The New Touring Era Motto Guzzi
- Thread starter Upt' North
- Start date
bdalameda
PaleoCyclist
I posted this back in September:
Guzzi's beauty is in the eye of the beholder. They are a quirky bike - you either love 'em or hate 'em. At one time they were the touring bike many* of us aspired to, and at least the older models were both very reliable and easy to repair - even on the side of the road.
*Maybe I should have said, "some of us aspired to".
V100 Mandela;not to be confused with Larry Mondello, on Leave it to beaver.
Uncle Phil
Site Supporter
An interesting story about riding 'perspective' -
Many years ago I had two Brit friends come over to ride with me (their first stateside trip). One of the first questions was -
"Can we ride to California from here (Nashville, TN)?"
My answer -
"Yes we can but it will be three 800 mile days out, dip your toes in the Pacific, then three 800 mile days back, and you won't be happy at the end of it".
I told them I could keep them plenty busy just in the Southeast and I did.
After we finished the rides, they were walking a little 'bowlegged' but they better understood why we talk about wanting highway pegs, custom seats and cruise controls.
It's not that one way is 'better' than the other, it's just different parameters in the different environments.
Many years ago I had two Brit friends come over to ride with me (their first stateside trip). One of the first questions was -
"Can we ride to California from here (Nashville, TN)?"
My answer -
"Yes we can but it will be three 800 mile days out, dip your toes in the Pacific, then three 800 mile days back, and you won't be happy at the end of it".
I told them I could keep them plenty busy just in the Southeast and I did.
After we finished the rides, they were walking a little 'bowlegged' but they better understood why we talk about wanting highway pegs, custom seats and cruise controls.
It's not that one way is 'better' than the other, it's just different parameters in the different environments.
the Ferret
Daily rider since May 1965
I understand and I actually worked at a Yamaha/Moto Guzzi dealer for a couple of years. We have had several Guzzis and one BMW in the family. One nephew still has a V7 III. I have ridden an 850 Eldorado, a 750 Breva, a Griso and the V7, but they are just too quirky for me. I understand some people love them, and honestly I love looking at them. I just dont enjoy riding them. My younger brother bought a new 850 Eldorado in 1973 and he rode that bike all over the country and loved it, but I preferred my TX 650.
If you want luggage, I'm sure Givi will bring some out. Go with Givi stuff. Guzzi usually goes with Hepco & Becker. I've got 6 of the H & B pieces. 4 of them leak, 1 doesn't seem to even start to keep stuff dry and 1 seals water tight. I mentioned it one time years ago. You would think I accused the Pope of being Christian. Those guys were on me like bums on a ham sandwich. Just saying what my experience has been.
Once sorted, Guzzi bikes are pretty solid. I just can't accept greasing bearings, adding relays, rewiring lamps, etc on a brand new from the factory bike. I don't own bikes to work on them, I buy them to ride them. That's why I've stayed with the ST.
Once sorted, Guzzi bikes are pretty solid. I just can't accept greasing bearings, adding relays, rewiring lamps, etc on a brand new from the factory bike. I don't own bikes to work on them, I buy them to ride them. That's why I've stayed with the ST.
OP
OP
I first posted this on the NT thread because I knew it had already been posted months back elsewhere.
Just noticed whomever moved it can't spell Moto Guzzi, is there a motto to this story.
As an aside, UP has correctly made the point that our quaint little Europe is nice and compact. I don't completely disagree but don't think you can "do Europe" in a day or two, you won't. Our two most recent European jaunts were both over 4000 miles and we never touched the same roads twice. Not forgetting that many of those roads are far twister and hence a little slower than my experience of US roads, NE, SE, W etc.
Now who can't spell Motto Guzzi?
Upt'North.
Just noticed whomever moved it can't spell Moto Guzzi, is there a motto to this story.
As an aside, UP has correctly made the point that our quaint little Europe is nice and compact. I don't completely disagree but don't think you can "do Europe" in a day or two, you won't. Our two most recent European jaunts were both over 4000 miles and we never touched the same roads twice. Not forgetting that many of those roads are far twister and hence a little slower than my experience of US roads, NE, SE, W etc.
Now who can't spell Motto Guzzi?
Upt'North.
OP
OP
If this in in reference to the classification of motorcycles, which ultimately only really matters to the manufacturers and marketing kids, then yes any bike can be ridden to some extent in a sporty manner. But that does not make a GW a sports tourer, or even a sports Behemoth. So by riding that Honda Grom, for instance, in a sporty manner doesn't change the bikes manufacturers description. Didn't Honda describe their last GW as the perfect bike to light tour at weekends, I can't imagine many took much notice.I've sport-toured on a couple Wings in the past.and Adv bikes..
and now on an RT
Buy em, ride em, who cares what the manufacturers call em, but of course when posting onto said forum it is obvious the descriptive narrative will be used. It's also obvious that in different global markets items will be marketed in different ways.
