Article [13] ST1300 - Maintenance - Fitting Wheel Bearings - What the manuals don't tell.

Kevcules said:
Very confusing as to why the spacer isn't a few mm shorter, to prevent the problems you made us aware of.....
Click to expand...
I still have the same question, why is the spacer not shorter or equal as the hub shoulders distance?
Is the spacer acting as a seal, preventing dust and water to get from the hub to the bearings, or something else? This question is not answered yet and stand as a key point to understand the installation procedure.
Everything that have been said on this thread is very straight forward, but I keep wondering about the design of the spacer.
Thank you @jfheath for bringing clarity on the practical side of the installation, as always your work is very much appreciated!
 
Last edited:
Sidekick said:
I still have the same question, why is the spacer not shorter or equal as the hub shoulders distance?
Click to expand...

It is a good question - one that I have pondered a number of times, and have not been able to find an official answer. Or any answer other than the one that I have come up with for myself.

The hub of the wheel is a cast alloy. I know next to nothing about the structural properties, but I have a few experiences.
  • For many years I rode a pushbike with a frame that was made of Reynolds 531 tubing. I never knew much about it but I knew it was supposed to be good - light, strong and had a certain amount of flex in it. I never appreciated how good this was until I replaced it with a more modern aluminium alloy frame. It is rigid. Absolutely no flex in it at all. It is a bone shaker.

  • At one time, I used to build and true my own wheels and used a cast alloy wheel truing frame. On one occasion, too lazy to turn the threaded rod the held the wheel axle in place the extra fraction I tried to 'spring' the two legs apart, as I would when trying to get the wheel hub between the bike's fork legs. The entire arm of the truing frame snapped off.

  • The rear ABS sensor on the ST1100 is a small cylinder which slips inside a hole in a short, cast alloy stalk - part of the rear final drive housing. It is a good, slide-in fit. Over the years the sensor rusts and the alloy corrodes, and it gets stuck. Faced with a failed sensor, it had to be removed, but would not budge. There was a slight gap at one point where the metal shim fits to adjust the air gap between the sensor and the pulsar ring. Enough for the tiny wedge shape blade of a modellers screwdriver. Armed with the experience years back of the snapped alloy truing frame, I knew that this had to be a very delicate procedure. I very gently gave my tiny wedge a tap into the gap, with nothing heavier than a toffee hammer, and a very light touch. I was being ultra cautious. Second tap, the bracket snapped off. Honest, it was a serious over-reaction to the slightest of taps. It was nothing.
So my thinking is that the cast alloy hub isn't really designed to take 78Nm or 108Nm force that is applied to the centre races of the wheel bearings when tightening the axle.

If that is the case then I reckon that some other things have to be true:

  1. The squeezing force has to be taken by the spacing tube. This means that the tube is clamped between the two bearings and is not free to rattle around.
  2. The length of the spacing tube must always be more than the distance between the hub shoulders to allow for temperature expansion / contraction of the alloy hub. (Heat / cold from tyres, brake discs, bearings, exhaust, sun, rain.... )
  3. As a result of #2, one bearing has to identified as the one to be driven in first, otherwise the wheel will be slightly off centre.
Years back, I used to wonder why there was a spacer at all on my previous bikes - it just seemed to be something that rattled around between the bearings when I went over bumps. But I never changed the bearings on any of those bikes.
 
Last edited:
jfheath said:
I forgot to mention that pretty crucial point.

Here are some diagrams and more detailed explanation from me.

Click to expand...

Can the first bearing hub shoulder be considered as the reference alignment point for the front wheel on the axle?
I am in the process of replacing the front wheel bearing for the second time after having done it incorrectly recently. The first time, I heard a whining sound coming from the hub and the wheel was misaligned.
Thank you!
 
You drive in the first bearing to the shoulder.

The spacer goes in and then the second bearing goes in until the inner shell meets up with the spacer. Making contact is enough, you don't drive it beyond that if you want your bearing to last longer than your tyres. But they must meet up.

BUT

You do not choose which bearing is first. Which side you drive in first is specified in the workshop manual. I try not to write it down anywhere because I will think that I have remembered, and I know that the day will come when I remember incorrectly. Next Thursday.
It is the left hand side for one wheel and the right hand side for the other - and yes it matters. The difference could affect (say) the front disc rotor clearance through the brake caliper.

Probably not quite, but if you believe that, you will remember that it is important enough to get it right.

Or you could watch the video of me putting one in. I did that one correctly. The side of the wheel with the abs pulsar ring is the right hand side.

I'll look it up and post it here, but Ive just got off the pushbike and right now, standing up will be quite a challenge.

Rear wheel - drive in the left bearing first. (it doesn't help that the manual then says drive in the left bearing - but I have checked this out with the diagrams and left first is correct.
Front wheel - drive in the right bearing first, then the left.

But you should never trust information that you get from someone on the internet . Always check it out.
 
Last edited:
jfheath said:
You do not choose which bearing is first. Which side you drive in first is specified in the workshop manual.
Click to expand...
yep...
Rear wheel - drive in the left bearing first. (it doesn't help that the manual then says drive in the left bearing - but I have checked this out with the diagrams and left first is correct.
Click to expand...
From a mechanical POV it might seem strange to have the narrow, LHS bearing going in first as alignment reference, and the heavier, double-row, load bearing RHS one to be brought home gently till inner race "touches" the spacer tube, but the brake/rotor side is in focus there...
 
jfheath said:
A PDF file to describe how to fit a pair of bearings into a wheel of the ST1300. It is straight forward, but if you don't know the correct procedure, there is a good chance of getting it wrong.
This pdf explains what things could go wrong, and how to avoid them.

A quick rundown and a few images - to remind of the content.
Insert first bearing - it matters which side goes in first.
Insert spacer
Insert second bearing driving inner and outer shell - until the inner shell touches the distance collar.

A few images of what could go wrong. Full diagrams and explanations in the attached pdf file.
(93 views of original file - updated 110221 to correct error P3 see post#17)

1586422773820.png 1586422797415.png 1586422621921.png

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Other related articles:

Article13.png ST1300 - Front & Rear Wheel Install and Front Axle Animation
Article13.png ST1300 - Front wheel bearing replacement [VIDEO]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
The attachment is VERY informative! Thank you!
 
jfheath said:
A thought popped into my head - something that I meant to try ages back, but never did.

Perhaps a much more certain way to install the bearings would be to install the first bearing in the usual way until it meets the shoulder, and then install the second bearing by using a long threaded draw bolt. Fit a bearing driver on each end and pull in the second bearing to meet the spacer.

Simple idea and I'm not the first to have considered this - but the thiught that popped into my head was to do with the mechanics of this.

When the axle is installed, it is tightened to quite a high torque, and it in doing so it is pulling the entire assembly on the inner race of both bearings. The axle distance spacer fixes how close together it can pull them. But if the outer bearings aren't driven in far enough, tightening the axle bolt could side load the bearing.

So if a threaded draw-bolt is used to pull them together, when do you stop pulling ? Do you apply the same torque as when tightening the axle, or is something much smaller adequate.

My feeling would be the latter. Once the bearing is tight against the spacer, it cannot get any closer, so stop tightening as soon as the bolt becomes tight. Any additional tightening cannot move the bearing further, and only serves to stretch the draw bolt, or strip the threads.

Is my thinking correct ?
Click to expand...
Just replaced the 4 bearings in the rear wheel with 3/8 rod and washers. Worked perfectly.
 
