Harleys and Heat: truth or myth?

[Hotel 179]

My Vulcan's still running strong five years later with 35K on it and I love the bike.

The appropriate sentiment: Dismay

Roger that....I've owned HD and other bikes simultaneously for many years. I used to enjoy the tinkering that it took to keep 'em on the road. Now, I enjoy hitting the starter button and actually riding most of the time.

Maybe I'll catch you on the road up your way....you have more curves than we do....unless you count the bikinis at P'cola Beach

 

[RealST]

putting in my 2 cents as a Harley Rider.

The new 2010 HD Road Kings, Ultras etc. do have a rear cylinder cut out at idle, but that is to prevent your thighs from burning up, not the bike.

My Ultra has ridden in many group rides. Those are typically slow and long and with so many bikes so close, it gets really hot in the group. We are taking 100+ bikes running 3-5 hours in a pack. I never had a problem and never saw another with a heat problem. Other problems, sure. Who doesn't.

I ride in all weather. Heat, Rain, Cold. Not freezing weather though. 32 was the coldest I've ridden in. This summer we had some of the hottest temps and even though I was cooking up, the bike kept running.

Also, not everyone has this, but we have three cities that run Harley's on their police force. Thats city riding. Stop and Go. Very Hot and cold since they run year round.

So the bikes are fine in heat and all I can add is that my ST use to put out as much heat as the Ultra. The ST put it on my shins, the Ultra puts it on my thighs.

 

[Harpo]

Imagine the cooling strategy of disabling part of the engine to combat
overheating instead of putting in a decent cooling jacket or building in
an air cooling fan. Harley's too sunk in the traditional look and sound
to produce a state-of-the-art motorcycle IMHO. Even the water-cooled
Harley's stubbornly stick to the vertical twin and belt drive.

There just never was sufficient cooling air for their air cooled rear
cylinder; it's caused more engine problems than any other aspect of
those bikes and this is Harley's bandaid! How revolutionary!

I'd like to see Milwaukee strike out in a more modern direction one of
these days with a multi-cylinder waterpumper shaftie and a revised
frame geometry and try to court more advanced riders instead of the
tattoo-and-skull crowd, but I don't think they ever will. It's a shame
the US can't produce anything other than two-wheeled tractors.

So for now they transform into a thumper whenever the heat in the
kitchen gets too hot .. and they still bake the rider's thighs. In the
words of Julia Roberts "Well, we don't want to roast this squab too
long or it will kill the flavor".

 

[MotorSam]

2005-2006 Kings (Police Models)... Specifically in the summer we can't leave them running on traffic stops or much anything else that requires us to be sitting for anything other than a signal light...They will either die or run REALLY bad for quite some time. And parade duty? Forget it Cough sputter cough sputter... :roll:

 

[schumacher]

yep, they get hot

 

[Tailgunner]

I rode a 92 FXLRC and a 90 Heritage Softail in Tucson, AZ for years with no heat issues. Both bikes had Evo motors. My bikes never overheated and I rode in 100+ temps all the time.

My $.02

 

[Harpo]

Motors?

They were electric bikes? That'd explain the lack of heat issues!

 

[8-BALL]

How hot is to hot? ??????????????????????

My Victory Vegas runs at 200 Degrees on cool days like today (80 degrees and lower,) and 250 on hotter days.

I have thermometer for an oil dipstick.

The '09 8-BALL has an oil cooler.

Thanks,

Dave C.

 

[schumacher]

yeh, I often wonder if those that complain about how hot thier Harley is aren't just wimps :

 

[RealST]

Re: Harley's and Heat: truth or myth?

Motors?

They were electric bikes? That'd explain the lack of heat issues!

Since the word Motorcycle comes from Motorized Bicycle, I'd have to say that Motor is more appropriate that engine. :

Hybrid owners call gas engines ICE now and electric motors EVO's so now I have to remember that the power plant in a car or truck is an Engine, on a bike its a motor and in a hybrid its an ICE

Anyway, anyone see the Electric Chopper from OCC? I honestly can't see my Harley as a Hybrid, but I could easily see the GL or ST as a hybrid.

 

[Harpo]

Motors require an external energy supply. Motors convert energy into motion.
They require either electricity, vacuum, or pressurized gas or fluid to function. Motors
cannot function on their own without the external energy supply. The term 'motor'
as a prefix denotes that something is capable of moving itself .. not that it contains a
motor. As a suffix, the term is 'motive'. Still doesn't mean there's a motor in it, but
that it can motivate itself.

Engines convert fuel into energy and then convert that energy into motion. They are
a combination of motor and fuel storage/conversion device. Most motorcycles are equipt
with gasoline ENGINES, although a few now sport electric MOTORS and storage batteries.

My old automotive shop teacher would hand anybody who called an engine a motor
a shop broom and instruct them to thoroughly sweep the entire shop. I still bridle
whenever I hear an engine called a motor.

 

[8-BALL]

My old automotive shop teacher would hand anybody who called an engine a motor
a shop broom and instruct them to thoroughly sweep the entire shop. I still bridle
whenever I hear an engine called a motor.[/quote]

================================================

My red-neck NASCAR fans and I should have had your old shop teacher .

Now can you respond to post #28 ?

 

[M&M Take2]

Had a buddy with an older Sportster (74/75) who managed to melt a back piston due to heat, too many people and not enough motor, but he never had a problem with his Heritage. Does this mean I ride an enginecyle? Marty

 

[Harpo]

It means motorcycles and automotive products generally have gasoline engines
for powerplants. Post #28: see post 33 regarding older sportster.

And yes, the NASCAR crowd has never impressed me with technical prowess nearly
as much as the formula one crowd has. Not much difference between NASCAR,
roller derby, and professional wrestling from where I sit. I do like to watch them
smash up their silly looking race cars and flip each other the finger, though.

Also, the formula one guys tend to move much faster and have more teeth ..

 

[Hotel 179]

"Motor" was a term historically used to distinguish the new internal combustion engine from the steam engine.

 

[sennister]

I wouldn't say total myth.

My cousin is on the Osman Cycle Corps and they have had issues with their bikes overheating and shutting down. Granted they are doing parades so they are moving slow on hot days but this could happen in heavy traffic. They all ride new Ultra Classics

Osman Cycle Corps

They sure do put on a great show.

 

[Harpo]

So in hot weather the HD shuts down the rear cylinder. Does that prevent
overheating in the front cylinder? No, it doesn't.

Look at it at face value: air cooled engine, no cooling fan, rear cylinder nearly
completely out of the airflow and tucked in under the rider's seat.

Sound like good engineering to you?

Every year thousands of Americans shell out premium payments for one or more
of these machines .. and the engineering isn't offering anything better in all these
years other than removing 50% of the power from the engine to cut the sweltering
heat buildup and increasing oil flow to critical heat failure areas in the engine. That
oil may or may not have an oil cooler .. and if it does, it's a passive (no
cooling fan) oil cooler. So the oil just heats up to french fry temps and stops
cooling altogether.

If there were no suckers, there would be no rich people.

 

[Shadowfirecat]

Went threw the desert a couple of times in triple digit temps with mine without any issue and my old mans hasn't had any issues either.... though we have had them with the heat. Mine- 2008 Road Glide, His- 2006 Road Glide. But I have had issues with my ST in the heat after 500 miles nonstop in the heat except for fuel.

 

[hihosilver]

I was wondering if this thread would eventually peter out, but I see it has a 'motor' of its own still.

I'll jump in.

I've been a lot of miles on HD TC88 and TC96 engines. Via the handy oil dipstick integrated thermometer, I recorded an oil temp in a Softtail tank of over 300 once in a hot stop and go parade (almost 350 if I remember right but I really don't remember exactly), but no rear cylinder shutdown.

After that I asked the HD shop guys about that automatic rear cylinder 'cooling feature', and the response I got was that it was only ever availabe on the cop bikes and never worked that well and never made it into the non-cop bikes.

I have been told that on the new fly-by-wire throttle bikes (08 and later touring models I think) that rolling the throttle forward (away from you) at idle now invokes the rear cylinder cooling function by shutting off spark and letting the fuel still flow through to absorb the heat. Something you could do at a red light or when stopped in traffic.

I have not tried it on a running bike, but I did roll a throttle forward on a bike on the showroom floor and it felt like there was something like that there.

Anyway, even with all that air-cooled heat coming off the HD, the ST is still by far hotter around the feet. But you can't beat 'three bars' on the temp gauge that are rock solid no matter what the heat outside, and I have never shut off the ST in stop and go traffic jam. I've done it on the HD plenty of times tho.

 

[Harpo]

The HD really gets into trouble in stop-and-go traffic, not a straight-through run
through a desert. The desert run provided airflow, so we wouldn't expect a failure
there. During a construction phase on I-26 near Columbia traffic was at a total
standstill and I was sweltering .. all the ST's head was being extracted from the
engine efficiently enough to fry my legs and make me miserable.

After traffic finally crawled to the top of a knoll I noticed a group of HDs under
a tree off to the side. Decided to leave the highway and join them. I was there
because my body was fried and they were there because the bikes were fried.
They had no choice.

They complimented me on my beemer, by the way. You should have stood next
to one of those HDs .. the heat was considerable and you could see the light
distorted just above the bikes.