Avon Storm Concerned

[sennister]

I had Storms on my ST1100 and endured the wobble.

Went to Bridgestones and had no wobble at all.

Storms are sticky but squirmy.

At least on my 1100.


Styles

That is what I have found. They really like getting into a corner. They are also great in the rain. The small bit instability that get are easily combated by keeping my hands on the grips where they should be. It is never enough that I felt out of control. I do fell it though. I can easily control the shake with one hand so even if I am doing something on the GPS it isn't an issue. And it only happens while slowing while coasting (no brakes or engine braking). Other than that the bike wanders more when caught in rough winds like following a semi or large motorhome. I tend not to ride around them long so it is a non-issue as well.

Even when my old OEM Dunlops were new I would notice hydroplaning at speeds as low as 50 MPH. In the same conditions on the same roads I have gone 80MPH with the Storms and not a hint of hydroplaning. They are great in the rain and in the corners. So much so that I overlook any instability that they may have.

 

[YR]

What is the difference between a Pan ST 1300 and a US ST 1300?

I believe that the Pan-European feels much more peer pressure at traffic lights than his American brother. I also believe that, for the most part, the quality of life of the US ST is much better due to lower road congestion.

 

[okckeith]

I encourage you guys to call. If we show them the market for these tires they might move on this a little quicker. I always grab the bull by the horns and call the source.

I was hearing the same stories until I called them direct. Hope it helps.

Just want everybody to know not calling anybody wrong or right here, just passing info along.

Just wanted to say thanks for your help. And your input. You might be on to something. Maybe enough phone calls might get the ball rolling.

 

[saaz]

I have had a few sets of the Avons on a 96 ST11. No instability problems whatsoever at any speed. But I haven't had any problems with BT020s, Z6s, Roadsmarts, D205s and now Continental Roadattacks, even when really worn. And I have used ST13 sizes in some of these sets of tyres.

Not to say noone else has problems, but someone has to put a good side to things, as usually only problems are discussed even if most are quite happy.

 

[river]

Put them on this weekend and they have no weave (nor did Bridgestones). The transition from straight to leaned over is smoother than the Bridgestones, and I'm leaning far more than I did with those. They had a couple thousand miles left, but were starting to square. They also corrected my right pull, it's perfect now.

Every dealer I asked around here (maybe four) had no problem getting Storms in.

 

[Raven]

+1 on the Avons (again).

I find them much quicker to turn in than the Bridgestones and MUCH more confidence inspiring in cornering. Plus I get way more miles out of a set than the Bridgestones ever got even though the OEM's always felt harder than the Avons.

Avons are a little twitchier on the slab than Bridgestones but they also have a sharper profile (which is why they are so SWEET in corners).

The Avons have the proper weight rating.
They have the proper speed rating.
They have the proper sizes.
The prices are good.
The mileage is great.
The cornering is fantastic.
The feedback is excellent.

YMMV

I like them and will be putting them on my ST1300 again (and again, and again).

 

[Winged_STer]

I liked them so much I bought a new set (sitting in the garage) for when I wear these out. They give me a ton more confidence than the Bridgestones ever did, especially in the rain. I had hoped to use the replacements earlier but life happens.

Anyway, I'd buy them again in a heartbeat.

 

[EASt]

...The transition from straight to leaned over is smoother than the Bridgestones...

Could that be because the new tires are rounded instead of squared off?

 

[dduelin]

I felt the same thing - I think it is because the OEM Bridgestone 020's have a more triangular profile if that makes sense. The 020's fell into turns and needed a bit more countersteer to hold a constant radius compared to the Storm's profile. Taken a bit further the Michelin Pilot Road I, the original, has a rounder semi eliptical profile that slows turn in and numbs feedback. The Avon Storm responds kind of in the middle between these two others. Very direct feel at tip in and great feedback. It doesn't hurt that they wear very evenly and about as long as any other tire I tried.

 

[Raven]

Actually I'd say the Storms are more triangular in profile than the Stones and make for quicker turn in. The Stones always felt like you had to force it into the turn so I'd say they had a flatter profile (flatter profile = less tendency to turn in).

 

[Byron]

I've said this before and I'll say it again:

Honda fits the ST1300 with two different tire brands, Bridgestone and Dunlop. Here is a comparison of the specifications the tires are built to:

Front

120/70 ZR18 59W (536 lbs.) for Storm, D220 OEM, BT-020 OEM

Rear

170/60 ZR17 72W (783 lbs.) for Storm, D220 OEM and 73W (805 lbs.) for BT-020 OEM


It doesn't matter who the tire manufacture is, as long as their tire meets the OEM specifications than it is considered appropriate by Honda. In other words if it meets the minimum specifications (size, speed rating and weight rating) then it is OK to use.

Now the only other slightly confusing point is what does Honda use as the determining factor as to the installation of Dunlop or Bridgestone tires on the bike? Is it the ABS vs. non-ABS?

 

[dduelin]

I've said this before and I'll say it again:

Honda fits the ST1300 with two different tire brands, Bridgestone and Dunlop. Here is a comparison of the specifications the tires are built to:

Front

120/70 ZR18 59W (536 lbs.) for Storm, D220 OEM, BT-020 OEM

Rear

170/60 ZR17 72W (783 lbs.) for Storm, D220 OEM and 73W (805 lbs.) for BT-020 OEM


It doesn't matter who the tire manufacture is, as long as their tire meets the OEM specifications than it is considered appropriate by Honda. In other words if it meets the minimum specifications (size, speed rating and weight rating) then it is OK to use.

