Article [13] ST1300 - HISS (UK) and Chipped Ignition Key.

The obvious fly in the ointment is the source of the chip. I've never had problems doing this.

Note paragraph 6 in the document that is attached to the first post in this thread in the section Register your keys. At this point you have the key that works in the ignition. "The red light comes on for 2 seconds and then flashes four times repeatedly. Which means that the system is in registration mode."

Note that when you register the second key, you have to take the first key out of the ignition, walk across the garage put it down. Pick up the second key - which you should have placed at the other side of the garage, walk back to the bike, insert the second key and turn on the ignition. If the antenna (that surrounds the ignition key slot) can detect the other key, then it will not work.

It has re-registered itself with the ECU and it now needs to set the same code for your other keys. If it cannot register a new key but it can re-register the old key, then I reckon that the 2nd key is the one at fault.
The only other possibility might be if the previous owner had obtained a new ECU and had a key made that works with it. Apparently that is possible, but from what I read a long time ago, you have to have additional keys cloned from the original.

The normal process is that you have to register the first key, and that then renders all other keys that used to work with the bike, useless - so if you have three keys and want to register a fourth, you have to start with a key that works and then re-register the other 2 and the new one. You cannot register a key that has already been registered with a different ECU.

The only way to find out is to buy a proper Honda key and chip. Fowlers have them in stock. They are about twice the price of the ones that I puchased and described in the pdf article.
https://www.fowlersparts.co.uk/parts/view/35121MBW601

Obviously, I cannot guarantee that that will work. But I am always suspect of anything that is a cheap fix, and there is only one way that you can find out.
 
Hi, thanks for your reply.

That’s all understood. I am following the procedure you described, keeping all other keys well away from the bike at all times. I just had another go and same result unfortunately.

I contacted the original key & chip supplier to see if they had any ideas and they were very surprised, saying they had done hundreds using those chips without any issues.

The chances of the first chip AND the more expensive replacement both being faulty are tiny, so I am reluctant to buy a Honda one as well, as it almost certainly won’t solve the problem. After all they don’t make chips, and PCF7936 is a standard chip. They are just marking it up.

My local lock smiths say they can clone the working key, but that will cost £80 😩

I found out that this cloning process can be done at home using a “Handy Baby” tool, but they are £140 and don’t seem to exist second hand.

Interesting point about a PO changing out the ECU. I don’t know why that would stop it registering new keys, but who knows?
 
Interesting discussion here. They are talking VFR but they use the same HISS system.

https://www.vfrdiscussion.com/index.php?/forums/topic/108306-hiss-programming/

Note that some of the participants use the word ‘clone’ when they are referring to the normal registration process - which doesn’t make an exact copy. With HISS, every key has a different number. Cloning makes an identical copy of a key that works so the Ecu doesn’t know the difference.

I’m out of ideas now !

Nb - you can start the bike with a standard key without a chip in it, providing a working chip is placed alongside the key when you start the engine. After that the chip can be put away somewhere. The engine will continue to run until you turn it off, or use the kill switch. It might make getting a chip cloned / cheaper. Once working the chip can be put inside the handle of a key blank with a space for a void.
 
Thanks John, I think I will go down the cloning route as for whatever reason my ECU is refusing to play ball, and the last thing I want to do is screw up my only working key.

Hopefully I can find someone who will do it for less than £80.

Just for info, you do need both a working key and the bike to be present for the cloning process. The cloning tool (Xhorse, Handy Baby etc) first reads the ID of the working key chip, then it “earwigs” on the codes exchanged between the key chip and ECU when the ignition is turned on. Finally it uses all this info to write an identical copy of the original key chip onto a new one.
 
thelonious said:
Just for info, you do need both a working key and the bike to be present for the cloning process. The cloning tool (Xhorse, Handy Baby etc) first reads the ID of the working key chip, then it “earwigs” on the codes exchanged between the key chip and ECU when the ignition is turned on. Finally it uses all this info to write an identical copy of the original key chip onto a new one.
Click to expand...
The answer to that is that I haven't got a clue. I've never done it - only read about it. I would have thought not - but your information may indicate that my assumption is wrong.

I no longer have my shop manuals with the relevant section in them. I gave them to my brother with the bike. But I've found one on line. There isn't a short - long - long- short code listed.
The training manual which I also found on-line doesn't list any codes. I found the S-L-L-S described as you say for a post 99 CBR600F which should be the same as the ST1300.

But haven't you answered your own question ? You say the chip is cloned first. Then it listens for the communication and copies that. My thinking is that it can only listen if the original is being used ?
I know there is an identification process - in which the key number is transsferred (1 to 4) and it then gets the password for that key and checks that.

But I really don't know. I have no experience of this. Just one thought - you say that PCF7936 is standard chip. Have you been able to verify that Honda actually uses that chip in their HISS keys. Generally speaking, Honda do not do 'standard' !!

Just looked up and found this site. They seem to know what they are doing. I'm not sure whether it is saying that you need a new chipped Honda key. It suggests that the bike is needed.
Take a look anyway. https://motorbikelocksmith.co.uk/motorbike-key-programming/
 
Last edited:
jfheath said:
The answer to that is that I haven't got a clue. I've never done it - only read about it. I would have thought not - but your information may indicate that my assumption is wrong.

I no longer have my shop manuals with the relevant section in them. I gave them to my brother with the bike. But I've found one on line. There isn't a short - long - long- short code listed.
The training manual which I also found on-line doesn't list any codes. I found the S-L-L-S described as you say for a post 99 CBR600F which should be the same as the ST1300.

But haven't you answered your own question ? You say the chip is cloned first. Then it listens for the communication and copies that. My thinking is that it can only listen if the original is being used ?
I know there is an identification process - in which the key number is transsferred (1 to 4) and it then gets the password for that key and checks that.

But I really don't know. I have no experience of this. Just one thought - you say that PCF7936 is standard chip. Have you been able to verify that Honda actually uses that chip in their HISS keys. Generally speaking, Honda do not do 'standard' !!

Just looked up and found this site. They seem to know what they are doing. I'm not sure whether it is saying that you need a new chipped Honda key. It suggests that the bike is needed.
Take a look anyway. https://motorbikelocksmith.co.uk/motorbike-key-programming/
Click to expand...
Err you’ve kind of lost me there John. I didn’t ask any question. That was just some info on how the cloning process works.

The cloning process is nothing to do with the way key chips are normally added to the system via the ECU - as you correctly say you can add up to four different keys.

It uses an separate tool to make an exact copy of a working key chip, and you can make as many as you want this way.

The SLLS error code is certainly in the HISS manual that I have, and I already posted the meaning above.

And yes I am 100% certain that a standard ID46 chip is used in Honda keys.

I have ordered an XHorse cloning tool, I’ll report back if I can get it to work or not.
 
Hmm - no you didn't ! I read the comment "Just for info, you do need both a working key and the bike to be present" as a question " .... Do you need ...." !!

The rest of it is just me thinking out loud - checking that you have checked everything that I do know about.
I know the difference between cloning and registering - but I noted that some sites that I came across used the phrase 'cloning the key', when what they were really doing was registering it. So I was covering that possibility too.

Ok - good luck with that - I hope that it works out OK. Let us know how it goes please.

Oh - and make sure you know which key is which !!!!
 
Good news, I finally have this sorted.

I bought a new X-Horse mini key tool direct from the manufacturer, the price has just dropped to £76, and 10 new ID46 chips for £8. It might have been a better idea to buy some of their VVDI “super chips” as these can be used for all sorts of different transponder protocols not just ID46.

The tool connects to your phone via bluetooth and is controlled with their free app, although you do need to set up a free account and log in before it will work.

I was a bit apprehensive about messing up my one working key, but the cloning process was straightforward, the app even gives voice prompts. It took a couple of tries but I think it was my fault as I took the key out too soon during the online code generation process.

I now have a fully working clone of my original key.

The mini tool is capable of reading and cloning all sorts of bike and car transponder chips, plus it can also decode and reprogram remote controls and RF fobs such as used on garage doors. I am in two minds now whether to keep hold of it and see if it proves useful in the future, or sell it and recoup the costs.
 
Well done for getting it sorted and thank you for feeding back the results.

Personally, I am not happy with just 2 keys. I like to have a spare with me in case (for example) I drop the key that I have been using down a drain - but I also like to have one at home just in case for the period that I have only one key I lose that and have to be recovered. At least then I can get a new one registered.

I tend to work on the notion that if anything can possibly go wrong, then it probably will !
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom