Series vs Parallel Heated Suit Wiring- How Do I tell?

paulcb

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I only have heated socks but this thread has me thinking..lol. if you build a heated suit, vest gloves etc..all in series, nothing would work unless all pieces where plugged in... my question is, do you have to wear all the pieces for the suits to work?
No. In the jacket, the glove and jacket circuits are electrically independent, and controlled independently. I believe if you add heated socks/pant liners, they are controlled by the same jacket/gloves controls, i.e. turning up you gloves will turn up your socks.

Which socks do you use? I've tried a couple of battery powered sets and could hardly feel any heat at all, even on the high settings.
 

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@Larry Fine, is there no electrical test that I can perform that would determine whether it is a series or parallel set-up?
Yes there is, see post #6 , #16 and #18

I've got widder gear (gloves, sleeves, & vest) and you're correct the gloves are wired in series, ie. each glove gets 6v instead of being in parallel and getting 12v. So it sounds like the homemade wiring harness should work fine.
This is another clue that maybe will clarify things. If each glove is rated for 6 volts you could not hook it individually directly to the 12 volts on the bike, however two 6 volt gloves, wired in series, would be fine on the 12 volt system
 

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This is another clue that maybe will clarify things. If each glove is rated for 6 volts you could not hook it individually directly to the 12 volts on the bike, however two 6 volt gloves, wired in series, would be fine on the 12 volt system
IIRC, the Widder jacket liner did not have glove wires attached, you had arm 'chaps' that snapped (the snaps were also the electrical connection) to the vest and they had the glove connections. My guess is the 'parallel to series' switch was done in the arm chaps.
 
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No. In the jacket, the glove and jacket circuits are electrically independent, and controlled independently. I believe if you add heated socks/pant liners, they are controlled by the same jacket/gloves controls, i.e. turning up you gloves will turn up your socks.

Which socks do you use? I've tried a couple of battery powered sets and could hardly feel any heat at all, even on the high settings.
I think they are warm n safe. I bought from Ken Phenix, he treated me very well...
 

paulcb

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I think they are warm n safe. I bought from Ken Phenix, he treated me very well...
I have some gloves from him... really good guy. I don't really want the hassle of wired socks, so for now, my feet just get a little chilly. I sometimes use the chemical toe warmers if I'm riding for more than an hour or two, and they work ok.
 

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I have some gloves from him... really good guy. I don't really want the hassle of wired socks, so for now, my feet just get a little chilly. I sometimes use the chemical toe warmers if I'm riding for more than an hour or two, and they work ok.
Gerbing used to make heated insoles which were a little less hassle than the socks (I have both).
Since I put the VP Accessories foot rain shields in front of my footpegs, I've not used either of them.
 
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Andrew Shadow

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Damn, gonna make me think...lol if
Volt2÷resistance= power. If you ohm out a glove. Run the calculation. If the calculated power matches rated watts its parallel, if not series. Im thinking series will be a higher watt rating.
I found a place that listed the rated Watts for the gloves- 20 Watts.
I did the math and it confirms that they are wired in series.
 
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Andrew Shadow

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Widder is long gone and there are probably not that many people using or interested in their heated clothing. But, since I already did the research, I though that I would post what I have learned in case anyone else is ever curious or needs to know.

I found some information for the Widder heated gloves. They are rated by Widder at 20 Watts for the pair. They were wired in series by Widder, which was a design decision by Widder. Because their research revealed that many people would often use the heated gloves separately from the rest of the suit, wiring them in series allows the gloves to get hot enough to be useful and comfortable, while at the same time allows them to be left on full time without getting to hot to become uncomfortable and dangerous. I guess in the days before variable controllers became the better option to control the heat level, this eliminated the need to be constantly turning the gloves on and off all the time.

One review that I came across stated that this worked very well, and that the gloves could be left on all the time without ever getting to hot.
This explains why those who have connected them in parallel have stated that they get to hot, and that a controller is needed.

I measured the resistance of the complete suit, as well as each individual item, and then did the math to see what is going on.
I also traced all the interior wires by feeling through the lining to see how they were wired.
Below is what Widder did.

