Steering damper on an 1100?

Ive never heard of it on an ST. Generally, the bikes (1100 and 1300) are heavy enough and what I would consider slow-steering enough, that I would think a damper would be a hindrance. Usually light sport bikes will benefit from a damper. Are you having handling issues?
 
My dear friend Roland Oliynyk, STOC 893, had a custom installed adjustable Scott’s steering damper on his Canadian ‘98 ST1100 [in that nice green colo(u)r]. It looked good and he said it it worked well.

John
 
John OoSTerhuis said:
My dear friend Roland Oliynyk, STOC 893, had a custom installed adjustable Scott’s steering damper on his Canadian ‘98 ST1100 [in that nice green colo(u)r]. It looked good and he said it it worked well.

John
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That's interesting John. As I stated, I cant imagine wanting/needing one on our bikes, but now Im more curious... what effect was he trying create or issue was he trying to fix? Not questioning his thinking, just trying to learn something here.
 
Its not the heaviness, its the short trail and sensitivity to rear preload. I cant go from being set up for two-up to taking a ride by myself without the 45mph hands-off-the-bars tank slapper unless i take off the bags, dig out the tool kit, scrape my flippin neanderthal knuckles adjusting preload, slip with the wrench, cuss, yadda yadda.

It may need better tires, thats not in the cards right now.

Head bearings feel good, tire pressures 42, etc etc. I put a set of tapered bearings in my other bike and swore I’d never do so again as it was such a pain in the butt.
 
I know you don't want to hear this, but it's probably your tyres. There was a recent post that went on for a millenia before guess what, it was the tyres.
Having said that, there are good ones and bad ones and luckily mine is a good one, more by luck than judgement probably. I don't adjust my head bearings weekly or take the calipers apart after every ride or mess about with diffent screens. It's just a STeady old girl at all speeds and the only difference without a pillion is the back end feels like a pogo stick. For the small amount of time it's got one on board I preserve my knuckles and leave it alone. For a prolonged journey I would adjust it to softer damping and springing. And then apply bandages.
IMO I would throw the price of a seering damper at two new tyres, no I'm not going to say which ones. You only fall for that once. If all you're getting is a little wobble at low speeds, ride them out and change then.
The damper is not needed and probably a pain in the arris to sort out.
Just my two'penneth.
Upt'North.
But yes John, the Green is lovely :lg112:.
 
Wow, that doesn't sound good. I will give a bit of advice, only because this is fresh in my mind. I just changed my steering head bearings to tapered and the jury is still out on whether it was a good or bad move. The bike definitely feels and steers different, just not sure if I like the quicker turn-in. I am getting ahead of myself here. The point I want to stress is how the preload has a narrow window and I cant imagine most people being able to tell if it is right by feel. The proper way to measure is to put a pull scale on a fork tube and pull gently to get a measurement. The measurement is between 3-5 pounds for the 1300. With the bars being outboard and swept back, I cant imagine being able to "feel" such a narrow spec. ... i couldn't. I wouldnt splurge on tires either just yet. The fact that the issue changes with load would make me think it is chassis/suspension related. If it were me, I would get a pull scale and verify that the preload is in spec. It should cost nothing and it should be verified and then you could put it to bed and look elsewhere. A steering damper in this instance , sounds more like a mask to hide a deeper issue. Now, I could be wrong and some may chime in and say this is common on 1100's. If so , I stand corrected
Also, I'll ask, does the 1100 have adjustable damping on the shock? If so, it may be worth playing with the damping and preload to get a happy setting that lessen the issue
 
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Upt' North said:
I know you don't want to hear this, but it's probably your tyres. There was a recent post that went on for a millenia before guess what, it was the tyres.
Having said that, there are good ones and bad ones and luckily mine is a good one, more by luck than judgement probably. I don't adjust my head bearings weekly or take the calipers apart after every ride or mess about with diffent screens. It's just a STeady old girl at all speeds and the only difference without a pillion is the back end feels like a pogo stick. For the small amount of time it's got one on board I preserve my knuckles and leave it alone. For a prolonged journey I would adjust it to softer damping and springing. And then apply bandages.
IMO I would throw the price of a seering damper at two new tyres, no I'm not going to say which ones. You only fall for that once. If all you're getting is a little wobble at low speeds, ride them out and change then.
The damper is not needed and probably a pain in the arris to sort out.
Just my two'penneth.
Upt'North.
But yes John, the Green is lovely :lg112:.
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You know, I’ve often wondered if aftermarket screens cause issue. This bike has a 22” rifle screen.
 
Upt' North said:
I know you don't want to hear this, but it's probably your tyres. There was a recent post that went on for a millenia before guess what, it was the tyres.
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Hi Ray, it appears you missed the part in the OPs final few posts in which he clearly stated that there was some remaining headshake, but he was just going to live with it. The tire was somewhat out of round, and was the primary suspect all along, but that defect amplified his underlying steering stem issues. Those issues may be minor, but they're there.

Unless he can tell us that he went from zero headshake on his last tire to his current condition, Hondeltor can adjust or replace his steering stem bearings to address the real cause of the issue, or he can mask it with a steering damper, that's his call.
 
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Bmacleod said:
The point I want to stress is how the preload has a narrow window and I cant imagine most people being able to tell if it is right by feel.
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Agreed. When I replaced mine on my 1100 I had to experiment several times with test rides to get the exact setting that removed the headshake without causing too much steering friction. I was not concerned with meeting some arbitrary pull force spec, I knew when I had it right by feel and lack of headshake, that's all that matters. You can't determine if its at that point with any external measurement, it either shakes or it doesn't, simple as that.

As a first step the OP could adjust the stock steering stem bearings and see if that provides any improvement.
 
Too many of us have installed tapered roller steering stem bearings successfully for that to be an issue. They have anecdotally resolved, or at least reduced, the infamous ST1100 “decel wobble” for many. And they are far more tolerant of a wider range of applied torque values than ball bearings, especially on the loose side. And with the STOC loaner R&R tool kit you won’t have to recheck their preload a few hundred miles down the road. The new races will be set for good.

The whole “decel wobble” with both hands off the handlebars issue/worry is just silly in my opinion. If the ST handles well otherwise, and just placing a finger on a bar stops the wobble — you have a non-problem; leave one hand on a bar for those few seconds! We ride a sport-TOURING motorcycle with SPORT-Touring pretensions, but its steering is generally not considered to be touchy/overly sensitive. But not slow or heavy when underway (why we love them!) either. This while we’re riding steady state, accelerating, carving corners. While decelerating though... some wobble more than others. It’s not dangerous, nor an actual safety issue, but if it really bothers you and you think it important to be able to engine brake with both hands off the bars, try tapered rollers.

Check your front and rear suspension first. Correct OEM ball bearings preload? On the centerstand does the wheel flop to the side stop with little or no input? Fork fluid fresh and at the spec’d levels? Sag set with correct preload? Tire inflated to spec (36psi)?

Rear shock preload set correctly? Damper setting matched? How old/many miles? Swingarm bearings...?

My thoughts on that. FWIW YMMV

John
 
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Bmacleod said:
what effect was he trying create or issue was he trying to fix?
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Roland hasn’t ridden for a number of years now due to health issues. I recall that he indeed tried the steering damper to address the decel wobble issue. Roland has an innate inclination to tinker and experiment with lots of things in many many areas; quite inventive. At the time, I believe he wasn’t overly concerned about the wobble; frankly, I think he did it just to see if it could be done on an ST1100. It was an elegant install with a frame-welded pin and the control mounted centered between and just above the handlebars/triple tree. It looked factory.

I could ask Roland for more info but at this point I suspect that he’d share my opinion that it really isn’t needed.

FWIW

John
 
Lots of different input pertaining to this known issue. As stated by Uncle Phil, replace those ole' roller bearings with tapered roller bearing sets and all WILL be good again with that front-end of your ST1100. BTDT myself several yrs. back.
 
John OoSTerhuis said:
The whole “decel wobble” with both hands off the handlebars issue/worry is just silly in my opinion. If the ST handles well otherwise, and just placing a finger on a bar stops the wobble — you have a non-problem; leave one hand on a bar for those few seconds!
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I understand this argument.

John OoSTerhuis said:
I recall that he indeed tried the steering damper to address the decel wobble issue. Roland has an innate inclination to tinker and experiment with lots of things in many many areas; quite inventive.
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But this sounds like me too.

dwalby said:
As a first step the OP could adjust the stock steering stem bearings and see if that provides any improvement.
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I plan to.

Thanks all.
 
My PO had a BT045R rear tire on the front of my bike. Not liking the steering, nor the fact that the sidewall was placarded "Rear Use Only" I exchanged it last week for a G547 Exedra. The steering was instantly better, but I also instantly had mild head-shake when hands-off decelerating - something I never had with the "wrong" tire. When I checked the headstock bearings, they were too loose. The wheel fell easily to either side. After tightening it to obtain a couple of pounds of drag on the fish scale, the shimmy is completely gone. I'm in a happy place with it now. I have a set of T31's for my other ST but it may be 6 months before I have it on the road. I need to settle on one tire for both of them because I keep a spare set of wheels with new tires queued up for long trips that I don't want to start with tires that can't make the entire trip.
 
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