Now the only other slightly confusing point is what does Honda use as the determining factor as to the installation of Dunlop or Bridgestone tires on the bike? Is it the ABS vs. non-ABS?

It is moot. The OEM Dunlop 220 was discontinued and is no longer available for aftermarket. The only tire "approved" or "recommended" by Honda's stickers on the bike and tire brand information in the service manual and owners manual is the OEM Bridgestone.

 

[Uncle Phil]

Just a note on the ST1100 'wobble' with hands off the bars - Some of my ST1100s have it regardless of the tires, some do not have it at all. On my 97 with the most miles that I know needs the head bearings replaced, it has it really bad. I just don't take my hands off the bars ... ;-) YEMV

 

[Fred D]

<snip>
Now the only other slightly confusing point is what does Honda use as the determining factor as to the installation of Dunlop or Bridgestone tires on the bike? Is it the ABS vs. non-ABS?

I think they use whatever is coming down the line. My 06 ABS came with Bridgestones, my 07 ABS came with Dunlops.

 

[Byron]

It is moot. The OEM Dunlop 220 was discontinued and is no longer available for aftermarket. The only tire "approved" or "recommended" by Honda's stickers on the bike and tire brand information in the service manual and owners manual is the OEM Bridgestone.

Is is moot but not for the reason you listed. As with any other part on the motorcycle you can use parts from other manufactures as long as they are of equal or better quality. If Honda felt that the D220 tire was sufficient and you choose to replace it with another brand it won't void the warranty. Tires are built to DOT standards. So as long as you replace the tire with one of equal or higher standard there is not a problem. If you were to replace a tire with a lower standard or improper size then there might be a problem.

Why does everyone think that motorcycles are any different than cars? Most people don't have a problem with putting different brands and even different size tires on their 4-wheel vehicles but some freak out when it comes to motorcycles. Some of those same people have no problem with running a fuel with lower octaine from what Honda specifies/recommends and don't seem to have a problem with that. Go figure.

If you could only put on what was original equipment there would be a whole lot less tire companies out there.

I think they use whatever is coming down the line. My 06 ABS came with Bridgestones, my 07 ABS came with Dunlops.

I sort of thought that as well. My '06 non-ABS came with D220's but others came with BT-020's.


I just thought of another way of looking at the issue that may help ease some minds. I'm in law enforcement. As such when I worked traffic, in California, I had the legal right to pull over any vehicle at any time for no other purpose other than to conduct a safety check of the vehicle. I never really did this but it was on the books. Back to my point. The safety check would be for things like; are the required lights on the vehicle and operational, was all the required equipment on the vehicle (muffler(s), mirrors etc.). Are the tires appropriate for the vehicle; are they the proper size and weight rating are they on an appropriate rim size for the tire. I could then let the vehicle pass if everything was in order or cite or even have the vehicle towed if it was considered unsafe for the road. What I couldn't do is cite you for having the wrong brand (manufacture) of tire on the vehicle.

The simple fact is, find a set of tires that will float your boat and let's go out and wear some tread off them!

 

[river]

Could that be because the new tires are rounded instead of squared off?

Yes, that was my not very elegantly made point...I don't know how much is due to the wear on the B's, with the gradual change from wear it's hard to remember how they were 5000K ago.

 

[dduelin]

Is is moot but not for the reason you listed. As with any other part on the motorcycle you can use parts from other manufactures as long as they are of equal or better quality. If Honda felt that the D220 tire was sufficient and you choose to replace it with another brand it won't void the warranty. Tires are built to DOT standards. So as long as you replace the tire with one of equal or higher standard there is not a problem. If you were to replace a tire with a lower standard or improper size then there might be a problem.

You are singing to the choir with me. I have plenty of posts archived on the issue of "approved tires" and after the OEM's were toast I have never gone back to what Honda recommends in print and on the bike and have stated many times what you did - as long as the chosen tire meets DOT load ratings, is speed rated, and the correct size I have always said screw Honda's "approved tires" go get the tires you want for the kind of riding you do. I have.

 

[ST-Brian]

I hear what everyone's saying about meeting DOT standards and minimum load requirements. That said, I guess I'm still missing something. If it's all that simple, why on earth would the manufacture not add the ST1300 to their fitment list?

 

[Two Brothers]

I hear what everyone's saying about meeting DOT standards and minimum load requirements. That said, I guess I'm still missing something. If it's all that simple, why on earth would the manufacture not add the ST1300 to their fitment list?

Because they don't officially back it. If they don''t have it on there website then someone can't throw a lawsuit at them.

It's sad that the world has come to this but it's the truth.


I want them to fix it more than you guys cuz I can start selling them again. darnit.

 

[Landon]

Because they don't officially back it. If they don''t have it on there website then someone can't throw a lawsuit at them.

It's sad that the world has come to this but it's the truth.


I want them to fix it more than you guys cuz I can start selling them again. darnit.

Why not just have people fill out a waiver releasing you of any liability, then put in the file if needed later?