Simple Question: Do all of these bikes have some brake drag?

Daniel

Daniel

Joined
Apr 2, 2017
Messages
56
Location
Newfield, NJ
I assure you I have already searched, and read many of the posts on this subject. I am not talking about the dangerous drag caused by the SMC. I have already changed the fluid ( I didn't introduce any air to the system, I used the 7 step bleeding method, and did a thorough job). I also removed the front calipers, pushed each piston out about .75" and thoroughly cleaned them. I also greased the pins, as well as the pins that go through the pads. Also cleaned/greased the guide slots the other side of the pads rest in. I basically made sure everything is moving free and easy with the calipers.

After all of this, I still get an annoying drag coming from the front at around town speeds. It is just that, an annoyance, nothing else.

I am just curious if this is just something normal we all have to put up with.

Thank you in advance !
 
Please define 'drag' (the degree of it and how you know it is dragging 'around town speeds'). That will be interpreted so many ways.
 
What I mean is just noise. Both wheels are free, and when spinning them by hand they seem just like any other bike I've had.

The best I can describe it is the noise the older harley's all seemed to make when driving through town. (Except I think that was usually the back wheel).

I don't feel anything, and the rotors don't get overly hot or anything like that.

My bike is a 2003 with just under 30K, so I do worry about stuff related to it sitting a lot.
 
No, ST 1300 brakes do not drag when operating properly. They do rub against the rotors however.
Contact between the brake pads and the rotor is normal when the brakes are in the fully relaxed position. All disc brake systems do so as this is how they are designed. Often there is a little louder than normal noise because one or both of the rotors is no longer perfectly straight. As the warped part of the rotor runs through the caliper they rub a little harder against the pads.
Barring any other symptoms, from what you have described your brakes sound normal.
 
+1 to Andrew's comments. By definition, the pads just barely clear the rotors when brake pressure is released. The pads do make ever-so-slight noise--you can hear it by spinning the front wheel by hand (bike tipped back on center stand)--sounds like yours are normal but you're tuned into the sound.
 
lift the front wheel off the ground and spin it. It should spin freely, but you will hear a light frictional sound because the pads are still in contact with the rotor. The best way to describe it is you'll be able to tell the difference between the wheel stopping due to it simply running out of inertia due to the light friction of the pads, vs. it stopping more abruptly because of too much brake pressure.

Sounds like you've already done this and it seemed OK, so you're probably just worrying about nothing.
 
maybe you need to describe the noise better, brake drag does not make noise, if
I lightly apply my brakes they don't make noise. Is it a tire noise, cupped tires or a wheel bearing noise??
 
dwalby said:
.................................... so you're probably just worrying about nothing.
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LOL......have we met?

Honestly, I'm a little embarrassed.

Slightly warped rotors does make sense, yet I never considered it.. Since I can't find anything really wrong, and have done everything I can, I'll just ride her and forget about it.

I love these forums, I really do, but I've noticed if I spend a lot of time reading about all the things that can go wrong seems to make me a little paranoid.
 
Daniel said:
LOL......have we met?

Honestly, I'm a little embarrassed.

Slightly warped rotors does make sense, yet I never considered it.. Since I can't find anything really wrong, and have done everything I can, I'll just ride her and forget about it.

I love these forums, I really do, but I've noticed if I spend a lot of time reading about all the things that can go wrong seems to make me a little paranoid.
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If the rotors were slightly warped there would be a brake pulsation especially when stopping at higher speeds, When spinning the front wheel on the center stand where would be tight spots when spinning the wheel as the high spot on the rotor would hit the brake pads.
 
Daniel, all disc brakes will make a light "shushing" noise when not being applied. Pads actually float on the rotor, never really retract completely off.

BTW I'm in Vineland. I leave for a week long ride Friday but shoot me an IM sometime to get together. You can ride another ST if you like to get a feel of how yours behaves. :thumb:
 
Whooshka said:
Daniel, all disc brakes will make a light "shushing" noise when not being applied. Pads actually float on the rotor, never really retract completely off.

BTW I'm in Vineland. I leave for a week long ride Friday but shoot me an IM sometime to get together. You can ride another ST if you like to get a feel of how yours behaves. :thumb:
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Al,

I am sure it is brake rub, rub being a better word than drag which I used originally. I've had many bikes, they all do it a little, this one just seems to be somewhat louder than the others.

Whooska ,

Awesome ! I actually bought my bike from a gentleman in Vineland, a few years ago. Met him at the Italian Club to look at the bike. Would love to meet you and get your input about a couple things.

Have a safe trip! My wife and I took a long weekend to Chincoteague on the ST a few weeks ago. Haven't ridden it since.
 
I am not saying this is it, but I have had several situations with my cars where the problem was the brake hose. You would apply brake and when you released it, not all the pressure was released. The brake hose was pinched internally. Ive never seen that happen on a bike, but it is possible.
 
Daniel small world. I am a member of that club, believe it or not. LOL Yeah I don't get to ride alot anymore. I've got a 3 1/2 year old and there isn't a good road for miles around. Hope to meet you soon.
 
