ST1300 heat Air Ram

[docw1]

Igofar went over my bike. I think one of the things that helped to reduce heat the most was cleaning out the PAIR valves. They were really gummed up with a thick goo that took a strong solvent and a lot of brushing to finally get off.

 

[Catmandu2]

Anyone else had this idea?

I do applaud your experiment,,, and realize that testing a concept does not require that it be pretty. My engineering thesis was based on a venturi principle,,, and your setup reminds me of that. But that story is way too long for this forum. Although my two ST13's don't cause me any really big heat issues,,,, I am working on some simpler enhancements that I will share soon. One problem that I see with your "extractor" is that it exhausts whatever it can pull from the engine bay towards the rider. Ideally,,, the airflow should exit the bike below and behind the rider. Heated air coming out of the crash bar covers,,, needs to be deflected or diverted away from the riders lower legs. If you were going to develop this concept further,,, a "swept exit" might be worth evaluating. Keep up the good thought process. This problem is going to be managed with a number of solutions,,, cheers,,,, CAt'

 

[Al Gully]

If I had a dog in this fight to reduce heat, I'd check the carb sync on the carbs first and then invent 2 or 3 -12 volt computer fans to keep the air exchanges under the tank moving rearward and out the side guard bumpers.
Canada is no where near as hot as the southern parts of the world, so I'm not interested in moving this heated air when riding up where I live.
Heated Hondaline grips almost stay on #1 setting year round up here, except when we get over 70 F.
I do know my 2nd ST1300 that I picked up in May 2022 with 42,000 miles runs a lot cooler than the one I bought in 2009.
and now has 118,000 miles on it .
Carb Mercury sync sticks are sitting in the garage, just need time to compare each ST to truly see if one is out of spec and one is bang on.

 

[snowmoer]

When I had my 04, I cut holes in the faring side panels that are next to the radiator. I did not have a heat problems with the bike before I did this. It definitely did not after I did this quick mod. At the time I lived in the So Cal high desert. Rode in 100+ degree temps all the time. The bike was no hotter than any other bike I had.

 

[Catmandu2]

When I had my 04, I cut holes in the faring side panels that are next to the radiator. I did not have a heat problems with the bike before I did this. It definitely did not after I did this quick mod. At the time I lived in the So Cal high desert. Rode in 100+ degree temps all the time. The bike was no hotter than any other bike I had.

Thanks for posting this, c/w photo. I have seen several variations on this approach,, slots,,, lots of slots and drilled holes,,, cutting off the corners and just installing those,,, leaving the entire cowl out. I had mine apart for maintenance,,, and decided to test ride it without re-installing the inners. It worked great,,, and I just left them out,,, but, I can't say that I had a big problem to begin with. Actually,,, I only had the bike a couple of months at that point, and it was in the fall. I will say that as a junior engineer,,, I worked for a summer at a company whose products relied on moving high volumes of chilled air through limited spaces. Slots, holes and other shapes always flowed less than the largest possible passages. But once you get enough flow to achieve a desired result in all conditions,,,, declare success and move on to the next problem. Good job,,, CAt'

 

[Igofar]

You were not doing your bike any favors by destroying your inner cowls
Having many ST's come through the garage with various forms of holes/slots/missing cowls, one thing became very obvious.
While YOU felt that you couldn't feel the heat, you were silently damaging other parts of your bike.
The wire harness and sub wire harness were slowly cooking and getting crispy....
Let me try to explain...
The front wheel and fender blocks most, if not all of the air flow to the engine/radiator etc.
The inner cowls were designed to DIRECT the flow of air that passes beside the wheel/fender INTO the radiator allowing it to do its job keeping the engine at normal operating temperatures.
By removing or cutting the cowls, you allow the air to blow straight back into a dead end (frame/gas tank area) and turn this entire area into a giant heat sink.
The holes/slots then can't direct the flow of air towards the radiator, and the bike runs much hotter.
The problem is, the folks who do this, truly believe the bike runs cooler, since they don't feel the heat, either because they've masked it with header wrap, removed panels, or want to believe they did something good, because they read about it on the internet or youtube video etc.
Almost, if not all, the bikes that have come through the garage with this modification, were found to have damaged wire harnesses and short/ground issues etc.
Another common problem that I've found to damage bikes, is the tin foil under everything.
Lets make an oven in there, and wrap our potato in tin foil and cook things since I can feel the heat now, it must be a good thing, and is working right?

 

[Igofar]

So...No is the answer, thanks for your valuable contributions.

Really?

