When does the rear shock go?

dduelin

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When does the OEM rear shock need replacing? At 40,000 miles I notice more bump steer in corners than ever before and I haven't changed the rebound damping setting it has been on (3/4 turn from full hard) and use various settings from medium to just short of maximum preload.
 

Marshal_Mercer

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When does the OEM rear shock need replacing? At 40,000 miles I notice more bump steer in corners than ever before and I haven't changed the rebound damping setting it has been on (3/4 turn from full hard) and use various settings from medium to just short of maximum preload.
dduelin:

It's time. About 20K miles should pretty well do in a stock shock. You might want to consider buying an after-market replacement.

Marshal
 

Marshal_Mercer

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OK, I'll bite. I've got 40,000, now what are some of the suggested shocks?

John
John:

Here's three: Penske, HyperPro, Wilbers. Do a SEARCH on any of these brands and you should find plenty of solid info.

Penske (my choice) can be found here: https://www.st-owners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27682. HyperPro is here: https://www.st-owners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21275&highlight=HyperPro. Wilbers is discussed here: https://www.st-owners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28635&highlight=wilbers.

Marshal
 
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hmm,
That is the one part I have not given much consideration to wear when I do my biweekly front-end pull.... I am sure I am wearing that bad boy lol....

And yes, I have it scheduled haha.. If I allow myself to pull the front end down my road from my house on tues and thurs it seems to keep the impulse of doing something crazy way down.
Same way on my TA, if I don't allow some play time, the car just umm take it.... yea, thats it.. haha
 
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Give Dave a call, he is the US distributer for Hagon shocks in the UK
They have ST specific design and tested units, not a cobled together shock made to work on our bikes by someone that has never even seen an ST.

He can do a base shock with just dampening and rebound adjustments, add remote preload, and has available a 30mm shorter model for those that need it, for about 60% the price of domestic manufacturers.

Takes about two weeks from the time you give him your specs, they are rebuildable and carry a two year warranty.

http://www.davequinnmotorcycles.com/cgi-bin/webc.cgi/Hagon.html

Spencer
 

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alan

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Are the aftermarket shocks stiffer/harsher? I made the mistake once on my other bike with installing Betor shocks which were supposed to improve handling. Well those Betor's turned the rear of the bike into a pogo stick anytime I hit a bump in the road. I then switched to Progressive with a purely stock replacement and those have worked very nicely, no more bad bounces over bumps.

I have thought about replacing the rear shock on my 03 which has 65,000 miles on it. It still seems to be working fine, but as a winter maintenance project I am thinking of replacing it. I have no desire to ruin the nice ride I presently get with the stock suspension, so I hesitate to go the aftermarket route because of my previous experience on my old CB750.
 

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What's involved in replacing the rear shock?
Bones,

Not much.
You have to release the tension on the existing shock. The swap on ST1100 entailed putting it on the centerstand and putting a board under the rear tire. On the ST1300 you'll have to remove a couple of plastic pieces to get access.

Then shock is connected at top and bottom and those must be disconnected; it pops right off then.
Installation of the new shock is just as simple; but, you have to tune the sag which takes a couple of adjustments. Those adjustments may or may not entail the removal of the shock depending on the shocks design.

Mark
 

Raven

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Well those Betor's turned the rear of the bike into a pogo stick anytime I hit a bump in the road.
Sounds like not enough rebound damping.

I've heard that Race Tech is also working on a rear for the ST as well.

BTW, I remember a thread from last year where someone got their shock replaced under warranty (may have been lost in the great crash of '07).
 
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wjbertrand

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I think Honda tends to build in too much compression damping. My experience with aftermarket shocks (or re-valved OEM ones) is that the ride was less harsh than the factory set up.

Replacing the shock on the ST11 is cake, but it looks a little more involved on the 1300. It's mounted way up forward compared to the 1100's location. At the least, I think the rear wheel will have to come off.
 
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nm6r

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It's time. About 20K miles should pretty well do in a stock shock. You might want to consider buying an after-market replacement.

I have over 74k miles on the stock shock with no noticeable ill effects. Maybe I just don't ride hard enough.



Only 40k miles? Why not get it replaced under warranty? That would give you a backup if you wanted to go with an aftermarket shock.

Ray
 

Marshal_Mercer

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I have over 74k miles on the stock shock with no noticeable ill effects. Maybe I just don't ride hard enough.



Only 40k miles? Why not get it replaced under warranty? That would give you a backup if you wanted to go with an aftermarket shock.

Ray
Ray:

Glad that your shock is still working well at such high mileage. Most car shocks I've used would have failed long before 74K miles.

My stock shock was toast after 17K miles. Perhaps mine was weak to begin with, or that I weigh much more than do you; I'm a porky 230 pounds. I don't know how fast you ride, or where, but I suspect that you and I ride similarly.

When I replaced my stock shock at about 20K miles, the sides of the shock were scuffed by the spring coils, near where the rod enters the shock body, there was no oil in the pre-load line, but there was also no oil seen on the shock, as one would expect to see if it was leaking. Changes to the damping circuit no longer had any effect on the rebound stroke. Pre-load adjustments made no difference to ride height.

