ABS1 repairing

Alberto

Alberto

Joined
Sep 4, 2019
Messages
411
Age
48
Location
Georgia
Bike
ST1100
Hi!
Recently i purchased 1996 bike but with the first version of ABS. ABS wasn't working, so i decided to recover it. I had to clean and reassemble both modulators, clean ABS/TCS buttons, plug ABS fuse and it started to work, but not right i suppose. ABS passed test as it should be (with chattering sounds, no errors are stored in memory) but when riding, both ABS lamps plus TCS lamp are steady on.
As i found out in ABS service guide, both ABS lamps are steady on in case of: 1) Faulty ABS ECU, 2) Faulty TCS/Ignition control module (ICM) or open /short harness between TCS ICM ans ABS ECU, 3) wrong battery voltage (as it described on attached picture).
I suppose than 2d option is most probable for me (because TCS warning lamp is always on, battery voltage is ok), but I don't understand clearly, how TCS works. Is ABS electronic module connected directly to main computer (ICM) ? or I have to find other module, which is responsible for TCS , somewhere in between ABS an ICM modules?

have anyone encountered similar problem?

thanks in advance!
 

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Alberto,
Welcome comrade from Northumberland UK.
I'm no expert on ABS 1, but I believe the same controller/ecu is used for ABS and TCS. Is that what you are asking.
Upt'North.
Someone with ABS 1 will dive in soon I'm sure.
 
Alberto said:
Hi!
Recently i purchased 1996 bike but with the first version of ABS. ABS wasn't working, so i decided to recover it. I had to clean and reassemble both modulators, clean ABS/TCS buttons, plug ABS fuse and it started to work, but not right i suppose. ABS passed test as it should be (with chattering sounds, no errors are stored in memory) but when riding, both ABS lamps plus TCS lamp are steady on.
As i found out in ABS service guide, both ABS lamps are steady on in case of: 1) Faulty ABS ECU, 2) Faulty TCS/Ignition control module (ICM) or open /short harness between TCS ICM ans ABS ECU, 3) wrong battery voltage (as it described on attached picture).
I suppose than 2d option is most probable for me (because TCS warning lamp is always on, battery voltage is ok), but I don't understand clearly, how TCS works. Is ABS electronic module connected directly to main computer (ICM) ? or I have to find other module, which is responsible for TCS , somewhere in between ABS an ICM modules?

have anyone encountered similar problem?

thanks in advance!
Click to expand...

ABS1 Brake Modulator Repair Service 1992, 1993, 1994 | Vendor Announcements

Due to the number of requests and not wishing to have bikes unable to be used due to failed ABS Brake Modulators, I have decided to start repairing these again. I will answer a limited number of diagnosis questions. Please contact me, or see my ad on Ebay if you need repairs. *Note: I...
www.st-owners.com www.st-owners.com
 
Upt' North said:
Alberto,
Welcome comrade from Northumberland UK.
I'm no expert on ABS 1, but I believe the same controller/ecu is used for ABS and TCS. Is that what you are asking.
Upt'North.
Someone with ABS 1 will dive in soon I'm sure.
Click to expand...

thanks )

I thought the same, that it should be one module, but I am confused with the ABS circuit diagram, on it looks like there is a separate TCS module...
 

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Wouldn't it be nice if it was a bad wheel speed sensor !! I would think all there is to check the sensor is to check the coil for continuity. If the front & rear measure the same, they are probably good. After disconnecting the sensor connectors to read the Ohms of the sensor itself, you could also read the Ohms looking into the controller, and compared those two pairs of readings ( with the ignition off ). Then change the meter function to DC volts and turn the ignition "ON" and measure the voltage coming from the controller and see how those two readings compare.
 
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thanks for advice with testing the sensors)

sure, it really would be nice, actually I tested sensors by hanging out motorcycle on the middle stand and turning wheels manually one by one, as it was described in the manual in the given link. So I know already, that rear sensor is failed, next step is check it as you said, with ohmmeter. Now i'm thinking in advance about buying this sensor on ebay or on the second market, or repairing it using any automotive sensor.
 
The aftermarket sensor from Happybikes uses a generic sensor however they employ a circuit board to adapt the signal so it corresponds to the Honda system. The good thing about this sensor is that it doesn't have to be exactly the 5mm gap it can be wider than that and still function properly.
The best thing is to swap the front to the rear and the rear to the front and see if the error code transfers then you will know it's the sensor. It is a pain to get at the front one, lots of plastic to take off, but so is the cost of the sensor....just sayin'
 
If you have a '96 that should be ABSII, not ABS1 unless somebody did some major surgery to the bike. The whole front fork/wheel/brake rotor/caliper arrangement is different, how sure are you that you don't have ABSII??
 
kiltman said:
swap the front to the rear
Click to expand...
if I won't find any visible damage to the sensor or its wiring, swapping is the way to test ABS harness, to make sure that the reason of the fault is the sensor, not anything else.

dwalby said:
how sure are you that you don't have ABSII
Click to expand...
positively sure, because I personally reassembled both modulators. I don't know, maybe it is an early 96 model with with actually, 95 version of abs. Or maybe there was a mess with production date in documents. Everything looks like stock. I don't know also what the sense in swapping ABS version to the early one too.
 
this weekend I planned to visit nearest workshop to deal with rear sensor and they were closed. so i decided to check the sensor at least visually by myself, and first started to check harness. And, as i slightly pulled wire close to sensor, wire came off very easily. So, problem was found)
But i needed to order new sensor, and keeping thinking about it, i decided to disassemble the sensor before throwing it to the trash.
I carefully removed with the dremel thing epoxy compound around the rubber insulator and managed to pull off the rubber). Tips of wires were still stuck out of sensor inside, and i soldered new wires back.
Put some heatshrink insulator and glued rubber with epoxy resin back, so sensor started to look absolutely as it was before but with wires)

I hope it is working now) need to install it back and test.
There is one unfortunate thing that we are having the end of the riding season now.. This was my first season on ST1100 and I loved it so much.
IMG_20190915_190238-2.jpgIMG_20190915_193712-2.jpgIMG_20190915_194526-2.jpgIMG_20190915_212447-2.jpg
 
Alberto said:
Hi!
Recently I purchased a 1996 bike but with the first version of ABS. ...
Click to expand...
dwalby said:
If you have a '96 that should be ABSII, not ABS1 unless somebody did some major surgery to the bike. The whole front fork/wheel/brake rotor/caliper arrangement is different; how sure are you that you don't have ABSII??
Click to expand...
Alberto said:
... positively sure, because I personally reassembled both modulators. I don't know, maybe it is an early '96 model with with actually, '95 version of abs. Or maybe there was a mess with production date in documents. Everything looks like stock. I don't know also what the sense in swapping ABS version to the early one, too.
Click to expand...
Alberto, can we have the frame number of your ST1100 Pan? It is not unusual for the owner of a 1995 Pan European to think that the motorcycle is a 1996 model. (If you do not wish to post the entire frame number, leave off the last character; or leave off the last two characters, or the last three ....)

The Honda model year of any European ST or Pan was assigned by Honda, but Honda did not put that year on the bike's steering head (where the frame number is).

If it is a 1995 European model, the frame number is only 12 characters long, and a rider almost needs a table of frame numbers to determine its year. But there may be, on the top of the rear fender, a white, paint code sticker that says ST1100S to indicate that it is a 1995 model. It has gold colored wheels and front brake calipers. And it was built new with ABS I and TCS. (S is the year code for 1995.)

If it is a 1996 from anywhere in the World, its frame number is 17 characters long; that number is called a Vehicle Identification Number (VIN). The tenth character of the VIN will be the letter T because T is the year code for 1996. The white sticker will likely read ST1100T. It will have grey/silver coloured wheels and calipers. And it was built with ABS II and TCS. (A non-European 1995 model will also have a VIN, but with the letter S in its tenth position. And it was built with ABS I.)

So the frame number can also help us determine which market imported your ST1100 when it was new, which in turn will help you to know the correct Honda parts list for your bike. (There are BIG differences between an ABS I bike and an ABS II bike, which can be used to sort out the two types, but using the frame number is MUCH easier.)
 
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at least in documents i have 1996 year... i'll check the sticker on rear fender, thanks. My VIN consist of 17 symbols, with the rest of it as "RM400013".
and im having grey/silver colored wheels and calipers, as you said.
 
Alberto said:
at least in documents i have 1996 year... i'll check the sticker on rear fender, thanks. My VIN consist of 17 symbols, with the rest of it as "RM400013".
and im having grey/silver colored wheels and calipers, as you said.
Click to expand...
Based on the VIN ending of RM400013 and on the grey/silver wheels and front calipers, you have what Honda calls a:

non-European model; the stickers on the upper fairing probably say "ST1100" instead of "Pan European" and it is a ...
non-Australian model (because the Australians received no ST1100 type model with Honda model year 1994 or year code R), and it was built as a ...

non-ABS model with neither ABS nor TCS installed by the Honda factory in Hamamatsu, Japan.
So the ABS/TCS was added by a previous owner, and it appears that they added the ABS I version, not the ABS II version.

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So you may have a North American model. Which North American model you have depends on that eighth digit of the VIN, which should be a 0, a 1, or a 2 for non-ABS.

0 means USA 49-state, non-ABS model originally;
1 means USA California, non-ABS model originally;
2 means Canadian, non-ABS model originally.

What is the eighth digit of your VIN? What is next character right after the beginning portion, which is JH2SC26 for any VIN?

But all 1994 North American models have the year "1994" in large characters on the VIN plate.

Can you post here a photo of your entire VIN plate even if the edges of the photo are blurry?

Your bike was probably registered at least once in either Europe or Australia. North Americans rarely mistake a 1994 model for a 1996 model.

ABS I was used only on models that Honda calls 1992, 1993, 1994 or 1995; your components came from an ST1100A from one of those years.
 
thanks for the investigation, DaveWooster , thats very interesting)
still not sure, why someone would add ABS instead of just changing the bike itself.

ill check a vin plate, sure. after JH2SC26 goes character 5. And it really has ST1100 sign on the fairings as well.
 
Alberto said:
... that's very interesting.

... still not sure, why someone would add ABS instead of just changing the bike itself.

I'll check a vin plate, sure. After JH2SC26 goes character 5. And it really has ST1100 sign on the fairings as well.
Click to expand...
Alberto and all, interesting perhaps, but dumb.

I was wrong when I said above that it must have been built as a non-ABS bike. RM400013 could indicate either a 1994 North American ABS or non-ABS ST1100.

JH2SC265 indicates you have what Honda calls a 1994 Canadian ABS model. (The "ST1100" on the faring is consistent with that. The low serial number 0013 is consistent with the ABS model type.)

Here is one attempt at a computer URL link to a parts list for your 1994 ST1100A:

https://www.cmsnl.com/ (That European site is in the Netherlands. You may have to search there for "1994 Canada ST1100A" in order to locate your parts list.)

Here is a portion of the "info" page for that same model, from that same site, which gives some details on your model:

specifications

Namevalue
base nameST1100AR
optionsKPH
year1994 (or year code R)
area codeCM (for Canada)


frame rangeJH2SC265*RM400001 ... to ... JH2SC265*RM400015 (Only 15 such were built.)

In order to reach the page from which I copied the "info" above, first find the parts list; then click on "info" which is towards the upper left of that page.

I still think that you will find the year "1994" in large characters on your VIN sticker, which is on your ST's steering head.
The "frame number" for your ST1100A should be stamped into the metal steering head and should be the same as the VIN on your printed, VIN sticker.
You should also find, on that sticker, the month and year that your bike was built. (Example: 09/93 indicates September, 1993.)
You have what we call an ABS I model, not ABS II. (ABS II originated later, for 1996, or year code T.)
I agree that it would seem very unlikely that someone would add ABS to an ST1100 that was built without ABS.
And finally, here is another attempt to provide a reliable link for your parts list:
https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-st1100a-1994-r-canadakph_model4623/partslist/#.XZKlhehKiUk
 
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Alberto said:
... but I don't understand clearly, how TCS works. Is ABS electronic module connected directly to main computer (ICM) ? Or I have to find other module, which is responsible for TCS , somewhere in between ABS an ICM modules? ...
Click to expand...
Alberto and all, I can tell you that there are two modules for your early version, ABS I.
One of those handles ABS; it hangs under the left side of the front fairing bracket (that Honda calls the Cowl Stay). I think it is white.

The other module is in front of your gauges, or instrument cluster, above the headlight. It handles both TCS, and what I call Ignition Control. It is black and much larger, compared to the smaller, black Ignition Control Module found on non-ABS models. (Your bike has no separate Ignition Control Module.)

Both modules that you have are roughly the same size. You might find them both shown on the portion of the parts list that is called Cowl Stay. Try this link:
www.cmsnl.com

Honda ST1100A 1994 (R) CANADA / KPH COWL STAY (ST1100AN/AP/AR) - buy COWL STAY (ST1100AN/AP/AR) spares online

✓access the COWL STAY (ST1100AN/AP/AR) schematic✓find Honda COWL STAY (ST1100AN/AP/AR) spares easily✓COWL STAY (ST1100AN/AP/AR) parts quickly delivered
www.cmsnl.com www.cmsnl.com

Look there at items 14 (ABS Module) and number 1 (TCS/Ignition Module).
 
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DaveWooster said:
I still think that you will find the year
Click to expand...
thanks again, that was really dumb, I mean, for me to buy 1994 model instead of 1996. That's a lot of loss in price, if want to sell bike out. How I have not noticed year on it when I bought it??
there is only one thing which is little bit soothing me , that bike condition is good enough for this year
 
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