jfheath
John Heath
How is Larry ?
Slight Instability in Windy Conditions
- Thread starter willie13377
- Start date
OP
OP
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2021
- Messages
- 33
- Age
- 33
- Location
- Livingston, Louisiana United States
- Bike
- 2004 Honda ST1300A
He is doing well! We spent nearly and hour on the phone going through various bits of concern on my ST. He mentioned your name as well while we were talking! Looking forward to working with him on my ST and getting it dialed in to the proper specs.
I have an ST 11, but as you mentioned, any full fairing bike will exhibit the behavior you're experiencing. The fairing, bags, and bodywork in general give the wind and turbulence a lot of surface to push against, even more so then the bike is stacked with camping gear, etc.
I have ridden since the '70s off road and '82 on the street, but before my ST I had never ridden a bike with fairing and bags. Also, almost all of my prior riding had been local and around town. Once I bought the ST I started doing a lot of multi-week, long distance touring and camping all over the far West and in up in the Great White North. Cross winds and turbulence in Wyoming, Utah, the western slope in Colorado, Texas, or anywhere on the plains and similar areas of the Wild West have to be experienced to be believed. The turbulence and buffeting from tractor trailers , RVs, and buses at the 80 mph speed limits out West sometimes had me feeling like a cork bobbing in the wake of giant container ships, in addition to the tricky winds around hills, mountains, and canyons. Some days weren't bad, but other days I spent part or most of the day white knuckled, hanging on for dear life, riding at what felt like a 45 degree angle to counteract the cross winds, dreading having to pass or be passed by a semi, and not daring to use the cruise control. Until I learned to loosen up, sometimes at the end of the day I could hardly let go of the grips. Especially being out in the middle of nowhere, you have to keep going and learn to deal with it. Pulling over and standing on the side of the road won't get you out of it, you have to keep riding to get through it.
It feels counterintuitive at first, but eventually you learn to relax and "ride limber" in those conditions. Don't white knuckle it or overcontrol it. If crosswinds are an issue, adjust your seating position about an inch or so to the upwind side until you feel it counteracting the wind. I'd also sometimes use my upwind leg as a rudder, knee out away from the bike as necessary, constantly adjusting seating and upwind knee position as necessary to counteract crosswinds, gusts, and turbulence. When you get around a big truck, bus, or RV, you have to play it as it comes, anticipate, and set yourself up for it.
The turbulence will be different and swirling in different directions depending on which direction the crosswind is coming from. Stay well back unless and until you're ready to pass. If there's a strong crosswind from the side the truck is on during the pass, it will block the wind as long as you're alongside it. You'll go from having to counteract a strong crosswind, to a lot of turbulence as you near the truck, then little turbulence and no crosswind at all when you're alongside it, then back into the crosswind with a sudden, even stronger blast of bow wave once you're no longer alongside it. You have to be prepared for the bow wave of big, boxy vehicles and especially with a strong crosswind from the truck side how it will suddenly try to push you hard downwind. On the worst crosswind and turbulence days, I learned to anticipate the bow wave by drifting out away from the direction it's going to come from, and a second before it hits, slightly angling into it.
Even more exciting can be the sudden bow blast and turbulence from oncoming big trucks at 70 mph (combined 140 mph closing speed) on a remote western two lane, especially combined with a strong cross wind from the truck side. About the only thing you can do in that situation is get as far over toward the shoulder and away from the center line as you can when you see them coming.
Hey, if motorcycling was easy, everybody would do it.
I have ridden since the '70s off road and '82 on the street, but before my ST I had never ridden a bike with fairing and bags. Also, almost all of my prior riding had been local and around town. Once I bought the ST I started doing a lot of multi-week, long distance touring and camping all over the far West and in up in the Great White North. Cross winds and turbulence in Wyoming, Utah, the western slope in Colorado, Texas, or anywhere on the plains and similar areas of the Wild West have to be experienced to be believed. The turbulence and buffeting from tractor trailers , RVs, and buses at the 80 mph speed limits out West sometimes had me feeling like a cork bobbing in the wake of giant container ships, in addition to the tricky winds around hills, mountains, and canyons. Some days weren't bad, but other days I spent part or most of the day white knuckled, hanging on for dear life, riding at what felt like a 45 degree angle to counteract the cross winds, dreading having to pass or be passed by a semi, and not daring to use the cruise control. Until I learned to loosen up, sometimes at the end of the day I could hardly let go of the grips. Especially being out in the middle of nowhere, you have to keep going and learn to deal with it. Pulling over and standing on the side of the road won't get you out of it, you have to keep riding to get through it.
It feels counterintuitive at first, but eventually you learn to relax and "ride limber" in those conditions. Don't white knuckle it or overcontrol it. If crosswinds are an issue, adjust your seating position about an inch or so to the upwind side until you feel it counteracting the wind. I'd also sometimes use my upwind leg as a rudder, knee out away from the bike as necessary, constantly adjusting seating and upwind knee position as necessary to counteract crosswinds, gusts, and turbulence. When you get around a big truck, bus, or RV, you have to play it as it comes, anticipate, and set yourself up for it.
The turbulence will be different and swirling in different directions depending on which direction the crosswind is coming from. Stay well back unless and until you're ready to pass. If there's a strong crosswind from the side the truck is on during the pass, it will block the wind as long as you're alongside it. You'll go from having to counteract a strong crosswind, to a lot of turbulence as you near the truck, then little turbulence and no crosswind at all when you're alongside it, then back into the crosswind with a sudden, even stronger blast of bow wave once you're no longer alongside it. You have to be prepared for the bow wave of big, boxy vehicles and especially with a strong crosswind from the truck side how it will suddenly try to push you hard downwind. On the worst crosswind and turbulence days, I learned to anticipate the bow wave by drifting out away from the direction it's going to come from, and a second before it hits, slightly angling into it.
Even more exciting can be the sudden bow blast and turbulence from oncoming big trucks at 70 mph (combined 140 mph closing speed) on a remote western two lane, especially combined with a strong cross wind from the truck side. About the only thing you can do in that situation is get as far over toward the shoulder and away from the center line as you can when you see them coming.
Hey, if motorcycling was easy, everybody would do it.
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The slight front end wiggle in dirty air, is not the Pan weave, that's the back end, and caused by carrying too much weight, too high and too far back
I exacerbated this instability by 'fixing' my rear shock. I played with the damping screw and the bike's handling in the turbulent air behind semi's frightened me. I put it back to the stock position and the bike settled down. I weigh 150 - 170 w/ full gear. If you are 230, you really need to check front and rear sag and take the necessary steps to set the bike up for your weight. If you carry a passenger, stock springs will not do it for you. This is going to mean new fork springs as well as upgrades in the rear. The difference will be surprising.
Before (and after) I played with that screw on the rear shock, the bike wiggled a bit in bad air, especially behind semis but the bike was rock solid at all speeds for me - from 0 to 95. Mine was a '10 with around 16k miles on the clock when I bought it.
Before (and after) I played with that screw on the rear shock, the bike wiggled a bit in bad air, especially behind semis but the bike was rock solid at all speeds for me - from 0 to 95. Mine was a '10 with around 16k miles on the clock when I bought it.