R1250 RT or new Goldwing?

[Sadlsor]

Could you talk a bit more about the transition from ST to GW? With the ST, the sensation the bike is going to tip over. Does the GW feel similar? Also does the seating position feel similar or more flat butt like a cruiser?

I find this to be very odd... tipping over?
Not being a jerk; I would like to really see what is meant here.
Like most of us, I have ridden dozens of bikes, owned my small share, and I find the ST1300 to be amazingly stable -- even now that I am more comfortable with low-speed maneuvers. (I was initially trepidatious about the weight, but time in the saddle and working on my technique has put that behind me. I can do gymkhana on it now.)

 

[caldercay]

Could you talk a bit more about the transition from ST to GW? With the ST, the sensation the bike is going to tip over. Does the GW feel similar?

find this to be very odd... tipping over?

It's the difference in the center of gravity - ST is higher, so unfamiliar riders may get the sensation that it's top heavy

 

[sky.high]

Interesting, what is the 'center of gravity' of these bikes, does anyone know or are we just making assumptions ?

 

[caldercay]

Interesting, what is the 'center of gravity' of these bikes, does anyone know or are we just making assumptions ?

I have an "old school" (2007) Gold Wing and [2] STs ... I do not know the "technical" COG of the two bikes, but I can guarantee you the GW has a lower COG than the ST. I suspect the newer GW is similar.

Simply sitting on both bikes in turn, and moving (shaking) them left and right, you can tell the difference.
The ST feels like it wants to instantly fall over, the GW is stable/manageable.

 

[red one]

Could you talk a bit more about the transition from ST to GW? With the ST, the sensation the bike is going to tip over. Does the GW feel similar? Also does the seating position feel similar or more flat butt like a cruiser?

The seating position is definitely different on my Goldwing test ride the seat had a clamshell type position that was close to your butt. And the bars are too close for me. It felt more like a cruiser position. On my ST1100 I have a more athletic forward lean and my butt has plenty of room to move around. As far as center of gravity I would say the Goldwing would have the edge as mine is a little top heavy especially with a full tank. As far as performance goes who cares. For me I just want to cruise down the road at a senior citizens pace of 75 to 85 mph and call it good.

 

[STJohnS]

The seating position is definitely different on my Goldwing test ride the seat had a clamshell type position that was close to your butt. And the bars are too close for me. It felt more like a cruiser position. On my ST1100 I have a more athletic forward lean and my butt has plenty of room to move around. As far as center of gravity I would say the Goldwing would have the edge as mine is a little top heavy especially with a full tank. As far as performance goes who cares. For me I just want to cruise down the road at a senior citizens pace of 75 to 85 mph and call it good.

Thanks for the details, interesting to see.

 

[TourNut]

I have both the '07 ST1300 & a '91 1500 GoldWing to constantly compare . GoldWing weighs more but the 6.1 gal gas tank is entirely below the seat a few inches , The 5 + gallons of the ST's top tank makes it a little top heavy but the ST is lighter anyway ( ~125 less wet wt. ) so to somebody my ht. 6'3" & wt. , they pretty much feel the same , but the ST is more nimble in handling , being almost 20 years newer design than the 1500 GW, in the mid '80s.

New Goldwings are lighter but with less luggage capacity than the old 1500 .

Would like to try the new DCT GoldWing but I'm afraid I'd like it !

 

[ST-venture]

What’s a DTC doing in this conversation? A trouble code?

Corrected. My typing fingers are dyslexic sometimes.

 

[carpdm]

Looking for new bike. Narrowed down to two. New R1250 RT or new Goldwing? Thoughts.

Circumstances have created the opportunity for me to currently own a 2017 R1200RT and a 2018 Goldwing Tour DCT.

My experience, the RT has been a very nice bike; equipped with all the latest technology and much lighter than the ST. The Goldwing, for me, is quite frankly the smoothest riding bike I’ve ever owned. My plan is to keep the Goldwing and sell the RT.

 

[Larry Fine]

The sensation of "tipping over" when cornering can be adjusted in and out by adjusting the rear suspension height.

If you raise the rear, the bike leans into corners more easily, and vice versa, because it alters the fork angle.

You can make it feel like you're about to fall over, or make it feel like you just can't make it lean over far enough.

The ideal is so leaning it over and coming back up with steering pressure feels equally responsive both ways.

 

[hollywood91]

Hi NTausch, I'm not sure how far you are from a BMW dealer, but its a safe bet that there is a Honda dealer not too far away. I have a '68 R60/2-US and had it in my head to get an 1200RT back 2006. My brother who is an avid motorcyclist and moto mechanic talked me out of it because of the high maintenance costs, the frequent problems that have crept into BMW's motorcycles of late, and that we no longer had a local BMW dealer. That meant having to travel 70 miles every time I needed service. Not so much of a problem if the bike is running, but if it's not running having to trailer it. I ended up with a new (leftover) 2005 ST1300 for about half the price. I haven't been sorry. Ride and stay safe. Ed

 

[NTausch]

All very interesting. Yes I know test ride. Kind of hard with that weird white stuff outside. Let’s throw another variable into this thread. Instead of the RT. What about the K1600 GTL or K1600 B Gran American? And local dealer coming. Perfect location. Midpoint on my way home from work.