 

[Igofar]

Heat issues are not solved by a single fix that someone on YouTube said worked for them, or read somewhere.
Heat issues are a symptom, not a cause.
You must find the cause of the heat to correct it, rather than keep throwing solutions at it in hopes that something works.
It can be caused by incorrect valve adjustments, wrong or poor choice of oil, wrong air filter and or exhaust, starter valves being incorrectly adjusted, wrong spark plugs, t-stats stuck open, neglected service work, wrong coolant, removing a panels, drilling holes, failing sensors, or even poor riding posture, or medications taken that make some folks very heat sensitive etc.
There is no one solution.
What I have found that works best is finding the cause and correcting it, whether it be mechanical, physical, or removing or correcting something that someone else caused.
In the last several years, I have only had (2) heat issues that I was unable to correct for the owners.
One was this person who was on some type of thyroid medication that would cause his legs to turn lobster red near ANY heat source.
His doctor changed his meds and his heat issue with his bike went away. The second one was another person’s riding posture/position etc.
He was very short and obese, and had to keep his seat in the lowest position, which clamped his chubby little thighs (his words) tightly against the tank and frame sealing off any air flow etc.
We have witnessed this with three riders on the same day and ride, by switching bikes.
Two of us were fine on any of the bikes, but the chubby guy was miserable on all of them.
Before you start cutting stuff up and damaging things, think about cause and effect of things. move your seat on the upper position and keep your knees off the tank, you may be surprised.
I’ve had great results curing even the hottest running bikes by paying attention to the smallest details, and making sure everything works well together.

 

[Willsmotorcycle]

So...No is the answer, thanks for your valuable contributions.

Really?

C'mon Larry, write the damn article. You can think of it as a greatest hits album. I hear the crowd chanting, Write It, Write It, Write It

 

[Igofar]

C'mon Larry, write the damn article. You can think of it as a greatest hits album. I hear the crowd chanting, Write It, Write It, Write It

That would be like someone going to a doctor and telling him they have a tummy ache and expecting him to know what is causing it without him examining them first
I don't just "fix" heat issues, I go through the entire bike, making sure every single system is in good working order, and all parts are working like they should.
If I were to make a list of things to check for, it would probably look like a service manual, and I would get post after post of folks insisting their bikes were in perfect running condition and they still have heat issues, and the BS flag would be raised, I'd get flamed, the probably deleted because of my comments.
We know how it turns out when I take a bike hostage
Perhaps I'll start a post suggesting some of the things to check for if they have a hot running bike.
But with answering forum members emails each day, and being on the phone trying to assist forum members with service stuff several hours each day, I probably don't have enough time to contribute much to this forum
But I'll try harder.

 

[Catmandu2]

damaged wire harnesses and short/ground issues etc.

Hey Larry,, in post #26,,, in the first photo with the melted sensor. Which sensor is that,,, and do all model years have that 2 piece metal heat shield surrounding it ?? I have not noticed the shielding on my 2004,,, but may find it when digging into my 2012 this winter,,, cheers,,, CAt'

 

[mobieone]

I have noticed some heat but, I adjusted the seat up a notch which seems to help considerably and I have no real comparison as I am sure all motorcycles put off a consider amount heat from an engine between the legs. With that said you may want to look at the following link which shows and seems completely plausible for the ST1300.

 

[SMSW]

Heat management on the ST is a little more involved than measuring header, head, and collector temperatures on a naked bike on a lift. If that's how you ride, then of course, that video is meaningful, but not too many of us strip the fairing, lift the bike in the air, and hop aboard for a stationary ride. The engine will put out the same amount of heat regardless of the muffler or header wrapping. When the bike is moving, the dynamics of the airflow through the fairing will determine what you feel. I'm in Larry's camp. If the bike is properly set up and maintained, heat on the rider will be managable.

 

[Willsmotorcycle]

Last month I rode out to camp. When I got settled we ran out for food. I didn't put the "suit" back on, and inadvertently knocked the maintenance cover loose on the right side. Not wanting to slow down our ride or lose it, I jiggled it off and put it in my lap. The first stop light we hit, the heat was obnoxious coming from the open space.

I usually ride ATGATT and never notice heat because of the layer(s), without it, it was noticeable. I have the OEM wind deflectors and can say it is a big difference. The heat breaks around you instead of up on you. My bike is reasonably tuned (OCD Enterprises 8k? miles ago) and one oil change in there, I am in need of another but that's just me.

Tallish boots, riding pants, and all the factory equipment on the bike seems to work for me and mine. If I did not have the deflectors, I would use an Air Wing or something near the maintenance cover to keep the heat farther away at a stop. Adding food for thought.

 

[dduelin]

Last month I rode out to camp. When I got settled we ran out for food. I didn't put the "suit" back on, and inadvertently knocked the maintenance cover loose on the right side. Not wanting to slow down our ride or lose it, I jiggled it off and put it in my lap. The first stop light we hit, the heat was obnoxious coming from the open space.

I usually ride ATGATT and never notice heat because of the layer(s), without it, it was noticeable. I have the OEM wind deflectors and can say it is a big difference. The heat breaks around you instead of up on you. My bike is reasonably tuned (OCD Enterprises 8k? miles ago) and one oil change in there, I am in need of another but that's just me.

Tallish boots, riding pants, and all the factory equipment on the bike seems to work for me and mine. If I did not have the deflectors, I would use an Air Wing or something near the maintenance cover to keep the heat farther away at a stop. Adding food for thought.

