Update U Joint - Was a Bearing Issue instead

Gandolkf

Gandolkf

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Joined
May 29, 2009
Messages
790
Location
Farmers Branch,Tx
Bike
2018 Wing
Some of you Know I had U Joint problems coming back from Chicago.I probably should not have riden as long as i did tring to get back home.
Honda warranty is doing good on covering this fiasco.

Hope to get it back before CheapStoc
 

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Re: Update U Joint

How many miles? I have an extra on the shelf if you need it sent out.
 
Re: Update U Joint

Fergie,

You made a mess out of that! I am glad Honda is taking care of the ST! Let us know when it is back on the road.

Mike
 
Re: Update U Joint

Oh ya it got hot they are replacing wiring harness,due to small fire.
One of the mechanics said 1 1/2 weeks(that would be great)

Started to rush project bike?might be ready for ChearSToc
 
Re: Update U Joint

Enquiring minds would like to know... how many miles did you have on the bike before this happened?

The pictures of the joint sure look like there is some rust colored crud in the joint almost like it was in the other one that caught fire.
 
Re: Update U Joint

Looks a lot like Shuey's. That make three that I know about, yours, Shuey's and Joe's. This sounds like a fairly common failure........
 
Re: Update U Joint

There's 2 or 3 others, CrazyKZ being one..

Here's the link to my thread, mine didn't actually fail but was making a minor noise which could be the precursor to the louder banging noise and eventual failure.

Here's the video I posted:

[video=youtube;otnNHbI-EiM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otnNHbI-EiM[/video]

Here's a poll, are u-join failures.

My personal opinion is any of the ones failing before 100k, and maybe some of them, is the rubber boot that connects between the Swingarm and the engine. That keeps out moisture and on many of these failures - if not all of them - you see rust colored contamination inside the swingarm. I'm thinking if those aren't installced correctly and don't keep out moisture, the u-joint is bound to fail eventually.

Could be with all the small metal particles inside that area when it's starting to fail, they just start to rust fast... so not sure if it's truly bad u-joints or the contamination from a poorly installed boot. When I took mine apart there was an impression on the edge of that rubber boot that 'appeared' like it was being pushed against the sharp edge of the swingarm instead of over and in the 'lip' of it.

The problem is it's really tough to know if it's installed correctly as it's very tough to get to. The wheel has to be off and the right side fairing and engine hanger bracket needs to be removed. Even then, it's visually hard to verify, you have to feel around to check it.
 
Re: Update U Joint

Smash said:
That's fantastic! How much downtime?
Click to expand...
Not the head guy but one of the guys there said about 1 1/2 weeks,but as of Thurs aft they had not ordered anything yet
Landon said:
How many miles? I have an extra on the shelf if you need it sent out.
Click to expand...
Thanks Landon,but I was lucky enough to buy the extended warranty,and the miles are over 32000 i might have turned 33000 coming back from Chicago.
Denba said:
That looks like it got HOT! Is the swing arm shot too?
Click to expand...
Ya it got a little hot after i pulled into gas station a small fire started under seat,thru my cola on it stoped for a second then it starting back up,ran into station grabbed a gallon of water and put it out(ruined wiring connections Honda's putting in new wiring harness)Swing arm is shot so is the shock
 
Re: Update U Joint

Bad rubber boot is a problem on many front drive cars with CV joints. Sounds like something we should all check. 1100s have a similar boot and it's easy to NOT install it correctly (like after a 40 amp upgrade.)
 
Re: Update U Joint

George said:
Bad rubber boot is a problem on many front drive cars with CV joints. Sounds like something we should all check. 1100s have a similar boot and it's easy to NOT install it correctly (like after a 40 amp upgrade.)
Click to expand...

It's tough to check on the 1300 as you have to do it by feel... Next time I have my rear wheel off, I'm going to see if I can put my point and shoot camera in macro mode and get some pics.. maybe that's the best way to check as unless you know what it feels like when it's off you may not know if you have an issue. I may take the wheel off and try that tomorrow.
 