I just did my front wheel bearings, 2nd time in 2 years. I felt that I had driven the 2nd bearing down too hard. It made me listen for bearing noise in my front wheel. Which I thought I had. Well, now I'm certain that the new bearings are absolutely correct.
The thing i did this time, which I did not do the first time is to tap down the 2nd bearing onto the first bearing and spacer as a supported stack. Did it while carefully checking the gap between the 2nd bearing and the spacer. As they closed up I did fewer strikes between checks until the bearing just kissed the spacer, then one more tap to make it snug. Now that spacer is well situated in the bore, it's lateral location is determined by the first bearing shoulder, and the 2nd bearing depth is located only by the spacer distance.
Freeze your bearings.
Grease exterior shells before driving them.
The stack is the key thing. Drive in the first bearing, flip the wheel over, PLACE IT ON A DRIVER THAT SUPPORTS THE BEARING SHELL AND INNER TOGETHER. Then drive the 2nd bearing with another flat driver that contacts both inner and outer shells. When driving the 2nd bearing you are setting bearing 2 to the spacer depth with no side load possible on either.
Love that bike.
 
3RePete said:
I just did my front wheel bearings, 2nd time in 2 years. I felt that I had driven the 2nd bearing down too hard. It made me listen for bearing noise in my front wheel. Which I thought I had. Well, now I'm certain that the new bearings are absolutely correct.
The thing i did this time, which I did not do the first time is to tap down the 2nd bearing onto the first bearing and spacer as a supported stack. Did it while carefully checking the gap between the 2nd bearing and the spacer. As they closed up I did fewer strikes between checks until the bearing just kissed the spacer, then one more tap to make it snug. Now that spacer is well situated in the bore, it's lateral location is determined by the first bearing shoulder, and the 2nd bearing depth is located only by the spacer distance.
Freeze your bearings.
Grease exterior shells before driving them.
The stack is the key thing. Drive in the first bearing, flip the wheel over, PLACE IT ON A DRIVER THAT SUPPORTS THE BEARING SHELL AND INNER TOGETHER. Then drive the 2nd bearing with another flat driver that contacts both inner and outer shells. When driving the 2nd bearing you are setting bearing 2 to the spacer depth with no side load possible on either.
Love that bike.
Click to expand...

Well done!
 
3RePete said:
The stack is the key thing. Drive in the first bearing, flip the wheel over, PLACE IT ON A DRIVER THAT SUPPORTS THE BEARING SHELL AND INNER TOGETHER. Then drive the 2nd bearing with another flat driver that contacts both inner and outer shells. When driving the 2nd bearing you are setting bearing 2 to the spacer depth with no side load possible on either.
Love that bike.
Click to expand...
And that method removes any opportunity for driving out the first bearing. You actually only need to support the inner race of the first bearing. since that is where the driving force is coming from when you install the second - but certainly an additonal driver of the size to support outer and inner races together, there is no way that it can be driven in too far, or kncok the first one out.

I don't think that I ever changed wheel bearings on any other motorcycle that I have owned. But I do remember my Yamaha XS650 - I had it from brand new and I fitted a sidecar before I ever rode it. The tyres were changed frequently as a result, and I always checked the bearings by sticking my finger in and rotating them back and forth - I have a good feel for bearing play having had to adjust the cones and loose bearings on pushbike wheels and pedals. The one thing that struck me was that the spacer was always loose between the bearings. What was it for ? I didn't make sense.

I now know the answer to that question for the Honda. But if the XS650 had the same arrangement it meant that my XS650 wheel bearings were never installed correctly from new, or that the spacer was a competely redundant component. And I don't know the answer to that. @MaxPete may be able to give me an answer - he still has an XS650, I think.

It's not important - it was over 40 years ago, but I have often wondered about the Honda system vs the Yamaha - is it unique to Honda ?
 
Last edited:
Well one thing I can be certain of is that it references the inside shoulder of the first bearing, and that the axle bolt places 58 foot pounds of rotational force on the inner bearing shells while the side collars keep the seals in place, and the whole assembly stays put due to the pinch bolts. The axle, inner bearing shells and collars stay where they are, the outer bearing shells and seals turn with the wheel.
And mine no longer makes a sound when I do a pronounced zig zag. So, yay. Glad I got around to it.
 
Bearings, delightful.
I have little bearing on bearings!

07 1300 25k miles.. new to me, no history.
Am hoping for these to be okay and normal after checking, although not quite sure how you check beyond obvious.