Didn't someone once tour the world on a R1, didn't make it a touring bike.
Upt'North.
That's what I said, just not as eloquently.
Uncle Phil
Site Supporter
No, there is no way to 'do Europe' in a day or two - you could whiz across it but not see it.
Over here, there is often many miles to go to 'see' something specific and if you work at a regular job, your time will be limited.
As I gave in my example, if I want to ride the California area (like the PCH) from where I live, it's three 800 mile days out and three 800 mile days back.
Or if I want to ride the ALCAN (Alaskan Canadian Highway) it's about the same distance.
It's not there isn't plenty to 'see' in between, but the 'idea' would be like someone from the UK going to ride part of the Austrian/German/Italian Alps region - they probably would not stop at Normandy or make a run by Paris.
Just curious for comparison - how many days did you take to 'do' the 4,000 + miles?
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OP
OP
About 10 riding days UP, that would be for each with a break in the middle. Usually an apartment for a few days. Both trips would have included mountain sections, one would have included the Pyrenees and Picos, the other the Alps and Dolomites. And those passes don't half eat into your average speeds, but you know that already.
Upt'North.
catcher
Site Supporter
- Joined
- Oct 13, 2005
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- Location
- Woodstock, New Brunswick, Canada.
- Bike
- '18Wing, '16VFR1200X
I had the pleasure of owning a M-G "Stone" a number of years ago. Although I enjoyed it, the experience of having one bike only grew a bit monotonous. Since that time - early 2000's - the care and feeding of at least two in the stable has enriched my satisfaction considerably. Kind of like having only one child; life with several does tend to create more memories!
So Uncle Phil, have you ever considered having just one ST11, and one each of perhaps Ducati, Moto-Guzzi, Yamaha, and even Hardley Ableson? Having one wife and being loyal to her is of course exemplary, but a toy box benefits from variety!
So Uncle Phil, have you ever considered having just one ST11, and one each of perhaps Ducati, Moto-Guzzi, Yamaha, and even Hardley Ableson? Having one wife and being loyal to her is of course exemplary, but a toy box benefits from variety!
Moto-Charlie
Vendor
I've owned 2 older Guzzis, both of which I very much enjoyed and wish I still had. One was a 1976 850 LeMans and the other a 1981 CX100, which looked like the LeMans II with an upper sport fairing and lower fairing. The CX100 came with a neutered 1,000cc motor for the American market. I took it down to the late Manfred Hecht in NY, the tuner for Dr John, so Manfred could give it the full performance upgrade he offered. When it came back it looked like the classic Guzzi but it was a completely different bike performance wise, another 15 horsepower, better suspension and a sound to die for with the Conti muffers. The shaft drive and fairing made it pretty comfortable (Guzzi was one of the first manufacturers to have their own wind tunnel) and Manfred's work made it very reliable. I kept it for 16 years as my daily driver before selling to buy a 1993 Ducati 900SS. I regretted selling it almost immediately and still do to this day.
As many have mentioned what is a touring bikes vs a sport touring bike, etc is all relative. I agree with Paulcb in post #19
So for me comfort is not just an issue of miles, but hours too and the ability to handle the roads that you are riding. That is why bikes like the Moto Guzzi V1000 Mandello or the just released Honda NT1100 are definitely touring bikes, suitable for multiple touring missions.
Many of us would agree that a ST1300 is a sport touring bike if ridden that way. I recently added a 2018 Goldwing to my garage and can pretty much ride it at the same pace as my ST1300. That is because many of the roads here, even the twisty ones, lend themselves to bigger bikes if ridden well. On the other hand I consider my 730lb ST1300 to be like a 2018 Goldwing in the tighter twisty roads of the Alps, where a lighter more nimble bike like the F900XR or even the new V1000 or NT1100 makes more sense, especially with decent weather protection and luggage. You can certainly tour on a ST1300 in the Alps, but it is easier to "sport" tour on one of the lighter alternatives.
As many have mentioned what is a touring bikes vs a sport touring bike, etc is all relative. I agree with Paulcb in post #19
I think that manufacturers categorize their bikes in order to set expectations. Buyers and the public will take it from there. My first big tour as a young man was on a Honda 350 with no windshield and a duffel bag lashed to the back seat. I spent 3 months riding 20,000 miles across Canada, the west coast, Mexico and back - a lot of that on highways. A Honda 350 would never be mistaken for a touring bike, sport or otherwise.
