New LED city street lights, idiot drivers

[scootac]

Similar rules here but fines are stiffer.

Fines for distracted driving in Ontario can be anywhere from $615 to $3,000 with three to six demerit points.
If you're a first-time offender and you dispute the ticket, a $615 ticket increases to $1,000 if you lose.

A second-time offender will receive a $615 ticket that increases to $2,000 if they dispute it and lose. They can also expect six demerit points and license suspension for seven days.

For third-time offenders, a $615 ticket goes up to $3,000 if they take it to court and lose. Mar 20, 2020

A law with a bite to it.....GOOD!!!!

 

[SMSW]

A lot of cars now have the daytime running lights come on with the ignition (our Toyota has an automatic setting for the lights for this and a sensor next to the windshield; my GMC van has the same thing) and folks just turn the knob to auto or blow it and turn it to a DRL setting and think they have turned their lights on. With all the ambient light, as @spiderman302 described, its easy to drive off and not realize you need your lights.

 

[Mophead]

I see a lot of people in cars that you know have bluetooth connections but they still have to have that phone in their hand and up to their ear. Tends to be more of the female variety but some guys also. The phone is more addicting than crack.

The can't talk or text while driving laws in Texas are a joke especially when you see a LEO going down the street talking on his phone AND working his laptop at the same time with their Oakley's on. If the law can multi task why can't I?

Its the world we live in folks. Watch those front wheels coming at you a little more closely. And the ones from behind.

 

[Mophead]

Here's the law here - for those who choose to follow it. You'd have to live under 3 rocks here to not know you can't text and drive or use a non hands free phone, which is why there's no warnings - just tickets.

What is illegal and what is not under the law?
Telephone calls: You cannot make or take calls when driving unless your telephone is hands-free or single-touch. If there is an emergency, you can call 911. Only while driving a police, fire or ambulance vehicle are you allowed to make or take a call.
Texting: You are not allowed. Ever.
Portable GPS: You can look at your GPS screen, but you cannot program or handle it.
MP3 or other entertainment devices: You can handle built-in devices. If you have a portable device plugged in while you drive, you can listen, but you cannot touch.
Display screen: If it is built into your vehicle, it is fine. Otherwise, you cannot have it in your view.
Two-way radio: You can use a two-way radio if driving for commercial purposes or driving a commercial vehicle (a bus or vehicle with gross mass of 4,500 kg or more), or involved in an emergency operation or search-and-rescue.

What is the penalty?
Drivers who violate the legislation can be fined $172.50 and lose three points from their licence.

So can you legally eat a triple meat bacon stuffed Whosever Burger with bucket of fries and a 42 gallon drink while driving? And we allow applying of makeup while driving too. That's ok here in the states just checking north of here.

 

[Obo]

So can you legally eat a triple meat bacon stuffed Whosever Burger with bucket of fries and a 42 gallon drink while driving? And we allow applying of makeup while driving too. That's ok here in the states just checking north of here.

Well they can charge you with distracted driving for anything (eating, doing makeup, having sex....) but there are too many of those to list in a document. The ones they've done up here refer to specific electronic devices that make up the majority of the culprits.

 

[STFlips]

Yep and when your burger/makeup/condom is smashed all over your face, then proof of distracted driving charge is evident...

 

[SMSW]

So can you legally eat a triple meat bacon stuffed Whosever Burger with bucket of fries and a 42 gallon drink while driving? And we allow applying of makeup while driving too. That's ok here in the states just checking north of here.

I believe our law that prohibits cell and texting while driving (unless hands free*) also says no 'distracted driving'. While this gives LEO's latitude to cite eating that 3 lb. burger and holding the 42 gallon barrel of pop, given the number of people doing all of the above makes me think the 'on the books' $1000 fine is rarely levied. Were the papers to list that 10 folks were fined $1K this week and 12 were last week, don't you think it would decrease the frequency of texting?

*What is a hands free device? How many folks say, "Hey Siri, answer the phone" or "Hey Siri, call Helen, mobile"? If you push a button on your steering wheel, is that 'hands free'? How about swiping a phone in a holder on the dashboard vent?

 

[Obo]

I believe our law that prohibits cell and texting while driving (unless hands free*) also says no 'distracted driving'. While this gives LEO's latitude to cite eating that 3 lb. burger and holding the 42 gallon barrel of pop, given the number of people doing all of the above makes me think the 'on the books' $1000 fine is rarely levied. Were the papers to list that 10 folks were fined $1K this week and 12 were last week, don't you think it would decrease the frequency of texting?

*What is a hands free device? How many folks say, "Hey Siri, answer the phone" or "Hey Siri, call Helen, mobile"? If you push a button on your steering wheel, is that 'hands free'? How about swiping a phone in a holder on the dashboard vent?

I've seem folks distracted just trying to adjust the radio or the AC/heat and vents... of those that spend more time looking at things out the side window vs in front of them.
I think Spiderman hit it right on the head with the name of the thread as the two things are related but separate - LED city street lights being the first topic and idiot drivers being the other. I doubt the new lights have been the cause, rather the drivers have always been idiots.