Re: Update U Joint

I replaced the output shaft seal on my 04 (33k) this past winter. It would drip just enough oil to be annoying, maybe 2-3 drops overnight when it was parked. Using the shop manual and threads found on this site for u-joint replacement it went pretty good. The seal had a very small nick in it which I believe was caused by contamination from the boot being out of place. There was a little dirt in there, mostly stuck in place by the leaking oil. I think the boot must have been out of the groove for the oil to leak out where it did. The u-joint seemed fine. It moved smoothly and didn't have any rust on it. Probably the oil leak was a good thing as it drew attention to the boot issue before the u-joint smoked. I replaced the boot and the seal. Putting the boot back on was the hardest part of the job. I said some things about Honda engineers that weren't nice at all but I think it helped. I believe they purposely make working on bikes hard for people with big hands, maybe some kind of Napoleon complex. :wink:
 
Re: Update U Joint

OP - Wow...

I replaced mine only because of a "vibration/looseness" I felt. My U-joint didn't technically fail, the vibration/looseness I felt lasted for probably 10k or so as I was trying to find the problem. I'm close to 30k on the second one now... currently I "feel" no issues.

Now that I've said that it will probably explode on the way home today :roll:.

tom de
 
Re: Update U Joint

I don't think that contamination from an improperly installed boot is the issue. How many cars and truck have U-joints that hang out in the weather their entire life?? I'm sure the contamination is not helping the issue, but I don't think it's the root cause.

There HAS to be a problem with the U-Joint itself; either improperly hardened materials, lack of lubrication or something along these lines.
 
Re: Update U Joint

sirepair said:
I don't think that contamination from an improperly installed boot is the issue. How many cars and truck have U-joints that hang out in the weather their entire life?? I'm sure the contamination is not helping the issue, but I don't think it's the root cause.

There HAS to be a problem with the U-Joint itself; either improperly hardened materials, lack of lubrication or something along these lines.
Click to expand...

True, I was talking to Fergie this weekend about that as well. However... most cars drive shafts probably don't move up/down to the same degree that a MC one will.. But, not sure that really matters.

So, then why have a boot at all.... if Honda didn't think it was necessary they wouldn't spend the $ on them...

I can see the boot keeping out contaminants that might make their way to the rear FD and bearings there, so maybe THAT is why there's a boot...

I have seen this 'rare' thing happen on many other bike forums devoted to bikes w/final drives... I say 'rare' because it is... as large as we are here, we are only a fraction of the total ST1300 / ST1100 riders out there, many more in Europe.. Some of them are here... and given that, even our small slice of the overall sales have only reported a handful of failures, not all of them were failures that caused the bike to be down either... some like mine were just because other symptoms were going on and I narrowed it down to this.

Will your u-joint fail? The odds JUST from this forum are very low..

The whole 'boot' thing with me was, it's so difficult to get on the swingarm during installation, I have to wonder how many are not on correctly at the factory.. .or, just pop off..
 
Re: Update U Joint

The boot is more likely there to keep clothes and toes from getting caught in the workings. THAT would make for a bad day!

Is there a weep hole in the swing arm? I don't recall there being one in the 1100's swing arm, but I may have overlooked it.
 
Re: Update U Joint

sirepair said:
The boot is more likely there to keep clothes and toes from getting caught in the workings. THAT would make for a bad day!

Is there a weep hole in the swing arm? I don't recall there being one in the 1100's swing arm, but I may have overlooked it.
Click to expand...

Considering how hard it is to get to the boot... I don't think you could get anything in there unless you were trying.. .but, I see your point.

No weep hole in the swingarm... it is broken into two chambers with a hole in the center divider so the drive shaft can go through.
 
Re: Update U Joint

I have a video/inspection tool ordered (handheld w/light on tip) and if I can use that to view the boot on a bike without taking anything off, the bike that is, I'm taking it to CampSTOC as it looks like there will be a lot of bikes there.

I'm curious just how many might have a boot not completely on... no conclusions from that of course, just curious how many MIGHT not have a boot completely installed.
 
Re: Update U Joint

Soooooo!! Should I continue totalling bikes before they get to 50K?
 
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