Power enters the vest and connects to an internal junction inside the bottom of the vest.
This junction provides power directly to the resistance heating wires of the vest.

The power is then routed to the sleeve arm chaps.
The vest internal junction also splits power off to the first connector of the left-hand arm chap through an internal wire. From there the power goes through this arm chap's resistance heating wires to the second connector of the left-hand arm chap. It then goes directly to the first connector of the right-hand arm chap through an internal wire. From there it goes through this arm chap's resistance heating wires to the second connector of the right-hand arm chap. It then goes directly back to the power source junction at the bottom of the vest through an internal wire.
The arm chaps/gloves wiring is a series-parallel circuit, allowing the arm chaps to function with or without the gloves attached.

The power is then routed to the heated gloves.
Inside the arm chaps there are internal wires that carry power from the arm chap connectors directly to the resistance heating wires of the gloves. Because they derive their power from the arm chap connectors, the power follows the same path as for the arm chaps.
i.e.
The power flows to the left-hand glove first through the left-hand arm chap, and then to the right-hand glove through the right-hand arm chap, and then back to the power source junction in the vest. Because the arm chaps are wired in series, so to are the gloves when they are connected to the arm chaps, as they become part of the series circuit of the arm chaps.
When the heated gloves are being used separately from the arm chaps, the Widder wiring harness connects them in series with each other.


So there you go, more useless information that you didn't need!
 

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So then the Widder Vest could be used with a W&N controller with no problems. It's just the arm chaps and the gloves that are series. Widder actually had a 'controller' near the end but it did last very long at all before it croaked on me.
 
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Andrew Shadow

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There is no reason why not to. All that the controller does is vary the duty cycle of the heated clothing, it doesn't change the voltage input to it. Since the Widder vest is designed to accept a 12V input, it won't know the difference. The entire suit can be used with the controller. The change to series wiring for the arm chaps and gloves happens internally. Adding a controller before the internal wiring will not affect anything.

The only item that is affected is the gloves, and only if they are being used apart from the rest of the suit, and only if they are connected to parallel wiring.
Jjonahjamison has stated that he has been doing exactly this for a long time, but had to add a controller for the gloves because they get to hot when wired in parallel. He also stated that he has not experienced any detrimental affect to the gloves.
 
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I only have heated socks but this thread has me thinking..lol. if you build a heated suit, vest gloves etc..all in series, nothing would work unless all pieces where plugged in... my question is, do you have to wear all the pieces for the suits to work?
If the system (jacket, gloves, pants, socks, all wired in series) is designed properly,everything will heat up as desired, and not cook you. If you pull one component out - say the jacket - and run it without the other items, it will quickly overheat (draw too much current) and either roast the contents or burn out.
 

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I only have heated socks but this thread has me thinking..lol. if you build a heated suit, vest gloves etc..all in series, nothing would work unless all pieces where plugged in... my question is, do you have to wear all the pieces for the suits to work?
Not the case for Gerbing, WarmNSafe or Gordon's.
I have all the 'pieces' but seldom use the heated pants or heat insoles or socks.
Everything works as it should together or separate.
You can even use the gloves without the jacket liner if you have the separate glove harness.
Widder - That may be another story. ;)
I don't recall Widder ever coming out with heated pants or socks though.
 
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Andrew Shadow

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I don't recall Widder ever coming out with heated pants or socks though.
Widder had heater vests, heated arm chaps, heated gloves, and heated leg chaps.

If the correct wiring harnesses were ordered, any combination of the above could be used with or without any other components.
The only exception was the arm chaps. They could not be used by themselves because of the way that they attached and were powered, unless a person made up their own harness to allow this.
 

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Widder had heater vests, heated arm chaps, heated gloves, and heated leg chaps.

If the correct wiring harnesses were ordered, any combination of the above could be used with or without any other components.
The only exception was the arm chaps. They could not be used by themselves because of the way that they attached and were powered, unless a person made up their own harness to allow this.
Never saw the leg chaps but I had probably move on to other gear by then.
 