For starters, does dirt/grime around the bearing indicate perhaps it’s time? At least the spacers appear to be on the correct sides… but left side is dirty, right side is clean.

Right side
IMG_5464.jpeg
left side
IMG_5466.jpeg
Where I wiped off the crud, semi dirty/greasy..
IMG_5467.jpeg
 
no, the muck on the outside does not indicate that there is anything wrong with the bearing.

But I notice that there is a band around the spacer on the left hand side - the bottom photo. A band like that is typical where the seal rubs on the spacer - which suggested that spacer has previously been put in the other way round. I think it may be the wrong way round now.

Here are the spacers on the axle as viewed from the front. It doesn’t show the left side of the bike very well - but the measurement is only 4mm on that side (right side of the photo, left side of bike)


1772954247121.jpeg

Note that the spacer on the left of the bike (right in the photo) has only 4mm sticking out. Yours has more than that.

That suggests that the spacer may be in the wrong way round. If so, that means that the short 4mm side is sitting inside the dust seal, and is not pressing against the face of the bearing - which means that your wheel can move laterally on the axle. It should be the 10.1mm side that sits firmly onto the inner race of the bearing. It can’t because it is 6mm too short. Some of that space will have been reclaimed by squashing the dust seals. It also means that your fork is splayed out too far and (probably) your caliper bracket is catching in the brake disc surface. If you look at the end of the axle bolt with the large hex socket on the right hand wheel - the axle is slightly proud. It should be flush.

That is a lot to conclude from one photo, but I think I am right and would definitely check it out. You’re the chap that was complaining about high speed instability ? That might be the reason. If so, you will probably need new dust seals.



Here is my front wheel showing the spacers fitted correctly.

1772955297808.png

See what I mean ?


I’m curious - did you get any other sensations - eg when leant over in bends - like you get when the rear tyre is squared off ? Or perhaps a bit of scrapping noise that you are not able to pin down.

I can’t remember. You may have to remove a caliper bracket to drop the wheel far enough to remove the spacer. If it was me, I would take the wheel out completely, confirm that the spacer I in the wrong way round and check for other damage. I suspect that the seal will be ruined, because it is rotating with the hub but has been clamped against that flange on the spacer which is fixed - although since it hasn’t been clamped properly, maybe it was rotating. Check the inside of the fork leg at the axle hole. Check the face of the bearing that the seal has not been melted into the bearing. The bearing has a seal so is probably ok.

If you find that my analysis from that single photo is correct, you now have an idea of the skill level of whoever fitted the front wheel - probably at the last tyre change. You would do well to assume that the same level of skill has been applied to everything else. Brakes would be my next concern and the rear wheel drive splines and tightening sequence, then any electrical additions.

Keep asking the questions.
 
Last edited:
jfheath said:
no, the muck on the outside does not indicate that there is anything wrong with the bearing.

But I notice that there is a band around the spacer on the left hand side - the bottom photo. A band like that is typical where the seal rubs on the spacer - which suggested that spacer has previously been put in the other way round. I think it may be the wrong way round now.

Here are the spacers on the axle as viewed from the front. It doesn’t show the left side of the bike very well - but the measurement is only 4mm on that side (right side of the photo, left side of bike)


1772954247121.jpeg

Note that the spacer on the left of the bike (right in the photo) has only 4mm sticking out. Yours has more than that.

That suggests that the spacer may be in the wrong way round. If so, that means that the short 4mm side is sitting inside the dust seal, and is not pressing against the face of the bearing - which means that your wheel can move laterally on the axle. It should be the 10.1mm side that sits firmly onto the inner race of the bearing. It can’t because it is 6mm too short. Some of that space will have been reclaimed by squashing the dust seals. It also means that your fork is splayed out too far and (probably) your caliper bracket is catching in the brake disc surface. If you look at the end of the axle bolt with the large hex socket on the right hand wheel - the axle is slightly proud. It should be flush.

That is a lot to conclude from one photo, but I think I am right and would definitely check it out. You’re the chap that was complaining about high speed instability ? That might be the reason. If so, you will probably need new dust seals.



Here is my front wheel showing the spacers fitted correctly.

1772955297808.png

See what I mean ?


I’m curious - did you get any other sensations - eg when leant over in bends - like you get when the rear tyre is squared off ? Or perhaps a bit of scrapping noise that you are not able to pin down.

I can’t remember. You may have to remove a caliper bracket to drop the wheel far enough to remove the spacer. If it was me, I would take the wheel out completely, confirm that the spacer I in the wrong way round and check for other damage. I suspect that the seal will be ruined, because it is rotating with the hub but has been clamped against that flange on the spacer which is fixed - although since it hasn’t been clamped properly, maybe it was rotating. Check the inside of the fork leg at the axle hole. Check the face of the bearing that the seal has not been melted into the bearing. The bearing has a seal so is probably ok.

If you find that my analysis from that single photo is correct, you now have an idea of the skill level of whoever fitted the front wheel - probably at the last tyre change. You would do well to assume that the same level of skill has been applied to everything else. Brakes would be my next concern and the rear wheel drive splines and tightening sequence, then any electrical additions.

Keep asking the questions.
Click to expand...
Looks like the spacer is in backwards to me too.
 
Thanks!
Agree, I did notice that there was no ‘covering’ over the gap in the left hub, seemed wrong. Definitely agree on level of previous maintenance indicators and yes my next is to remove both wheels, spline maint, check all bearings(I need to know what that means). Sort out this front, replace balance- tires.

So it’s possible that this reversed spacer will not have caused major damage?

As far as other sensations, yes.. one other, nothing else until the weave..

If a bike is balanced and true, you can let go of the bars, under power(cruise) and it should track straight and upright.. physics, but mine wants to lean, right.. you either have to throw your weight to draw it back inline or steer it back with the bar.. it’s not a quick or hard lean, it will track, but not for long.. don’t like that.

I did change out all the pads, exercised and checked for things like rear brake drag relative to linked system operation and that system seems to be working properly. Not to mention the way I ride.. it doesn’t work with bad brakes! ..and I’ll probably break these brakes next! 🤣

I do have to replace the fluid still.. it’s the brake task I haven’t the confidence yet to do it myself, I’ll get there but my plan was to shop that out initially, but trusting that procedure to today’s service world is as much of a concern as doing it myself and too expensive for the effort.. I imagine once done then that duh fog goes away and can be added to the self maintenance routine. Now I didn’t prioritize this task because it seems like certain maintenance items were done and others were not, the clutch fluid I replaced looked new. Now at least the brake fluid looks good, both reservoirs are full and clear and the brakes work really well, so I let that go for now. The only history is the po had it for about a year, then.. nothing after that, and I don’t think po was technically into the bike as some of us..

I got lucky on electrical in the sense that.. no add ons so no none-OEM wiring. Everything that I added or will is via a fused dist box I put in.

Again thanks for all the help, I am grateful!
Nd
 
Last edited:
Update:
Front wheel is off, left side, spacer was backwards..IMG_5471.jpeg
IMG_5472.jpegIMG_5473.jpegIMG_5474.jpegIMG_5487.jpeg

Right side, dust seal looks like it did its job..

IMG_5480.jpegIMG_5483.jpegIMG_5484.jpeg
IMG_5486.jpeg


Both bearing turn fine, no movements- up, down, both inner and outer races are tight. That’s all by hand
feel.

Additionally, all pinch bolts were not that tight at all,
The axle nut was worse, one small tap and it broke loose and hand turned out the rest of the way, so no proper torque values here.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_5486.jpeg
    IMG_5486.jpeg
    216.3 KB · Views: 2
  • IMG_5479.jpeg
    IMG_5479.jpeg
    244.8 KB · Views: 2
  • IMG_5482.jpeg
    IMG_5482.jpeg
    218.2 KB · Views: 2
  • IMG_5479.jpeg
    IMG_5479.jpeg
    244.8 KB · Views: 2
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom