UK to Ban Sales of New Petrol Fuelled Motorcycles from 2040

Boys and girls, I think we may be missing the point.
Governments around the world and climate bodies will announce targets and plans to satisfy most of the target audience. By 2040 a lot of us on here will be lucky to be alive never mind riding.
Will it help the planet, who knows or gives a flying f..k anyway. This is about votes, not polution.
If y'all haven't noticed most of the younger kids out there (anyone under 40 is a kid to me) couldn't care less what they drive, they probably wouldn't know what they are driving, they probably don't even want to drive/ride, may never do so, but they will probably vote.
No one in power (?) cares what old folk think about vehicles in 10/20 years time, we won't be around to vote.
Upt.
 
@Whisker Bill posted a picture that pretty much summed up this debate the other day over a coffee. It's actually something I understand. Unlike the graphs and numbers which individuals and organisations like to quote as fact and rarely are. I'll reproduce it here for those that don't drink coffee......you know who you are!
Upt.
IMG_1999.jpeg
 
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My grandchildren and their children, your grandchildren and their children will live in a world dependent on the decisions we make today long after my generation is gone on to our rewards. Do the right things today.
 
dduelin said:
My grandchildren and their children, your grandchildren and their children will live in a world dependent on the decisions we make today long after my generation is gone on to our rewards. Do the right things today.
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When you say, "we make today", who can make those decisions and will they.
Are you planning a long ride this year, maybe a flight, a cruise? Maybe just day rides adding up to a few thousand miles? If we believe what we are being told then that leisure time will lead to the added release of harmful gases. It doesn't matter if you use an electric vehicle either, where do the electrons come from? How much harmfulness will be released by making that posh new EV? Will you give that time up, stay at home and keep the AC off?
These are big issues, and for the record I believe the weather patterns are changing compared to when I was a lad.
The map posted by @ST1100Y is pretty interesting don't you think? I don't think changing my bulbs to LED and running motors which all return 60+ mpg (which I have) will save the planet, if indeed, the death of the planet is what finally occurs.
Do what you think makes a difference, it might help us to sleep at night but no one East of the EU gives a toss.
Upt.
 
tpasco1995 said:
If a tech is using line-side adapters to pull 1234yf through a 134a RRR machine that isn't certified by the manufacturer to be compatible with both and provides a decontamination regimen, they're already in violation of their Section 609 licensure. The fact that YF is flammable and 134a equipment isn't necessarily manufactured with that consideration would have me steer away from it.

The identifier doesn't have to be changed at all; the Nuerotronics Mini ID is the standard for YF and the filters are only $70 when they get oil-fouled. Yeah, it's $800, but the 134a ones are about $500 and the filters cost about $70 so it's an extremely minimal cost variation.

If a shop is trying to save a buck by avoiding a second recovery machine, that's no different than the ones that avoided getting OBD2 computers and tried getting by on jumper wired between pins for CANBUS diagnostics. Shortcuts only go so far.

I haven't used the RRR machine for 1234yf yet; I've done straight recovery though and it's really no different.
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It's a lot different your luckey to get it done in a hour. From the Robinair owners manual "operating time of the identifer and unit are limited. If not replaced unit will not recover or recharge" . Ours had to be replaced and I don't think we went through more that 5 10 lbs cans.
Where did you find " $3950 for a Mastercool RRR machine for R-1234yf. "
 
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tpasco1995 said:
This "there's no perfect option so let's keep going with the absolute worst since it's meaningless anyway" mentality...
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There is a logic error...

Already in the 70ies "calls to doom" warned about finite resources... however did politics and corporations act right out contrary:
the cycle of constantly producing more and more products to sell them faster and faster to more and more people... growth and that...

And this is what trips me in this religious current propaganda:
the most environmentally friendly product is the one I don't need to produce...
So that "safe the planet" cult boils down to that we all simply have to buy new stuff, yet to be produced...
(and the arguments come from a generation of fast-fashion, fast-food and the need for a new phone every 3 months... :confused: )
Sorry, alone the production of that oh-so-great-EV puts out more pollution then my old Toyota is able to blow out within the theoretical next 500 years...
The rig is a '96 with over 300,000km on the clock, hence already saved the production of at least two new cars...

TLGO with pretty much everything, home appliances, consumer electronics, computers, smartphones, etc...
 
If I wanted to ride an electric scooter, then I'd buy one. If smog is THAT BAD in any city or country to invoke a banning of such a small niche market, then they are waaay out of touch. Sorry fellas, but I'm glad I'm not in the UK.
 
tpasco1995 said:
Grasping to vague concepts that don't track to anything tangible is virtue signaling.

35% of the carbon dioxide emissions in the US are from electricity production. 20% of electricity production is renewable (wind, hydro, and solar; not nuclear), and 20% is coal. If just that coal moves to renewables, then that wipes out more than 50% of the total carbon footprint of US electrical production. An 18% reduction in carbon output that has zero impact on the industrial sector.

38% of the carbon emissions are from transportation; literally tailpipe emissions. Breaking that out, rail accounts for 1.7% of transportation emissions, air transit for only about 2.5%, commercial trucks contribute 23.4%, and passenger cars 58.5%. The remaining 14% is predominantly ocean shipping vessels.