Al st1100 said:
If the rotors were slightly warped there would be a brake pulsation especially when stopping at higher speeds,
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Not necessarily. Properly functioning and freely moving calipers float in and out on the slider pins following the lateral run-out of the rotors. You normally will not feel any pulsation unless the calipers are sticking on the slider pins to some degree and can not follow the rotors. In that case the pistons, instead of the calipers, move in and out with the rotors and transfer the movement through the brake fluid to the brake lever where it is felt as a pulsation. The other scenario that would cause a pulsation in the brake lever is if the rotor run-out was significant enough that the calipers could not absorb all of the movement.
Al st1100 said:
brake drag does not make noise,
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A lot of force is required to scrub off enough energy to stop a vehicle. Squeezing a brake pad against a rotating rotor hard enough to achieve this always makes some amount of noise. Some vehicles are louder than others dependent on design and materials but in my experience they all make noise to some degree while dissipating that energy.
Daniel said:
I love these forums, I really do, but I've noticed if I spend a lot of time reading about all the things that can go wrong seems to make me a little paranoid.
Click to expand...
Easily cured- insert ear plugs and go ride.
 
Andrew Shadow said:
Not necessarily. Properly functioning and freely moving calipers float in and out on the slider pins following the lateral run-out of the rotors. You normally will not feel any pulsation unless the calipers are sticking on the slider pins to some degree and can not follow the rotors. In that case the pistons, instead of the calipers, move in and out with the rotors and transfer the movement through the brake fluid to the brake lever where it is felt as a pulsation. The other scenario that would cause a pulsation in the brake lever is if the rotor run-out was significant enough that the calipers could not absorb all of the movement.

A lot of force is required to scrub off enough energy to stop a vehicle. Squeezing a brake pad against a rotating rotor hard enough to achieve this always makes some amount of noise. Some vehicles are louder than others dependent on design and materials but in my experience they all make noise to some degree while dissipating that energy.

Easily cured- insert ear plugs and go ride.
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Thickness variation would cause the brake lever to pulsate. I agree lateral run out would cause the caliper to slide on the pins. Put a dial indicator on it .003 should be the standard. I don't feel that he has a wrapped rotor issue as he was lead to believe There is something going on if you can hear the brake noise over the engine and wind noise . Last time ridding with a group I don't remember hearing all that stopping noise. I still would like a better description.
 
Allowable warpage for the front rotors is 0.008" and the rear is 0.012".
I did not mean to infer that his rotors are warped to the point of being a problem. In my experience warpage that is within specifications can cause a swooshing sound. The area of the rotor with the greatest warpage pushes the pistons back until they are just barely in contact with that high spot of the rotor. The rest of the rotor goes by without touching. When the maximum warped area of the rotor comes around again it touches the pad and makes a sound that catches your attention. With perfectly straight and flat rotors the pads are barely in contact all of the time. They are still making noise but it doesn't attract your attention because it does not come and go.

I made the assumption, possibly incorrectly, that this was a low speed condition that he was referring to. If he can hear it at high speed over all of the other noises I agree that there is something else going on.
 
Drilled disks will make a noise as the hole is covered/revealed..... Noticed it some years ago on a Kawasaki after changing from a Honda with plain disks.
 
The first, easiest, and cheapest thing to check would be the pads themselves :rolleyes: are we talking about OEM Honda pads or aftermarket EBC pads?
Check the rear pads and see if they have the white OEM heat guard spacer in them, then check the front pads. Do they have 2 sections or 4?
 
Igofar said:
The first, easiest, and cheapest thing to check would be the pads themselves :rolleyes: are we talking about OEM Honda pads or aftermarket EBC pads?
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I was just about to suggest the same thing. Every time that I have installed EBC pads I have found them to be noisier then the Honda OEM pads. On my VT1100C Shadow it was actually irritating. I was happy when they were worn out. I put Honda pads back on and the noise was gone. I had no complaints about how the EBC performed- they were just noisy. This would be worth a look as a first step.
 
Andrew Shadow said:
Allowable warpage for the front rotors is 0.008" and the rear is 0.012".
I did not mean to infer that his rotors are warped to the point of being a problem. In my experience warpage that is within specifications can cause a swooshing sound. The area of the rotor with the greatest warpage pushes the pistons back until they are just barely in contact with that high spot of the rotor. The rest of the rotor goes by without touching. When the maximum warped area of the rotor comes around again it touches the pad and makes a sound that catches your attention. With perfectly straight and flat rotors the pads are barely in contact all of the time. They are still making noise but it doesn't attract your attention because it does not come and go.

I made the assumption, possibly incorrectly, that this was a low speed condition that he was referring to. If he can hear it at high speed over all of the other noises I agree that there is something else going on.
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where did you get those numbers, .012 is a lot. I don't have the honda specs but every car I have worked on is the same, bikes should be no different. Here is the theoryhttps://www.tirereview.com/brake-rotors-measure-cut/
 
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