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Andrew Shadow

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The heated leg chaps were the same design as the heated arm chaps, only sized and shaped to fit legs.

In theory, the arm and leg chaps made sense. Less bulk inside your riding jacket/pants and therefore less bunching and restriction of movement, and they were also smaller to pack. They also require less power draw because only half of the arm/leg is being heated. Way back then motorcycle alternators were less powerful and heated clothing consumed more power than the modern stuff does, so limiting current draw was a concern back then. Limiting the current draw made heated clothing viable on more motorcycle models, especially smaller sized motorcycles.

In practice, the arm and leg chaps are a pain to put on because they are only half a sleeve/leg held in place with Velcro straps on the opposite side. It would have been a much better design if they had made the non heated and non insulated parts out of thin lightweight fabric. This would have allowed for a complete sleeve and a complete leg that would have been much easier to put on as it could be slid on the same way as any jacket or pants.
 

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The heated leg chaps were the same design as the heated arm chaps, only sized and shaped to fit legs.

In theory, the arm and leg chaps made sense.
Yes, I remember the arm chaps well (I still have my Widder gear stored away somewhere in the archives) - great in theory, poor in practice. ;)
 

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In practice, the arm and leg chaps are a pain to put on because they are only half a sleeve/leg held in place with Velcro straps on the opposite side
I have the "GEARS" model heated chaps, yes they are a pain to put on, Once I've done up the waistband I sit in a chair to fasten the Velcro straps, makes the task much easier. I have the heated insoles that plug into the chaps as well as a wiring harness for the insoles if I don't use the chaps.
I'm extremely happy with my heated gear, extends my season.
 
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Andrew Shadow

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In case anyone else is ever trying to make the same determination regarding whether something is wired in series or parallel, something that I forgot to mention is that it was actually easy to test for this.

While taking the resistance readings of the complete heated suit, unplugging one glove caused the total resistance to change. When I unplugged the second glove, there was no change. Immediately I realized why, and of course this makes perfect sense. Since they are wired in series, unplugging one glove removes both of them from the circuit. This causes a change in the total resistance reading by an amount equivalent to the resistance of both gloves, regardless of whether one or both gloves is unplugged.

If they were wired in parallel, the change in resistance would be equal to the resistance of only the one glove that was unplugged, as the remaining glove remains in the circuit.

The same thing happened when unplugging the heated arm chaps, as they are also wired in series.

Quite simple actually!
 
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Andrew Shadow

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While determining how these heated gloves were wired, I measured the resistance of the complete suit, and of the individual components of it.
I don't understand the resistance readings that I have taken.
Can anyone can explain the below?

Assumption # 1- The heating wire that is used to produce the heat in heated clothing does so by introducing a resistance in to the circuit. This resistance turns the electrical energy in to heat.
Assumption # 2- The greater the total length of heating wire that there is in the circuit, the more resistance there will be, assuming XX amount of resistance per given unit of length.

The total suit, including heated vest, heated arm chaps, and heated gloves, has a total measured resistance of 2.0 Ω.
The vest only has a measured resistance of 3.5 Ω.
Disconnecting items from the suit causes incremental increases in the total resistance.

How is it that disconnecting the heated arm chaps and the heated gloves yields a higher total resistance value, not less?
Disconnecting items from the suit means that the total length of heating wire in the circuit is being reduced. Should this not equate to less total resistance?
 
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How is it that disconnecting the heated arm chaps and the heated gloves yields a higher total resistance value, not less?
Disconnecting items from the suit means that the total length of heating wire in the circuit is being reduced. Should this not equate to less total resistance?
For pairs of items wired in series, such as chaps or gloves, what you're thinking applies. But, beyond that, the pair of chaps and/or the pair of gloves are connected in parallel with any other heated pieces, like vests.

For example, looking at the parallel diagram below, two chaps in series would make up R1, two gloves in series would make up R2, and a jacket would be R3. Parallel resistances combine to lower the total resistance.

Removing any one R from a parallel circuit removes onea parallel pathway, increasing the overall circuit resistance, which reduces the overall circuit current. Removing an R from a series circuit reduces the total resistance.

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