If the average fuel economy of commercial trucks can go up from 7.5 MPG to 15, be it with hybrid drivetrains or electric long-hauls or electric short-haul fleets, that's a 5% carbon reduction overall. If the average fuel economy of passenger cars bumps up to 50 MPG by the same concepts (further electrification, hybrids becoming the standard offering like Toyota has shifted to with the Sienna and Camry, etc), that's an 11% reduction in overall carbon. 16% reduction just by making vehicles use less gas.

So if the US can reduce carbon emissions by 34% by phasing out only coal and making vehicles less expensive to operate per mile, and the infrastructure ramp-up to build batteries and wind turbines and charging stations adds to the industrial sector, the suggestion that reducing carbon output results in "killing industrial output" is farcical at best.

This "there's no perfect option so let's keep going with the absolute worst since it's meaningless anyway" mentality pains me because it's decisions for how I'm going to spend my forties, fifties, sixties, and seventies being made by people that will have long before become "worm bait", as @the Ferret so eloquently put it yesterday. We're talking about policies for 2040.
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Hey, I get it. You're a true believer. I've just been around long enough to see industrial output pushed overseas, for many reasons, one major one being environmental. If you think that is "farcical" so be it. If you think that the infrastructure "ramp up" to build batteries, wind turbines, and charging stations will happen here, well, I have a bridge to sell you. And that's it for me. You wanna disagree, do it. But we're done.
 
jdmccright said:
If I wanted to ride an electric scooter, then I'd buy one. If smog is THAT BAD in any city or country to invoke a banning of such a small niche market, then they are waaay out of touch. Sorry fellas, but I'm glad I'm not in the UK.
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The polution's that bad here I can only see 25 miles today!
I'm going to write to my MP.
The UK thing is a bit of a red herring really. The EU is way ahead of us when it comes to clean air zealots. I've just applied for my Crit Air certificate from France. €160 fine if you ride into town without one displayed.
Don't worry if you ride an ST11 though, they're too old to even get one. Not that that's a good thing because you'll still get fined.
It's coming to a town near you soon, yes it is.
Manufacturers can't afford to make different products for different markets and the EU is a big market.
When you lose different models of motorcycles at the moment that is down to EU pollution regs, that's what is driving the market. Bless em.
Upt.
 
You'd think the UK would be banning cows ;)

The Global Methane Emission From Cows Issue - HomeBiogas

"The beef and dairy cattle industry is responsible for about 14.5% of the world’s greenhouse gas emissions, and more than half of this gas is methane. This potent greenhouse gas traps heat in the atmosphere 25 times more effectively than carbon dioxide."

Of the top 5 methane producing industries, "agriculture is at the top, and cow methane emissions make up almost 70% of the total emissions in this area. How is that possible? Each cow produces about 220 pounds of methane annually. Multiply that by 1 billion cows, and you will better understand why something needs to change in the beef and dairy industry to make agriculture more sustainable and eco-friendly.

Why is this so crucial and urgent? Methane has 80 times the short-term warming potential of carbon dioxide, making it one of the most potent greenhouse gases. In fact, scientists estimate that half of the warming occurring over the following two decades will be caused by the increasing amounts of methane in the atmosphere. "

Crazy world isn't it? Won't even be able to get a decent steak or burger someday if the greenies get their way :rofl1:
 
They may well fart a lot, but they don't half taste nice.
I could just eat a fillet.
But alas it's duck legs for dinner, ......do ducks fart? I've never seen them blowing bubbles.
The French would have a clean air certificate on them before they could say quackers.
Upt.
 
jdmccright said:
Sorry fellas, but I'm glad I'm not in the UK.
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Romans introduced wine vineyards to England during the Roman Warm Period … 250BC -AD450. :wine2:

Tom

Roman Warm Period
Topographic map of the area affected by the Roman Warm Period, specifically Europe and the NE North Atlantic Ocean
The Roman Warm Period affected Europe and the North Atlantic Ocean.
Duration250 BC – AD 400
LocationEurope and the North Atlantic
The Roman Warm Period, or Roman Climatic Optimum, was a period of unusually-warm weather in Europe and the North Atlantic that ran from approximately 250 BC to AD 400.[1]Theophrastus (371 – c. 287 BC) wrote that date trees could grow in Greece if they were planted but that they could not set fruit there. That is still the case today, which implies that South Aegeanmean summer temperatures in the 4th and the 5th centuries BC were within a degree of modern ones. That and other literary fragments from the time confirm that the Greek climate was basically the same then as around 2000. Tree rings from the Italian Peninsula in the late 3rd century BC indicate a time of mild conditions there around the time of Hannibal's crossing of the Alps with imported elephants in 218 BC.
 
diferg said:
George Orwell was a SAGE! (all those under 60 google "Nineteen Eighty-Four".)
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He thought he was writing warnings. Instead, his works are instruction manuals.

Alternate energy bikes, and other things are on the horizon, depending on how quickly it can be made both effective from a pollution and utility standpoint. I'd like to add 'attractive'. Alternative energy vehicle companies should fire all their current design teams, confiscate and burn their paintbrushes.
 
Probably won't make much difference anyway. pass the tipping point this "natural" warming of the earth is going to happen. When I watched Nova on tv they found old remnants of palm trees in Alaska... imagine that. People have to remember that after the Global warming period then the ice age will start. I wonder what they will blame that on:rofl1:
 
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