their ST market is stagnant with a customer base that is relatively happy with the product.

Now that both my nostrils are sealed, I have to stand up to talk and breathe ....... for those with limited recall ...... see reply #46.
 
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I didn't see anyone mention an accurate speedo. If there was ever a bike that needed one...

Losing 100 pounds would sure add to the giddy-yup without doing anything with the engine to increase power. Throttle-by-wire is becoming the de-facto standard way of throttle control in autos and light trucks and some modern motorcycles. It is worth the investment whether it will be applied to a new ST or not. Honda and Kawasaki have been unusually stubborn over this while Yamaha has rocketed ahead with both the FJR and Super Tenere as has BMW with their latest models.

Put wider rims on it to be able to take advantage of the most modern tires. Also, dump the 18" front, this limits tire choices as well. Do some extensive wind tunnel work to optimize windsheild venting, shape and positioning with the electric system. For cryin' out loud, move the oil filter. Oh, and hydraulics for the valves would launch Honda ahead of the rest. ABS, TC, cruise, etc.

Dan
 
bergmen said:
I didn't see anyone mention an accurate speedo. If there was ever a bike that needed one...


...
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Well, at least two out of my three bikes have fairly accurate speedos! (cop speedos that is) The only bike that still has a stock speedo is the only one I bought that still had one! LOL

I've even gotten out of the habit of looking at my GPS for the speed! :hat3:
 
Rider adjustable ergonomics would be a big plus. The magic relationship between bar-peg-seat is difficult for any manufacturer to achieve and making it something the rider would have some control over would be a smart play.

Ride modes are kind of nice, too
 
It seems to me Honda has set their course to produce ugly-*** beginner bikes such as the dumbed-down CTX 1300 and DN-09. Wow, what an advance in design---less power, looks stupid, stodgy handling. Can't wait! I kept my 2004 ST 1300, but just bought the 2015 Indian Roadmaster. This bike speaks to my soul like no other ever has. Beautiful execution! Gorgeous bike. Comfortable for rider and passenger, tons of storage, burbling, mellifluous sound, heated seats and grips, cruise, ABS, I-pod connection, blue tooth, ---you can actually read the instruments. Of course, it costs more than my GMC crew cab 4WD, but oh well. Pretty wife loves it. She said we had to buy it. We have not been spending the kids' inheritance nearly fast enough!
 
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