I never really had a problem with ST1300 heat but heat is such a personal thing. Maybe I didn't because I have lived in a hot humid climate all of my life and am acclimated somewhat or because I always rode ATGATT on it. My '05 also had the Honda accessory wind deflectors. I kept it in good tune but turning gasoline into horsepower creates BTUs and Honda didn't do the best job with getting rid of those BTUs. The only time I noticed excessive heat was one time I rode it around the block with just a pair of jeans and running shoes on. I noticed a lot of heat pouring across my feet and lower legs! Protective pants and at least calf high boots go a long way to mitigate the heat that comes off a liquid cooled 1.3 liter engine sitting right ahead and below the rider. Overall many touring and sport touring bikes are uncomfortably hot to some of their owners. Some Harley big twins, early Concours 14, the early FJRs, the Triumph Trophy, etc., all create comments in respective forums.

 

[maddog13]

That would be like someone going to a doctor and telling him they have a tummy ache and expecting him to know what is causing it without him examining them first
I don't just "fix" heat issues, I go through the entire bike, making sure every single system is in good working order, and all parts are working like they should.
If I were to make a list of things to check for, it would probably look like a service manual, and I would get post after post of folks insisting their bikes were in perfect running condition and they still have heat issues, and the BS flag would be raised, I'd get flamed, the probably deleted because of my comments.
We know how it turns out when I take a bike hostage
Perhaps I'll start a post suggesting some of the things to check for if they have a hot running bike.
But with answering forum members emails each day, and being on the phone trying to assist forum members with service stuff several hours each day, I probably don't have enough time to contribute much to this forum
But I'll try harder.

I think you contribute a great deal to this forum. And I'm thankful for it. My bike's heat is only unmanageable on a very hot day. 95 degrees F or more. I'm going to change the thermostat this winter because I think the one in there is stuck open I am also suspicious that the radiator fins themselves are plugged full of bugs and dirt from riding in the rain so I'm going to give that a good cleaning as well.

 

[CDNolddude]

That would be like someone going to a doctor and telling him they have a tummy ache and expecting him to know what is causing it without him examining them first
I don't just "fix" heat issues, I go through the entire bike, making sure every single system is in good working order, and all parts are working like they should.
If I were to make a list of things to check for, it would probably look like a service manual, and I would get post after post of folks insisting their bikes were in perfect running condition and they still have heat issues, and the BS flag would be raised, I'd get flamed, the probably deleted because of my comments.
We know how it turns out when I take a bike hostage
Perhaps I'll start a post suggesting some of the things to check for if they have a hot running bike.
But with answering forum members emails each day, and being on the phone trying to assist forum members with service stuff several hours each day, I probably don't have enough time to contribute much to this forum
But I'll try harder.

Maybe just dictate/record all your work. (Just as if you are on the phone). Then someone could write it up. (The pita part of it). Just a thought.

 

[Catmandu2]

Tallish boots, riding pants, and all the factory equipment on the bike seems to work for me and mine. If I did not have the deflectors, I would use an Air Wing or something near the maintenance cover to keep the heat farther away at a stop. Adding food for thought.

I ride similarly equipped,,, note the boots and shin pads in the photo. That boot/pad combo not only protects in a crash,,, but also shields from high low temp's as well. Speaking of the small maintenance covers,,, I also recently did a days ride in cool-ish 10c conditions,,,, and out of curiosity took both covers off to test the effect. It was fantastic,,, cushy warmth all day. Sure sometimes the heat poured out against my knees,,, but they are protect from both heat and cold,,, as I said. The boots are pricey,,, but the pads are cheap,,, about $20 on sale,, and both are totally convenient. The pads work much better than pant mounted knee armor,,, as they stay perfectly in place. And, I have crash tested them,,, by sliding across asphalt without damage to myself. So I don't ride without the boot/pad combo anymore,,, in all temp's. CAt'

 

[Willsmotorcycle]

I ride similarly equipped,,, note the boots and shin pads in the photo. That boot/pad combo not only protects in a crash,,, but also shields from high low temp's as well. Speaking of the small maintenance covers,,, I also recently did a days ride in cool-ish 10c conditions,,,, and out of curiosity took both covers off to test the effect. It was fantastic,,, cushy warmth all day. Sure sometimes the heat poured out against my knees,,, but they are protect from both heat and cold,,, as I said. The boots are pricey,,, but the pads are cheap,,, about $20 on sale,, and both are totally convenient. The pads work much better than pant mounted knee armor,,, as they stay perfectly in place. And, I have crash tested them,,, by sliding across asphalt without damage to myself. So I don't ride without the boot/pad combo anymore,,, in all temp's. CAt'

You"re looking a little peckish.

 

[randii]

It has been remove. I was just wondering if it would make any difference. If it had worked I was going to come up with something that looked OK over the winter.

I like that you tried. Experimentation has the potential to drive us forward. Accepting the status quo -- even a nice status quo like the ST1300 -- stands us still.