 

[beemerphile]

No one ever said "you meet the nicest people on a BMW" - although I'm sure you certainly can!

I have met some lifelong friends on BMW's and a few on Hondas. I think it boils down to an empty marketing statement. It started in the late 60's when
Honda was trying to change the image of motorcycling. In some ways they still are. However, nice people and dolts come in all flavors. The "I had trouble so you shouldn't buy one" argument is specious. I have enjoyed my various Hondas, Yamahas, Kawasakis, Suzukis, and Triumphs, but I still wouldn't trade my time on BMW's for anything. <non-PC warning> It parallels my experience with women, the ones that are more fun are usually a bit more trouble and expense. Everyone has a different value equation for relating fun and trouble. Some are willing to have no fun in exchange for no trouble; some the opposite; and most somewhere in-between. As PopEye says, "Ya pays ya nickel, and ya takes ya choice."

EDITED TO ADD: In the off chance that Mrs. beemerphile reads this, I'll borrow a phrase from John Lewis and say that I consider her to be "good trouble".

 

[Sadlsor]

It parallels my experience with women, the ones that are more fun are usually a bit more trouble and expense. Everyone has a different value equation for relating fun and trouble.

Truth and wisdom for the ages, right there.
Pay attention, boys and girls.

 

[Gug]

Could you talk a bit more about the transition from ST to GW? With the ST, the sensation the bike is going to tip over. Does the GW feel similar? Also does the seating position feel similar or more flat butt like a cruiser?

The transition couldn't be more natural, almost as if the ST1300 was made to groom you for the 18'+ Goldwing. The ST1300 is a great bike, but the GW is it on steroids but very refined. The Goldwing is not hot to ride at all, even in short pants on a 90F+ day, the ST was always warm or hot, but it had the full fairing which not only provided wind/cold protection also created much heat. I live in Michigan so I installed both the upper and lower deflectors which gave me coverage of the aforementioned. Quite simply the flat six boxer motor does not get real hot and it has the added benefit of a much lower center of gravity, which the ST1300 does not and that contributes to the heat being the motor is so tall, it's a V4 and an awesome motor I must say. The flat six boxer combined with the dual wishbone fork and the electronic suspension on the GW are incredible. It is the smoothest bike ever made and I have ridden all of them before I bought. It handles incredibly well (I had an MV Agusta so I know handling pretty good), it is a 800lb. Sport Touring motorcycle and it is quick, not as fast as the ST but I have a video on my computer that shows at GW doing 11.95 1/4 mile, the ST does 11.47 which is quicker but the GW has gobs of torque (see graph, no curve, a right angle), so much that if you turn off the Torque Control, well it gets it. Go to 16:25 into the video. See Video Here! I have my bike setup where I am 90 degrees while sitting, I like it there. Some have put heli risers on and they like it. The GW is right about the same height as the ST and I put heli risers on the ST but did not need them on the GW, the position was perfect for me. If you have the means and you are looking for a new touring bike, I encourage you to take a test ride. Any questions feel free to ask.

 

[beemerphile]

The sensation of "tipping over" when cornering can be adjusted in and out by adjusting the rear suspension height.

This is also greatly influenced by the profile of the tires (especially the front). Rounder/flatter profiles fall in less, and at the extreme seem buoyant, springing upright when the steering force is released. Tires with "pointy" profiles lay over as JFK would say "with vigor" and will fall further unless resisted. The best are neutral like an airplane in good trim - you apply a force to set the lean angle and it stays there until you apply a countering force to end the turn. Other factors can include under-inflation which makes the bike want to stand up, and a tire too wide for the wheel which makes it want to fall in by distorting the profile making it more "pointy".

 

[OkieRider]

...The best are neutral like an airplane in good trim - you apply a force to set the lean angle and it stays there until you apply a countering force to end the turn.

"Best" depends on you and your purpose. I like triangular profile tires. They're quite neutral on edge.

 

[beemerphile]

"Best" depends on you and your purpose. I like triangular profile tires. They're quite neutral on edge.

My preference tends towards pointy as well because the round/flat ones designed to keep CruiserBoys in a lounging position won't hold a line.

 

[Shawn K]

Quite simply the flat six boxer motor does not get real hot

Gotta push back a little here.

The GL engine operates at the same thermostat settings as the ST. The engine gets plenty hot, and when all that extra metal gets up to temperature it's quite hot indeed.

My observation and deduction is that the perceived heat of the GL is MUCH lower than the ST (I would describe it as "slightly over ambient"), primarily because on the GL the cooling air comes in through the front, pushed through two side-mounted radiators and heated up, and immediately exits the motorcycle.

On the ST, the air comes in, goes through the radiator, gets heated up, and then shoved through the engine bay and a bunch of obstructions before exiting. So all that heat gets shoved into the bike before it gets removed.

Side-mounted radiators make it that much easier for the GL's body panels to insulate you from the rest of the perceived heat.

I've ridden many motorcycles over many years, and the GL1800 has, by far, better heat management than any other motorcycle I've ever ridden.

 

[red one]

All very interesting. Yes I know test ride. Kind of hard with that weird white stuff outside. Let’s throw another variable into this thread. Instead of the RT. What about the K1600 GTL or K1600 B Gran American? And local dealer coming. Perfect location. Midpoint on my way home from work.

See my thread about bye bye BMW K bikes.