On very smooth roads my bike handled well. Adding bumps to the road unsettled the rear end. Not greatly so, but much more than I like.

After installing the after-market shock, my same-corner, cornering speeds rose by 5-10 MPH over the best speeds I could muster since the bike was new, with far less effort and far less lean angle while doing it.

Bumps and potholes almost disappear, and handling is much improved relative to other STs I've tried. Mountain and canyon roads, freeway cruising, and fast sweepers all feel safer and more comfortable to me than before. My Penske shock just works.

I go by Sacramento on my way to Washington State about twice a year. If you'd like, I could stop by your place and you could try out my bike's suspension. PM me if you'd like to try this.

Marshal
 
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Marshal_Mercer

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really, if you have to replace a shock at 20k, something can't be right. And if so, I'd expect it under warranty.
I have the same problem with tires. They all seem to fail, WAY before they reach 20K miles. Don't know what is wrong with them. Oil, brake fluid, and gasoline, too. Is nothing made with magical goodness anymore?

Except for the brake pads. They are still going strong: I have over 60% of the pads left. :rolleyes:

Marshal
 

ST13Fred

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I always assumed if a shock is not leaking and has compression/rebound functions working it is still good. Along with this, if tires are wearing normally, the shocks would be functioning normally.

On my Accord, I 'bounce' on any corner of the body, the car will rise and stop, without pogoing. To me the shock is good; same with the ST.

Where am I going wrong here?

:04biker:
 

Marshal_Mercer

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I always assumed if a shock is not leaking and has compression/rebound functions working it is still good. Along with this, if tires are wearing normally, the shocks would be functioning normally.

On my Accord, I 'bounce' on any corner of the body, the car will rise and stop, without pogoing. To me the shock is good; same with the ST.

Where am I going wrong here?

:04biker:
Hey, Fred:

Fun topic, huh?

For clarification purposes: the tires are an important part of the suspension system, as are any other compressive, tensive, or elastic parts, and their positions relative to their paths of travel. "Reading" the tires' wear is a really good indicator of what is going on elsewhere. It may take more time to wear-in the tires than to check for other parts which are worn out, though. But back to your question.

I'm not sure that you are doing anything wrong. Bouncing the car is a fine way to estimate one segment of the shock's rebound damping ability. It does not check much of the compression stroke, though. It is the compression stroke damping that most of us look for in shock performance. There's much more to it than that, of course.

If one pushes down on the corner, as you described, the shock's spring pushes back with an equal effort (balanced forces). When you release the car's corner, the spring's upward force against the car body's downward force becomes unbalanced and pushes back against the car's mass. This continues until the spring's force and car's resistance to movement, as effected by gravity, balance. At that point both the shock's spring/rod and the car body stop moving. Unless one can provide the force required to pass the spring and damper through their entire compression stroke and rebound stroke, I doubt that there is much one could learn from this exercise. Kind of like kicking the tires; it no longer tells us as much as it used to.

Looking for oil weeps around a failed shock's body, and not finding any, is not that uncommon. I don't know where the oil goes. Sometimes it just isn't "there".

Riding along the roadway, intentionally riding over rough areas, can easily compress or extend the shock's spring and damper, sometimes to the point where all of the shock's travel is used. I'm just not sure that this is a safe way to check for suspension wear, but it is a way. Using a shock dynamometer is a safer way, but few of us have access to one. I like to ride along a familiar course, noting how irregularities "feel". I know what I like -- as does everyone else. My job is to make changes to my bike's suspension until I get "that" feel. Like the old saw about what is "art": I know it when I see it.

To paraphrase a wiser person than I, it ain't that hard; it ain't that easy. It surely is fun though!

Have a terrific Holiday season,

Marshal
 
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crazykz

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Mine went during the rally at about 125000+ miles.

Replaced under warranty. Sorry I didn't see this post. I've been busy with new farkles.

Curt
 
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dduelin

dduelin

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I decided before replacing the OEM unit I would at least try to document loss of function and then talk to the dealer about warranty replacement.

Near my house is a 1 mile section of very bad road. It is a temporary road built as a detour and is a combination of sharp-edged bumps, less abrupt bumps, rises, dips, potholes, etc. I ran at a steady 40 mph over it with the preload fully soft, at the standard setting, and at high. Each run was back and forth. At each of the three preload settings I ran it with the rebound damping set to 3 turns back from hard, then 2 turns back, then 1 turn, then fully hard before moving to the next preload position. Then I adjusted the damping 1/4 turn back and forth from 1 turn from hard.

I found that the original Showa still works well at 40,000 miles. Preload and damping adjustments still independently affect operation and adjust the shock to settings above and below what I determined is best for me. While an aftermarket unit would likely be a better unit the OEM unit is still working well. I still want to replace it with a better aftermarket shock in the near future but for now I am satisfied the dealer isn't going to roll over for a new OEM one and the old one isn't unsafe to ride on.

FWIW, I feel was riding with the preload too high and the shock may have been topping out on rebound. As an adjunct to this I measured rear sag at each of the marks on the preload adjuster. The correct sag for my weight is about 15 clicks above STD and I was running hard or even above or about half the recommended sag.
 
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