In the end I think it comes down to what UP said - but - I would also add that the amount of saddle times figures into the defintion/requirement of a touring bike too. Here in America we have lots of open roads and sweeping roads that allow for 800 mile days, which frequently equates to 10 or 12 hour in the saddle each day, where comfort is appreciated. Riding in the Alps on tight twisty narrow roads can also result in 10 - 12 hour days - I do it all the time - but we might only cover 200 miles. I recently spent 9 riding days just in Southern Switzerland, let alone the rest of Europe.
So for me comfort is not just an issue of miles, but hours too and the ability to handle the roads that you are riding. That is why bikes like the Moto Guzzi V1000 Mandello or the just released Honda NT1100 are definitely touring bikes, suitable for multiple touring missions.
Many of us would agree that a ST1300 is a sport touring bike if ridden that way. I recently added a 2018 Goldwing to my garage and can pretty much ride it at the same pace as my ST1300. That is because many of the roads here, even the twisty ones, lend themselves to bigger bikes if ridden well. On the other hand I consider my 730lb ST1300 to be like a 2018 Goldwing in the tighter twisty roads of the Alps, where a lighter more nimble bike like the F900XR or even the new V1000 or NT1100 makes more sense, especially with decent weather protection and luggage. You can certainly tour on a ST1300 in the Alps, but it is easier to "sport" tour on one of the lighter alternatives.
Uncle Phil
Site Supporter
Yes I have and that's why I have 4 rideable ST1100s and 2 parts ST1100s.
I could probably buy any motorcycle out there but I am very happy with what I have.
I wish folks would stop with all the marketing BS, they are motorcycles, get one, ride on, and enjoy them.
Touring, Naked, Standard, Sport, Sport touring, Cruiser, Dual sport, Adventure, Race replica....etc.
It used to be if you had a Triumph Bonneville you could change the tires and race in the desert, flat track on it, ride trials on them, and I seem to recall a couple folks ride them around the world and write books about them.
The old Honda Black Bombers were the sportiest of their time, yet you could load them up and go anywhere on them.
Touring, Naked, Standard, Sport, Sport touring, Cruiser, Dual sport, Adventure, Race replica....etc.
It used to be if you had a Triumph Bonneville you could change the tires and race in the desert, flat track on it, ride trials on them, and I seem to recall a couple folks ride them around the world and write books about them.
The old Honda Black Bombers were the sportiest of their time, yet you could load them up and go anywhere on them.
OP
OP
Whilst we're chin wagging about MG's, this special edition 85 is a 2022 release. It honours the Cuirassiers Regiment. The Italian Presidents own guard.
Just seems to be paint and a few extra bolt on bits. Nice though.
Upt'North.
Just seems to be paint and a few extra bolt on bits. Nice though.
Upt'North.
I feel like I have the best of both of those worlds. My BMW F800GT weighs about 470 lbs wet; it's probably a bit more with side cases and definitely more with the stuff I carry in them. Yet I can move it easily, no matter where I park. Twisties are fun. I shredded the tires on the Maryhill Loops road in a moment that Alan Greenspan would call "irrational exhuberance".
And yet it has served me well over 80,000 miles of touring. It carries 37 liters in each side case and 46 liters in the top case, plus the pillion seat. When I did an extended test ride on a RT1200, I liked its windshield...but didn't feel it did anything better than the aftermarket Madstad windshield on my F800GT. The belt drive is great. Simple. Light weight. The first belt lasted 53,000 miles. It has a centerstand, and the bike's light enough to easily get it up. And I don't need 5 gallons of fuel because it gets 55-70 mpg which gives me 220-280 miles for range.
I had a NT700V for a few years. It weighed 570 lbs...a hundred more. It was going to be my touring bike till I moved up to a better touring bike like an ST or FJR. Instead I found my "old man's bike".
Chris
With a guzzi
You need to ride a guzzi and get a relationship going with her. You'll find you can't live without her anymore! We, my LM2 and me have tried a separation but we're back together now. . We've been together 40years except for the couple of years apart and we've got about 160,000miles on the clock, all over the Alps, elephant rallys, Stella alpina, pyrenees, Europe East and west Inc East Germany and colditz. Ukraine, Moscow, Finland, Norway, North Cape (Arctic). My wife, me and camping luggage rode from Austria up to Holland in one very hot day and I've ridden every day for three weeks and in all this she only broke down once when the output shaft from the gearbox broke, and that was about two miles from home! I've got an ST1100 and a fx650 as well but, although they're good, they don't have the character of my guzzi. We will be together forever now, and then my daughter, Diana, is going to take over. (I hope they get on!).. Swede.