 

[rwthomas1]

One of the (few) things GM got right on my GM trucks is the "auto" setting is the default for the headlights. Impossible to forget to turn them on. Even better, when I leave in the dark, the lights are on, and when the sun rises, they turn off at the appropriate time. Drive into a tunnel, click, they go on. Drive out, click, off. Heavy rain, dark skies, click, on they go. Etc. I'm not one for electronic doodads, but this one is entirely seamless, it just works.

RT

 

[Obo]

One of the (few) things GM got right on my GM trucks is the "auto" setting is the default for the headlights. Impossible to forget to turn them on. Even better, when I leave in the dark, the lights are on, and when the sun rises, they turn off at the appropriate time. Drive into a tunnel, click, they go on. Drive out, click, off. Heavy rain, dark skies, click, on they go. Etc. I'm not one for electronic doodads, but this one is entirely seamless, it just works.

RT

Does it only have "auto" and "on"? If it has off setting at all you now have a way to muck it up.

 

[ddemair]

Here's the law here - for those who choose to follow it. You'd have to live under 3 rocks here to not know you can't text and drive or use a non hands free phone, which is why there's no warnings - just tickets.

What is illegal and what is not under the law?
Telephone calls: You cannot make or take calls when driving unless your telephone is hands-free or single-touch. If there is an emergency, you can call 911. Only while driving a police, fire or ambulance vehicle are you allowed to make or take a call.
Texting: You are not allowed. Ever.
Portable GPS: You can look at your GPS screen, but you cannot program or handle it.
MP3 or other entertainment devices: You can handle built-in devices. If you have a portable device plugged in while you drive, you can listen, but you cannot touch.
Display screen: If it is built into your vehicle, it is fine. Otherwise, you cannot have it in your view.
Two-way radio: You can use a two-way radio if driving for commercial purposes or driving a commercial vehicle (a bus or vehicle with gross mass of 4,500 kg or more), or involved in an emergency operation or search-and-rescue.

What is the penalty?
Drivers who violate the legislation can be fined $172.50 and lose three points from their licence.

Question about texting... I can text completely hands-free using google assistant and speech to text. Would that be allowed?

 

[SMSW]

Does it only have "auto" and "on"? If it has off setting at all you now have a way to muck it up.

My '17 Savanna has multiple settings. Yes you can muck it up.

 

[SMSW]

Question about texting... I can text completely hands-free using google assistant and speech to text. Would that be allowed?

Sure, as would be making a call by using Siri. In either case, you don't touch the phone. If Alexa does that on a 'Droid phone, then, of course - its all hands free. The lawmakers were concerned about folks trying to shift while holding a phone (yup, with an auto trans) or their inability to focus on the road while playing a game on said phone. Both of these are stretches, I have no idea what the impetus for these laws was. Of course you can do a LOT of stuff hands free, but since most folks use 10% of the capability of their electronic devices, expecting them to talk TO an electronic assistant is making a leap of logic. You would be astounded how many folks call an electrician to reset a circuit breaker. Maybe not in @Larry Fine's neck of the woods, but up here in the affluent (is that word effluent?)* suburbs the highly educated people have lost their ability to use their fingers and hands and think outside their area of specialty.
*I know the difference - that was a smelly attempt at humor.

 

[Obo]

Question about texting... I can text completely hands-free using google assistant and speech to text. Would that be allowed?

There's always minutiae that folks use to get away with something, some for legit reason and some to try and get around something. That's why we have so much damned fine print (and lawyers.)

I'd agree you can text with voice. My VW does it by allowing you to send a text via voice and it read it to you as well. I don't have to touch the phone at all. I think the caveat with that is the radio's touch screen doesn't show the text. It's only read out, if I have that feature on on my iPhone. My iPhone also has the ability to put it on "driving mode" where any texts or calls I get get voicemail or sorry I'm driving text reply. I've used it quite often (the read or send a text, not the auto reply / voicemail)
Is it allowed, I'd think so, but I also see how the wording says it's illegal. Is it texting or is it voice like a hands free phone call? If it leads to an accident (just like makeup, food etc,) then yeah it's distracted. Same arguments can be made for built in GPS. Using it is ok, just don't touch the display screen when driving. Again, a contradiction - here you go, installed "safety" feature, but illegal to use. Cue lawyer music.

The spirit of the law is a both a derent and educational - to prevent those who are using a device that distracts from the act of driving. Looking away from your surroundings and using 1 or both hands on a device and both eyes certainly is a distraction in my books. No one wants to pay a fine. Everyone knows it's not safe to do. Yet many still talk and text knowing it's illegal and unsafe. So does it really deter and educate? Perhaps. Does it stop it? Nope, but it met the deterrent goal - just not a full stoppage of it goal, as that's almost as impossible as any other law we have for any other crime from jaywalking to murder.

Take drinking and driving as a related but unrelated example. It distracts your driving via impairment vs distration. We all know it's not good and can cause death to both the person doing it as well as others. It differs as we have some level of acceptable amount (blood alcohol level) before it's illegal (we're not talking safe here, just what's allowed before it's considered criminal.) Then we have texting which seems to be no more harmful than causing carpal tunnel lol. We then set it's acceptable level with driving at zero. We have lower fines than driving drunk too.

Again the spirit of both DD's (distracted and drunk driving) is to make it safer for everyone, and yet so many seem to think it's either ok, or safe to do it, or do anyway it knowing it's not.

We have become an all about me and have to have it now society in many ways. But I digress...

As for what the laws I quoted say - there will always be folks who disagree. Right or wrong isn't for me to decide or to enforce. The laws are made up from the common agreed upon ideas and like it or not we all have to follow them - or choose to not and accept whatever comes from that. It's no different in many ways from the discussions about seat belts, helmets, speed limits, birth control, abortion. Society sets rules based on where you live and what the majority of folks feel is acceptable. Part of being a society is a general following of those agreed to laws until the time comes to amend, change or abolish them. We'll always have those that think they can either purposely disregard or slightly "bend" the rules without incident or legal recourse. Some will have no issues and see that as proof it's fine to have done it and to do it again. That's always going to be the case. Unfortunatley some will find it has consequences, both monetary and physically.

It's an easy fix to do. Why do we have such a hard time doing it then?

I'm curious if there's anyone here who disagrees with texting and driving as NOT being dangerous? I know it scares the crap out of me when especially when I'm riding, way more than the fear of a drunk driver does.

 

[rwthomas1]

Does it only have "auto" and "on"? If it has off setting at all you now have a way to muck it up.

Default is Auto. Next click up is parking lights, and the next click is on. Yes you can shut the lights off, but the knob is spring loaded back to Auto, so the next time the key is cycled, the lights come on. 99.9% of the time this means the lights are in Auto, as there is simply no reason to mess with them.
RT

 

[Jayco123]

15 years ago I was travelling on the I95 near Portsmouth to pick up a bike in Concord NH. I was pulling a trailer so was in the slow lane doing 60 mi/hr. I passed a 'elderly' gentleman who was in the centre lane doing about 55. He had the daily paper spread out across the steering wheel. As Mr. Gump said, "Stupid is as Stupid does"

 

[SMSW]

I passed a 'elderly' gentleman who was in the centre lane doing about 55. He had the daily paper spread out across the steering wheel. As Mr. Gump said, "Stupid is as Stupid does"

At least he will be up to date with current events when he heads to the promised land.....

 

[rwthomas1]

There's always minutiae that folks use to get away with something, some for legit reason and some to try and get around something. That's why we have so much damned fine print (and lawyers.)

As for what the laws I quoted say - there will always be folks who disagree. Right or wrong isn't for me to decide or to enforce. The laws are made up from the common agreed upon ideas and like it or not we all have to follow them - or choose to not and accept whatever comes from that. It's no different in many ways from the discussions about seat belts, helmets, speed limits, birth control, abortion. Society sets rules based on where you live and what the majority of folks feel is acceptable. Part of being a society is a general following of those agreed to laws until the time comes to amend, change or abolish them. We'll always have those that think they can either purposely disregard or slightly "bend" the rules without incident or legal recourse. Some will have no issues and see that as proof it's fine to have done it and to do it again. That's always going to be the case. Unfortunatley some will find it has consequences

“The United States is a nation of laws: badly written and randomly enforced.” - Frank Zappa.

The problem is we simply have too many laws. Period. Society no longer makes the laws, or pays attention. Special interest groups influence the crowd, buy the politicians and the bureaucrats bathe in the absurd minutiae. I'd bet anyone $100 that I can go in any home in the USA and find a violation of law. Any house. Building code, vehicular code, environmental law, traffic law, civil law, criminal law, ad infinitum. 99.9% of these laws are never enforced, and when they are its randomly. Try to go about your day without causing harm to anyone else, and hopefully yourself as well. For all but the big stuff in the criminal and civil areas, legality or illegality is largely irrelevant.

I'd never argue that texting and driving is not dangerous. It would be a pretty simple thing to make phones inoperative whilst driving. But the cellphone lobby is very powerful.

RT

 

[Ol'Tomcat]

I was at a 4 way stop the other day with 5 cars sitting across from me. As I went by, at least 3 of them had their faces stuck in their cell phones not paying attention at all to what was happening in front of them. It's a strange world out there where the last thing on a driver's mind is operating their vehicle. That's down around tenth place ....

If you were in Seattle it would have been all five vehicles. In Portland, OR, there would have been laptops in addition to the phones.

 

[Ol'Tomcat]

When riding or driving I turn my cell phone off. I'm not on call, and if someone has an emergency, they should be dialling 911, not me. Family included. I also avoid GPS, I find watching my progress on the map a distraction. My driving instructor told me that driving is a full-time job and I still believe that to be true.